Question:

Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a  bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters. What do you experts think?

Here’s what one expert (Dan Empfield) thinks: This is the all-important question because the aero bar (triathlon bar) is not just an accessory one attaches to one’s bike; the aero bar actually turns the bike into a sort of front recumbent in which the rider attaches and weights himself to the bike using different parts of his body. It is an entirely new riding position that requires a rethinking of how the frame should be designed to take maximum advantage of the aero position. So the explanation below will describe the benefits of this position, the advantages to it, things to watch out for, and at the end you’ll understand why tri bikes are made the way they are. Basically, realize that there’s a significant shift in weight that the front-end must acccommodate. For some people this issue must be addressed, for others it’s merely an interesting difference in riding. The key words above are "maximum advantage." Maximum advantage is not for everyone. See the full article for more: http://www.slowtwitch.com/mainheadings/techctr/bikefit.html –stv FWIW, Dan Empfield hangs out here, runs the slowtwitch site, and used to run Quintana Roo bicylces. Before you buy.

Response:

I use a road bike. Profile Designs makes a seat post called the Front Forward that sort of does what you want. It only costs about $60 and works great for me. I too, was too stretched out, and this made all the difference in the world. And if your seat is uncomfortable – try a Serfas Dual-Density Pro saddle. (Of course everyone has their favorite saddle…) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – faux pas Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Response:

Generally no problem. But consider 2 points: If you want to ride a road-bike frame (relaxed seat-angle) you have two choices: I: Getting the mentioned "forward" post for your existing (or regular roady-sized) frame to accommodate the shorter distance between saddle and handle/aerobars NEGS: This can compromise weight distribution and handling of the bike to a greater extent and a lot of people don’t like it because it can be flat out dangerous (strong braking during a switchback-descent—–horror !) POS: If you only want to try out triathlon or plan to compete once ore twice a year you will be fine. You can easily convert the bike back to a road-bike your roady-friends can accept. II: Getting a smaller frame with a top-tube length around the length of your torso and with a short head-tube) : NEGS: Results in a little "nervous" handling of the bike due to the shorter wheelbase (might be positive for criterium-style courses) and requires some hip-flexibility due to the steeper hip-angle. Additionally you will get a ear-full from your roady-friends about correct frame-sizing. POS: Does not compromise weight distribution that much and you can still retrofit this bike to a somewhat decent road geometry with a longer and upwards angled stem even if you mostly ride with a aero-setup. MOST IMPORTANT: Get practical advice from somebody who knows how to proper set up a (moderate) aeroposition (experienced athlete, coach, bike-shop that caters Triathletes) trInIc

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – faux pas Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Response:

Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Response:

I’m not aware of it being unorthodox of putting aero bars on a road bike.  One problem you may have is that your "cockpit" is too large thus extending your arms too far out infront of you.  Also, you probably wont be able to get into a very good aerodynamic position because of this.  That’s why Profile makes the fastforward seat tube(other companies make it too, but profile’s is cheapest) which moves the rider further up onto your aerobars.  Also, the seat tube changes the seat tube angle slightly, I think. –jeremy b

Response:

In Europe, especially in France, most bikes used in triathlon are typical road bikes with aero bars. Regarding the seat tube angle and running after the bike, it is a matter of biomechanics. Some specialists agree with the 78 angle (Triathlon), others do not, as usually. I know very strong runners that are using a 73d angle and are running very fast. The same applies for steeper angles use. The approach seems to be a bit less radical with more and more seat tube angles from 74 to 77-78. Anyway, we also use pure Triathlon bikes with the aero bars setup (most often because of the drafted events – and it is easier to dismount the aero bars for such events – even if drafting sucks by the way). So, up to you. Olivier Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Before you buy.

Response:

faux pas

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Response:

Andrea, I ride a road bike with aero bars.  When I first set it up with the original seat post, I was way too stretched out and also lacked any efficiency in pedaling.  Lucky for me the local bike shop guru gave me a titanium seat post that was used but that could be turned around and then I slid the seat forward and voila (thought we should continue with the French here) it was great.  Control Tech makes an aluminum post that is just like the ti one I have. So, It is not a faux pas, but you need to experiment a bit to get it right.  From what I have read, by doing this retro fit you put too much weight on the front wheel, which can make handling dicey. I have been riding since the early 80’s so it didn’t take too long to adapt. Good luck–I hope this helps Mike Scott faux pas Is it a foupa (SP?) to add aero bars to a regular road bike?  I’ve heard a bit about the seat angle thing, but don’t really understand what that means or if it matters.  What do you experts think? Andrea

Before you buy.

Response:

I have a set of clip on aero bars that I’ve used for over 5 years and they work great. There is the prostate thing though, so you want to make sure that you adjust the angle of your saddle to take this into account. When I first started using these I noticed right off a little numbness and that was before this problem started getting attention. They do make a big difference, gave me a much better aero postion but I can never stay down that low for a long period of time… Mike Before you buy.

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Question:

Is anyone else having problems with the Results search on the Bolder Boulder site. I was able to access the top 2000 men and women and elite earlier today but now I get an error when trying to search. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

Response:

They are getting hit very hard so there may be some delays in gettuing a connection.  They also appear to be having troubles getting the results on line.  They keep changing the time the searchable results should be available back by two hours.  Last year they took two to three weeks to get the results on line os at least they are making an effort to improve. Tom

: Is anyone else having problems with the Results search on the Bolder : Boulder site. : I was able to access the top 2000 men and women and elite earlier : today but now I get an error when trying to search. : Ken : Ken Parker : Runner’s Web : A running & triathlon resource site. : http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

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Question:

Just had a question for everyone.  Since piercing guns are a big no-no here, when I did an additional lobe pierce 8 weeks ago, I had it done the "acceptable" way. Where all my gunned ones healed in 4-6 weeks, this one is still oozing and producing crusties 8 weeks later.  Could this be a factor because the cbr in there turns more often than a gun stud would have or what?  Would it possibly be better for healing to replace it with a stud?

Well, my friend got her ear pierced with a needle and used a CBR and she also managed to get it infeceted. How? She had a nasty habit of playing with the ring with dirty fingers (she was a bank teller). In your case, I would ask how well you are cleaning your ear. CBRs are easier to clean than studs, but they are also easier to get dirty if you aren’t careful. Are you carefully cleaning after swimming? (<muahaha, I recognize you from rec.sport.triathlon, you’re on my turf now ) Keeping it clean in general and *never* touching the CBR with dirty hands? Crusties after 8 weeks does seem odd, but it is a bit early to give up. In my very non-professional opinion, I doubt a stud would help. You need to figure out what you are doing to your ear and change that. Wendy —          "Life is pain, Highness.  Anyone who says differently              is selling something." — The Princess Bride          

Question:

I still say that it is Laroupe that is doing the running.  It is her legs and her speed.  Even if you and I had a pacer in the marathon, we could not do the time that she did.  I don’t see any difference in this and what Runner’s World and others do at large marathons with pacing teams.  And where are the men in this argument?  Men use the pacers too, but I rarely here any bickering over them.  And I am a man, so I can imagine that this would upset women even more. Tegla is an INCREDIBLE athlete, with a great deal of talent and should be respected, not questioned every time she breaks a record.  

the complaint about pacing is that women are being paced by men. if they’re paced by other women, nobody minds (except in this horrible example). men pacing men is no problem. now, if you got a cyclist to pace the men, it might be different.

Response:

In the NYC Marathon there were pacesetters for the men.  The fact that they were not doing their job (couldn’t keep up!) is irrelevant to me.  I don’t like any kind of pace setting, but I think that until and unless they are banned for men too, I am tired of the arguments about Tegla. The same for all, I say. Lenore Beaky

Response:

These are posted from pevious track and field news postings, so a larger picture can be seen. Word is that Tegla Loroupe set new 1 hour world record of 18,340 meters at Borgholzhausen, GER on Saturday. Anybody know of intermediate splits, particularly if Loroupe bettered Cruciata’s "unofficial" 15,000 world best of 49:44 en route?? The Monday edition of the highly-respected German daily, the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, carried a report of Tegla Loroupe’s world record in the one-hour run, which occurred this past weekend in the German town of Borgholzhausen. The report, presumably filed on-site by Ulrich Hoernemann, contained some interesting details of the race.  Loroupe was paced by Susan Chepkemei, who ran a brisk tempo for the first seven laps.  Then, Chepkemei started almost running in place while Loroupe took off. When Loroupe had caught up to the position where Chepkemei was vamping–essentially lapping her-the refreshed Chepkemei took off again with the pacemaking.   This happened several times (the exact number not specified in the report) during the first 30 laps (12 km), after which Loroupe continued onward solo to her 18340m record. Any clues as to whether this kind of tempo-making is legal?   Hello, That’s exactly what happened at the ‘87 Pan Am Games with Doug Padilla and Terry Brahm, I think Padilla paced Brahm after being  lapped so that Brahm would make standard for the World Champs. Brahm and Padilla were both DQ’d. Stan Alto The Monday edition of the highly-respected German daily, the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, carried a report of Tegla Loroupe’s world record in the one-hour run, which occurred this past weekend in the German town of Borgholzhausen. The report, presumably filed on-site by Ulrich Hoernemann, contained some interesting details of the race.  Loroupe was paced by Susan Chepkemei, who ran a brisk tempo for the first seven laps.  Then, Chepkemei started almost running in place while Loroupe took off. When Loroupe had caught up to the position where Chepkemei was vamping–essentially lapping her-the refreshed Chepkemei took off again with the pacemaking.   This happened several times (the exact number not specified in the report) during the first 30 laps (12 km), after which Loroupe continued onward solo to her 18340m record. Any clues as to whether this kind of tempo-making is legal?   I could not find the right rule at the moment, but I think, that this is forbidden since the 1998 version of the rulebook. Ciao,Dirk | Hessischer Leichtathletik-Verband | Schreyerstrasse 5      | | Webmaster             Dirk Wagner | 60596 Frankfurt        | |          | Tel   +49 69 63199131  | | Ergebnisdienst DM & DJM Berlin    | FAX   +49 69 63199132  | | http://www.hlv.de/DM98            |                        | IAAF rule 143.2 states: "…no competitor shall give or receive assistance during the progress of an event. Assistance is the conveying, by any means, of advice, information, or direct help and includes pacing in races by persons not participating in the race, by runners or walkers lapped or about to be lapped or by any kind of technical advice." Walt Murphy  The report, presumably filed on-site by Ulrich Hoernemann, contained some interesting details of the race.  Loroupe was paced by Susan Chepkemei, who ran a brisk tempo for the first seven laps.  Then, Chepkemei started almost running in place while Loroupe took off. When Loroupe had caught up to the position where Chepkemei was vamping–essentially lapping her–the refreshed Chepkemei took off again with the pacemaking.    This happened several times (the exact number not specified in the report) during the first 30 laps (12 km), after which Loroupe continued onward solo to her 18340m record.  Any clues as to whether this kind of tempo-making is legal? From "Rules and Regulations" on the IAAF website: "Rule 143 – Assistance to Athletes Giving Assistance 2. Except as provided in this Rule and in Rules 165, 167 and 191, no competitor shall give or receive assistance during the progress of an event. Assistance is the conveying, by any means, of advice, information or direct help and includes pacing in races by persons not participating in the race, by runners or walkers lapped or about to be lapped or by any kind of technical device." Remember Khalid Skah was initially disqualified in Barcelona 1992 (10 000 meter). The reason: A lapped runner (H.Boutayeb) seemingly tried to "assist" him in his fight against a Kenyan runner. Lucky enough, the jury later found that Khalid was not to blame and gave him the gold medal he deserved. As a matter of fact, Boutayeb’s behaviour was probably only disturbing both runners. But the rule should be clear enough. John R

Question:

Water temp. is about 70 degrees right now. We have been swimming in the lake for the last 2 weeks. A wetsuit will help but not a must have item to get throught the swim. Only 1000 yard swim. The triathlon is full. It will be a great weekend race. Alan

Response:

Anyone know what the water temp is for this race?  Or what the weather reports are predicting? — Tri Your Hardest!   /O     ___o      o  ~~~~   _ <,_    <|        (*)/ (*)      / Darrin Bartlett

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Question:

I NEED HELP! I just got a new tri bike and have a question on seat position. On my old road bike I had the standard setup of the boney part on my knee directly over the spindle of the pedals. On the tri bike with the steeper steat tube it seems to throw this boney part more to the front of the spindle. Most of my training is geared towards 1/2 to full Ironman distances. Any comments on wear I shoould try to position my knees to make it the easiest on them? Thanks for the help, Mike

Response:

A forward position tri bike follows different rules. But the knee-over-the-pedal-spindle theory is a coincidence of other fitting process, at least in my opinion. My ratio of femur to tibia is 1.14, which is about 3% higher than the average man. Supposedly, this allows me to put my saddle farther back at least when following road-bike rules. Even when I do, my knees are a little in front of the pedal spindle. Most people my size complain about have far back I’ve placed my saddle when they ride my bike. On my triathlon bike (which uses the forward position), my knees are substantially forward of the pedals. But the relationship between my feet, butt, and hands is the same as on my road bikes, only tilted forward about the crank spindle by 5 degrees. For an excellent and detailed article on the myths of the knee-over-the-pedal-spindle rule, and on fitment in general, look at Rivendell’s web page: http://www.veloworks.com/rivendell/kops.html Note that the article complains about steep seat tubes only because of the resulting weight on the arms. If the rider is resting in the aerobars, this is not a problems. The steep arrangement was designed for riders using their aerobars. I NEED HELP! I just got a new tri bike and have a question on seat position. On my old road bike I had the standard setup of the boney part on my knee directly over the spindle of the pedals. On the tri bike with the steeper steat tube it seems to throw this boney part more to the front of the spindle. Most of my training is geared towards 1/2 to full Ironman distances. Any comments on wear I shoould try to position my knees to make it the easiest on them? Thanks for the help, Mike

Rick Denney Take what you want and leave the rest.

Response:

Question:

: At last … all of (well, most of) the information-seeking forms are in the mail for the : development of my current project, The 1997 Triathlon Sourcebook. : Forms went out to hundreds and hundreds of industry-types

Question:

I am still looking for any triathlon in the rochester area of NY. If anyone knows of a race there, could you please let me know of it.  Thanks!    I really appreciate it thanks Stephen

Response:

There are two area Tri’s. June 24th is Rochester’s Harborfront Triathlon (1K,25K,5K about) and on August 18th is the Hamlin Beach Triathlon (1.5K,40K,10K). Call The RATs (Rochester Area TriathleteS) Hotline 716-723-5119 for more details.

Response:

Does anyone know of a triathlon in the Rochester area.  I thought that there used to be a triathlon in the Rochester NY area but I can not find any info about it.  If anyone knows of a tri in the area of Rochester, Please let me know. thanks!!! Stephen Judice

Response:

Does anyone know of a triathlon in the Rochester area.  I thought that there used to be a triathlon in the Rochester NY area but I can not find any info about it.  If anyone knows of a tri in the area of Rochester, Please let me know. thanks!!! Stephen Judice

Stephen, There are four races in the Rochester Area planned for this season. -The Down & Dirty (Mt. Bike Triathlon) is THIS Sunday at 10AM at Casey  Park in Ontario, New York.  1/4 mileS, 8 mile MTB, 5K R.  For more info  call Terbo Tri Sports at 315-524-4130 -The Harborfest Triathlon (Sprint) on July 23rd.  For more info, see the   Rochester Area Triathletes Home Page at http://www2.rpa.net/~rats -The Union Springs Triathlon (Intl. dist.) on (I think) July 13th in   Union Springs, on Cayuga Lake.  Also check RATS homepage. -The Hamlin Beach Triathlon (Intl. dist) Hosted by Rochester Area Tri-   athletes in late August. Applications available soon on RATs homepage. For training and workout information, call the RATS Hotline at 716-723-5119. Feel free to email me if I can be of assistance. Augie Calabrese

Response:

You might want to contact RATS. or Rochester Area TriathleteS. apologize in advance to mike if I gave out his address without his permission. Later… TriDork

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Question:

Is there a review of Heart Rate Monitors that can be worn while running? I’ve checked the FAQ, but found nothing.  I’ve seen a couple of Casio watches with the HRM feature, but I’m not sure if they are any good. Anyone have a recommendation?  Are they worthwhile? Or is it just as quick to stop running long enough (10-15sec) to do a manual pulse check? — Ron Daubenspeck                   | I speak only for myself, not BNR. Raleigh, NC                       |

Response:

: Is there a review of Heart Rate Monitors that can be worn while running? : I’ve checked the FAQ, but found nothing.  I’ve seen a couple of Casio : watches with the HRM feature, but I’m not sure if they are any good. : Anyone have a recommendation?  Are they worthwhile? Or is it just as quick : to stop running long enough (10-15sec) to do a manual pulse check? : — : Ron Daubenspeck                   | I speak only for myself, not BNR. : Raleigh, NC                       | Check out the Polar monitors, IMHO the best made.   I use the Accurex II, has plenty of nice features and cost about $180.  Not cheap, but worth it. brad —                                                               __o      o Brad Poland, ISU Ames, IA.                     ____/o__   _ |/<_     < Some people eat to train, I train to eat!

Response:

Is there a review of Heart Rate Monitors that can be worn while running? I’ve checked the FAQ, but found nothing.  I’ve seen a couple of Casio watches with the HRM feature, but I’m not sure if they are any good. Anyone have a recommendation?  Are they worthwhile? Or is it just as quick to stop running long enough (10-15sec) to do a manual pulse check?

Contact Creative Health Products 800-742-4478, a mail-order shop out of Michigan, and ask them for their HRM Buyer’s Guide. It’s worthwile to read over the features of the various HRMs so you can understand what they offer and decide what you’ll think you need. Other mail-order shops to consider: Colorado Cyclist (Colorado Springs, CO) Triathlete Zombies (San Diego) Performance Bike Shop (North Carolina) Call 800 info (1-800-555-1212) for numbers. Manual pulse checks are not the same. — Tom Carminati U S WEST Technologies

Response:

I agree that POLAR is the best. They set the standard for the industry and continue to innovate.  All POLAR’s units are made with the same technology and quality and use the same high quality wireless transmitter strap.  The only difference between units is in the features offered.  They start at $90 and go up from there.  Currently you can get a good deal on the ACCUREX II on a closeout as they are a discontinued model.  It offers a full featured runners watch, and the fully featured high end HRM all in one nice package. I sell POLAR units at discount, and will beat any legitimate price on POLAR units.  I wrote an article on Heart Rate Training for runners which describes what HRM training is and why it is useful.  It’s a quick short guide.  I can also send you a flyer on teh various POLAR models with the features and prices etc.. if you’re interested. Happy Running! Tom Kulhawik HI-TEK Racing "State of the Art Running & Fitness Equipment" Stratford, CT  USA

Response:

Is there a review of Heart Rate Monitors that can be worn while running? I’ve checked the FAQ, but found nothing.  I’ve seen a couple of Casio watches with the HRM feature, but I’m not sure if they are any good. Anyone have a recommendation?  Are they worthwhile? Or is it just as quick to stop running long enough (10-15sec) to do a manual pulse check?

I recently bought a not-so expensive Polar- the Polar Pacer for $158.00.  I like it much.  I had originally intended to get the Polar work.  The store had another Favor, which they couldn’t get to work, so I upgraded to the Pacer, which has been very reliable.  It has a settable target range heart rate, so if you exceed or go below your target region, it beeps at you.  All Polars are water resistant to 20 meters. I cannot recommend watches with hrm features- I believe them to be unreliable.  The reason is the following:  there are two established ways to get a heart rate.  One uses the electrical signal from the heart and one uses light (the pulse changes the amount of light that can pass and this is detected).  The light method, which some watches probably use, is very unreliable if you are moving and if ambient light conditions are changing.  If the watch uses the eletric pulse method, I believe this is probably not reliable for two reasons:  you wear the watch quite far from the heart (weak signal) and the surface area covered by the watch band is quite small.  I believe the Polars are so robust because the electrodes have a large surface area and because the band sits very close to the heart.   Taking pulse manually when running is not reliable- according to Sally Edwards’ book "The Heart Rate Monitor Book", approximately 60% of the people in an aerobics class could not accurately find their heart rate during a brief pause in their workout.  The reason is twofold: 1) it’s difficult to do while you are breathing rapidly and sweaty and tired! and 2) during the pause, your hr changes.  The change is due to recovery from the workout during rest.  If the rate is measured by feeling at the throat (carotid?), the pressure on the artery can cause a rapid lowering of heart rate.  I’ve measured this myself with the monitor.   A final caveat- take with a grain of salt the maximum heart rate determined from age.  I’m 28, so by this method my max is 192.  From experience, I know that 192 is in my aerobic range- hell, lightly warming up gets me into the 170’s and I’m in reasonably good shape!  I estimate my actual max to be about 225.  The only way to tell is to do an intense workout that bring you very close to the max (procede with caution here!). -J

Response:

Regarding recent queries about the best HRM:- The Polar HRM range possibly has the edge on its competitors if price is of no concern. However, if you are working to a limited budget then pound for pound (:dollar for dollar:) I think the CardioSport range by HealthCare Technologies Ltd, UK takes a lot of beating. I feel that the biggest advantages of the CardioSport monitors are : 1. More features than an equivalently priced Polar model. 2. The batteries can be changed by the user, unlike Polar where the unit has to be sent back to the supplier which is inconvenient and costly. Its main disadvantage is that the transmitter is a little bit more bulky than the Polar. I’ve recently been testing the Polar Accurex II and a CardioSport Heartsafe – the bottom of the CardioSport range (thanks to everyone on this newsgroup who recommended it). I marginally preferred the features on the Accurex, but the HeartSafe was about half the (UK) price. For the same price as the Accurex, I can get plenty more bells and whistles from CardioSport. (:Of course this price argument may be irrelevant across the pond, because leisure and electronic equipment is dirt cheap in the USA compared to the UK:) Linacre College, Oxford

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…  I believe the Polars are so robust because the electrodes have a large surface area and because the band sits very close to the heart.  

Since the topic’s come up… Some months back I bought a Polar Edge for my 70-year old father to use in his recovery from bypass surgery. (He has always tended to push himself too hard in training…) Although I was impressed with this HRM, it did not register any heartrate for my dad, so I returned it. The Polar rep thought that the electrical signals from the heart might be weaker for some time following an operation, but some people in the cardiology group disagreed with this opinion. Anyway, my question is, has anyone else had the experience of a HRM not registering a heartrate, i.e., a zero reading, and also, are there brands other than Polar that might be worth a trial? Thanks for any advice, Mark Sandrock — Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign   "Seid _einfach_ in dem Denken und Chemical Sciences Computing Services     dem Tun; denn in der Einfachheit 505 S. Mathews Ave., Urbana, IL 61801    liegt Groesse und auch Staerke!"

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Question:

Is there anybody out there knowing of some good computer programmes for planing training, and diets. Please let me know where to find it. Thanx! Yours Steinar. | Please feel free to mail me your opinion, I may not agree but anyway…. |

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Is there anybody out there knowing of some good computer programmes for planing training, and diets. Please let me know where to find it.

There is a windows/mac version of PC Coach which schedules your training with coaches input… so far for marathons– and 10 k Arturo Barrios and uta pippig marathon training they are working on biking, running and triathlon for this year… Biometrics PC Coach 800-52 COACH They are in Colorado kathy — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<K.S. Gorenz Illinois Valley Community College 815 N. Orlando Smith Rd. Oglesby, IL 61348-9691

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