Question:

This seems like a very short swim workout. If this all the time you have for swimming, then (1) make sure you practice the specific swimming skills needed for the next race, and (2) get into the weight room to improve arm strength. Efficient management of the water and the race’s peculiar environment + strength = you go faster. John Bickmore www.bicyclecam.com www.feed-zone.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

Hard to say without seeing you swim. Try transitioning a few of those 25s to 50s gradually. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks Tom. What is the sensible way to build, 50 yard a week? more ? jojo First of all, congrats on getting out there and working out. If you can get comfortable doing that workout, and build it to just over 1000 yards, I’d say find a good masters group and get your workouts from a coach. While it’s important to build strength, technique is about 80-90% of swimming, and you’ll learn that best from a coach. Tom my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

Get the book and video from Total Immersion. The book has a bunch of workouts in it.  Pull buoys keep your legs afloat and teach your body what it feels like to have a good body position (horizontal). – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source?

Response:

My suggestion would also be get a coach (masters or tri squad). But for the reason of stroke correction. Judging by your yardage swimming is reasonably new to you. You mention sore shoulders, this may be you having a good workout or the result of a poor stroke (arms not bent at a big enough angle) in the PULL part of your freestyle. Some of the biggest increases in your swimming will come from merely becoming more efficient, & this can more often than not only be achieved through a correct stroke. Now is also a time you will pick up bad habits. One big one with triathletes is "I don’t kick when I swim to save my legs for the bike"…hehehehe. Get a coach, you only need swim a squad once or twice a week & he’ll give you enough advice to keep you on track to being a more efficient swimming. As for increases in yardage. A general rule of thumb is increase at a rate of no greater than 10%(*approx) with every 4th week a recovery week(eg: swim week one yardage). Another important factor in training is recovery. Overtraining will be a major factor in any injuries somewhere down the track. You also say you will start open water traing come march, try adding some water polo style swimming (head up forward above water) this is a fairly standard freestyle drill & great for the upper body but also very necessary for open water & something many people forget to train prior to racing. Hell, I could talk all day about swimming but I’ll spare ya…hehehehe http://www.sportsid.com/sid2000/default.htm is a good site with free video instruction Hope this helps —  Lee Vickary (Namsul Melek)  www.club-triathlon.com  Triathlon Stuff       __o     -<,  ( ) / ( )

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

First of all, congrats on getting out there and working out. If you can get comfortable doing that workout, and build it to just over 1000 yards, I’d say find a good masters group and get your workouts from a coach. While it’s important to build strength, technique is about 80-90% of swimming, and you’ll learn that best from a coach. Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

Thanks Tom. What is the sensible way to build, 50 yard a week? more ? jojo

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – First of all, congrats on getting out there and working out. If you can get comfortable doing that workout, and build it to just over 1000 yards, I’d say find a good masters group and get your workouts from a coach. While it’s important to build strength, technique is about 80-90% of swimming, and you’ll learn that best from a coach. Tom my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

my warm up is: 100 swim real easy 50 kick easy 50 swim easy The workout is: 8 25’s w/ 10 seconds rest between 100 swim down real easy.  Total 500 yards What is the best way to increase? This was my first workout in several months and it was challenging, but doable. My shoulders are a bit sore today. I have done one sprint triathlon, but I would like to train smarter for the spring. I will be swimming twice a week. How often and how much should I increase my yardage? What should I shoot for?  My goal is to be able to swim 1/2 mile very comfortably when this springs triathlons start. I will increase my workouts to 3 per week in late January. I will start training in open water in march, but am training in a 25 yard pool for now. Also, I am using the workouts as shown on the www.trinewbies.com website. These workouts look good, but don’t use any pull buoys, and I have heard that pull buoys are important to the triathlete (don’t know why). Should I alter the workouts shown, or does someone have a better source? I am hoping to get the Triathletes Training Bible for Christmas, and hope to learn a lot there. Thanks for any help, jojo

Response:

Question:

I think Larry has offered the best advice thus far. I too almost always see at least one or two people at a tri with a surfing type wetsuit and don’t recall any fatalities. If it’s his first tri – he’s probably not concerned about losing the podium to a slow swim time anyway, and if he’s determined to get a bargain or that’s all he can afford – it will probably keep him warm at least. I did my first tri in a Billabong surfing shorty and while it ballooned up on me like a sea anchor, I didn’t really know the difference until later on when I got a triathlon specific wetsuit. 4 years later that Quintana Roo longjohn still works just fine, but I have no idea what happened to that Billabong suit.  In a last ditch – why not check out the classified ads on inside tri or triathlete mag, or better yet, check out tribuy.com to see if there are any used wetsuit deals more suited to his price tag and sport. Mike

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There always a few Body Glove wetsuits at triathlons and AFAIK they haven’t caused anyone to drown.  If all he has is $44 then a BG wetsuit beats hypothermia.  If the water is warm he’s better off without it it will probably slow him down.  If he intends to use a wetsuit regularly in triathlons he should spend the extra bucks and get the right equipment. Larry I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

Response:

I had one for my first three seasons. They are very heavy, bulky, and water-absorbent. I got through the beginning with it, but, now having a QR LongJohn, I would say his $44.00 would be better spent towards a real triathlon-designed wetsuit. The major triathlon stores have them on closeout regularly, and you can get good prices! I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

– Bernie Hall                                            o                         __o          </_                         <        __ /       /o__      (0)  (0)           /

Response:

Tell him to look into Promotion suits.  They usually have last years suits at this time of the year marked down to some really good prices.  I bought mine at 50% off for 100 bucks.  It is a really nice suit and fits perfectly. Richard "IronCop wannabe" in El Paso – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

Response:

I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

Response:

You might not convince him with the "drowning" argument (he will definitely not: surf-suits even have more rubber than swim-suits) But just remind him how it will be when he chafes up his neck and armpits and then has to swim a couple of yards in salt-water or spend a sweaty hour on the bike and another couple of minutes running with sweat rinsing his rashes… really painful ! trInIc – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

Response:

I’d imagine getting off will be harder as it won’t be as flexible as a TOTL Tri suit. Phil

| You might not convince him with the "drowning" argument (he will definitely | not: surf-suits even have more rubber than swim-suits) | But just remind him how it will be when he chafes up his neck and armpits | and then has to swim a couple of yards in salt-water or spend a sweaty hour | on the bike and another couple of minutes running with sweat rinsing his | rashes… | | really painful ! | | trInIc | | I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a | Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very | appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri | wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! | | Thanks | | |

Response:

You might not convince him with the "drowning" argument (he will definitely not: surf-suits even have more rubber than swim-suits)

But it’s thinner. I have two surfing/diving suits, one full length and one BG shorty – I sink with them layered one over the other, but my tri wesuit (a Performance shorty) will float me.  Tri wetsuits are made thicker in key areas to provide floatation.

Response:

There always a few Body Glove wetsuits at triathlons and AFAIK they haven’t caused anyone to drown.  If all he has is $44 then a BG wetsuit beats hypothermia.  If the water is warm he’s better off without it it will probably slow him down.  If he intends to use a wetsuit regularly in triathlons he should spend the extra bucks and get the right equipment. Larry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend is new to tri. I’m trying to convince him not to buy a Body glove Surfing wetsuit for his first ocean swim.  The price is very appealing to him ($44).  Does BG have the same properties as a tri wetsuit?  I don’t think so.  HELP!!!  He might drown! Thanks

Response:

Question:

Running the Trans America Footrace : Trials and Triumphs of Life on the Road by Barry Lewis http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0811725820/qid=943891370/sr=1- 10/002-4097058-0568208 Ten Million Steps : The Incredible Journey of Paul Reese, Who Ran Across America-A Marathon a Day for 124 Days-At Age 73 by Paul Reese, Joe Henderson http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1567960146/qid=943891370/sr=1- 44/002-4097058-0568208 Before you buy.

Response:

rent a copy of Forrest Gump – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m thinking about doing a run across the US as a fund-raiser for research on a rare form of cancer.  I would appreciate any information that might be helpful in organizing this project, especially as regards routing, support network, and actual fundraising procedure, also any references to published accounts of runs of this kind.

-H.Ong- Track 200-:26, 400-:58, 4×400, 4×100, 800-2:18, 1600-5:23, 3200-12:38 XCountry-18:48 Basketballer Mountain/Road Biker Marathoner Triathlete (except I can’t swim!) Paintballer MiniMag#11115 MOG#441 AO#58

Response:

Sounds interesting, Peter!  Keep us updated about your plans! Mary

Response:

see the book "4 million footsteps"

Response:

In the running booms of the 1880s and 1920s, such cross country races were xtreme sport publicity stunts. Runner’s World has written about them and I believe there was a book about one of the 1880s races a few years back. During the current running boom sicne 1968, many people also have run across the country.  I am not sure what the record is, but I’ve heard of people taking about two months at about 50 miles a day. They often have a spouse or friend drive along for support. Massages are important. Before you buy.

Response:

I’m thinking about doing a run across the US as a fund-raiser for research on a rare form of cancer.  I would appreciate any information that might be helpful in organizing this project, especially as regards routing, support network, and actual fundraising procedure, also any references to published accounts of runs of this kind.

Response:

Question:

Hi folks I’m looking at buying a wetsuit, and I’ve been struck by how expensive wetsuits seem to be. A wetsuit designed specifically for triathlon costs between 150 and 300 UK pounds. A kayaking or surfing wetsuit costs between 40 and 60 (for a sleeveless). Can anyone tell me a) why the price difference is so huge and b) what the comparative performance, comfort etc. gains are between a tri-specific suit and, say, a double lined 3mm kayaking longjohn. Cheers Rob Knell Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I’m repeatibly 10% faster with my wetsuit on. Slow swimmers tend to have bad position in the water (I know I do). A wetsuit takes you in to a more hydrodynamic position. The fast swimmers already tend to have such a position, so they don’t benefit as much. Joel — Joel Sylvester Longest Day ‘98 12:10:33 Edinburgh Triathletes: www.edintri.u-net.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I just got a new wetsuit. I was amazed at how much faster I went. I’ve been practicing the TI swim and thought I was doing pretty good. However, I knocked 10 seconds off my 50yd sprint with the suit. Have others noticed this much improvement? Or is this unique to me because I’m not real fast (16 min .5 mile)? Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves? Thanks! David "why all the funny looks when I wore the suit in the pool?" Wuth FEY2K (remove spaces) at att dot net

Response:

I just got a new wetsuit. I was amazed at how much faster I went. I’ve been practicing the TI swim and thought I was doing pretty good. However, I knocked 10 seconds off my 50yd sprint with the suit. Have others noticed this much improvement? Or is this unique to me because I’m not real fast (16 min .5 mile)? Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves? Thanks! David "why all the funny looks when I wore the suit in the pool?" Wuth FEY2K (remove spaces) at att dot net

Response:

Dave, I know what you mean. I knocked 5 minutes off my 1000M time of 25 minutes … 20 percent … not bad. I thought I was gonna knock myself out at the end of my first lap in the pool, I hit the end so hard … Geoff *GWN Tri – July 4th* Nash – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have others noticed this much improvement?

Response:

I just got a new wetsuit. I was amazed at how much faster I went. I’ve been practicing the TI swim and thought I was doing pretty good. However, I knocked 10 seconds off my 50yd sprint with the suit. Have others noticed this much improvement? Or is this unique to me because I’m not real fast (16 min .5 mile)? Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves? Thanks! David "why all the funny looks when I wore the suit in the pool?" Wuth FEY2K

  One of my friends swam 400m (.25 mile) in 5.30 wetsuitless then put on his Orca and took 5 mins. The gains are greater for slower swimmers, as often buoyancy and kicking are problems and the wetsuit gets your body position higher.   I just got a new wetsuit but have still not tried it and shan’t race in it until summer (december).  It looks very flash and is much better designed than my 6 year old one (forearm grip panels, no water entry etc.) and is supposed to give a 3 minute gain over 1500m.  - David "so if I don’t come out in 18 mins I shall be most perturbed" Bowden

Response:

Enough performance gains to make the good swimmers bitch – alot. Bob

Response:

Thanks for all the input! I set a PR yesterday for a 1/2 mile swim, using the wetsuit — 15:13. My previous PR was 15:58, but this year I have been doing only 17:30-18:00 for the 1/2 mile. I was hoping for a time around 17. My eyes almost popped out when I hit the lap split exiting the water… Of course, the fast swimmers (sans wetsuits) came out in around 9 minutes… David / FEY2K (remove spaces) at att dot net

Response:

Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves?

I don’t know about speed but warnth there is a huge difference.  I live up in Seattle and 4 of us did our first open water swim in Lake Washington yesterday. 1 in full suit with a hood and 3 of us in sleevless with 1 guy having a hood. It was damn cold without the sleeves, I could hardly breathe is was so cold they tell me it’s about as cold as Alcatraz.  If I ever do that race I will definitely buy the full suit, hood and maybe booties.  My friend with the full suit says that it is a little harder to swim because of the resistance it creates in the shoulders but I think the added  warmth would be worth it.  I think the other 2 guys would agree as I think they ar both going to buy a new full suit before we try that again.  The water was around 60 degrees for those of you who have never been in, thats damn cold at 7am.  So go for the full and stay warm and take off a few more seconds.  Good luck Marc " I hope the Dr. lets me run again soon" Hallen

Response:

Hey David, I have worked for a leading triathlon wetsuit manufacturer in the past and thought my comments could help out. Speed is certainly an advantage you will gain by using a wetsuit primarily because of the "buoyancy" involved with the "materials" used by wetsuit companies today. Another factor influencing wetsuit speed is whether or not the wetsuit has a "slippery coating" on the outside of the suit. In most cases "silicon" is used which has the desirable effect of reducing the drag coefficient that your profile presents to the water as you move through it. The "materials" utilised also affect your speed in various ways. The "thickness" of the rubber used on different wetsuit "panels" affects your performance for different reasons, eg: you want it thick on your stomach (for more lift), but less so on your arms although not too little (still want the buoyancy of thickness but also the ease of movement of a thinner material). It is interesting to note also that there is a trade off between stretch & bouyancy (don’t generally get both in the same material) therefore wetsuit companies face a trade off when deciding which panels will go where. Then there is the "design" factor which influences many of us in our purchases. This variable in consideration of speed relates mainly to "fit" and "type of material". If your wetsuit has been correctly sized and the suit is of a good shape for your body, then it will let only a minimum of water into it while still allowing you the freedom that is necessary for ease of movement (doesn’t tire you out swimming normally). Ease of movement is quite obviously affected by how well the wetsuit stretches through your normal range of swimming movement. If it does, great stuff! If not, you can be sure at that 500m mark that damn piano will drop on you and you will start to struggle with the suit instead. So anyway, apart from all this dribble about wetsuits to get faster you just have to get fitter or more technically competent (ie through a TI class) to gain speed. Hope this gives you some more info. Haydn Woolley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just got a new wetsuit. I was amazed at how much faster I went. I’ve been practicing the TI swim and thought I was doing pretty good. However, I knocked 10 seconds off my 50yd sprint with the suit. Have others noticed this much improvement? Or is this unique to me because I’m not real fast (16 min .5 mile)? Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves? Thanks! David "why all the funny looks when I wore the suit in the pool?" Wuth FEY2K (remove spaces) at att dot net

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I just got a new wetsuit. I was amazed at how much faster I went. I’ve been practicing the TI swim and thought I was doing pretty good. However, I knocked 10 seconds off my 50yd sprint with the suit. Have others noticed this much improvement? Or is this unique to me because I’m not real fast (16 min .5 mile)?

        Not unusual since you increase your buoyancy and reduce drag (assuming proper fit).  There was a paper by Chatard and  Millet in Sports Medicine a few years back on wetsuit use by triathletes. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Also, any comments on sleeveless vs sleeves? Thanks! David "why all the funny looks when I wore the suit in the pool?" Wuth FEY2K (remove spaces) at att dot net

Response:

Question:

 Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that?

I agree with the suggestion to ask the person you wish to share a lane with first before jumping in.  In the pool I use, the etiquette for lane sharing is to simply split the lane rather than swimming on the right and having to deal with passing.  I also think it is common courtesy to ask to share a lane before jumping in.  It does piss me off to be booking along in my lane and swim headlong into some Bozo who decides to just jump in without letting me know he’s there and expecting me to get out of his way.  Common courtesy and common sense should make the situation smooth.   Marty

Response:

I would say that when swimming in a designated LANE, that circle swimming is the best way to go when there are more than 2 swimmers in the lane.  If there are only two, then splitting the lane is best to avoid problems like Marty described (passing, etc.) However, in my experience with larger open areas of the pool where there are NO lane lines, circle swimming is asking for trouble. You can usually fit 3 people in the same space of a single lane without having to make people circle swim. Whether they don’t install lane lines in this area for that reason or some other reason, I don’t know. Just a couple of cents to add to the ante…. Craig – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a question. I was swimming today and it was crowded. I swim in a public pool, where about half the pool is marked with floating lane dividers in  lanes and the other half is not.People swim in both sections. All along the entire bottom of the pool there are the black arrows you swim along. I was always taught to swim to the right of them and in a circle.   Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt think straight after that.   Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard? thanks, al marvelli Check out: http://members.aol.com/KybrSose/giantstridePage1.html

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Ditto. At my club, we also have to deal with the "walkers", you know, the type who get into a lane and walk up and down the lane, then they stand at the end of the lane, for oh, about 20 minutes, just standing there, then they walk up the lane again. I think they walk because they don’t want to get their hairdoos wet (water??? in a swimming pool???). Of course they walk straight up the middle of the lane. This gets particularly frustrating in the hour right before the Masters’ swim program. You know, you want to get in the lanes early to warm up, add some yardage and the walkers are there. Arrgh! One of these days, I’m going to get in one of those lanes and start swimming and give them a big splash with my turn at the wall. Maybe then they will get the message. [ I know, I know, not very polite, but why can't they go walk outside] Just my whine for the day. Laura – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Another lane? Another time of day?.  I have, also, ended up with the housewives  in an out of town pool, who invariably take up more of a lane than serious, considerate, competitive swimmers. If you must go at that time of day, "interview" each lane member;  find out who is at your level of ability. Sometimes introducing yourself and ‘asking’ if you may share "their" lane, makes all the difference !

Response:

I say, next time just plow right over the ol’ broad, and give her a good firm kick in the forehead just for good measure as you go by.  It’s good practice for those mass swim starts! ** Notice to those humor impaired – this is sarcasm, and is not to be taken as anything but an example of a very dark sense of humor**

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Marvelous thread ! This one is really fun ! <splash, splash kick

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| I have a question. I was swimming today and it was crowded. I swim in a public | pool, where about half the pool is marked with floating lane dividers in  lanes | and the other half is not.People swim in both sections. All along the entire | bottom of the pool there are the black arrows you swim along. I was always | taught to swim to the right of them and in a circle. |   |   Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is | kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and | she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood | up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim | in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her | kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt | think straight after that.   | |   Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing | what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see | what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What | would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard?   | I would think you should have complained to the pool management, hopefully having the ignoramus scolded or thrown out, and asked them about etiquette.                                         rich

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I had to laugh at this. I know it probably wasn’t funny at the time, but I can just picture it. Anyway, being a swimmer for 18 or so years now, I have seen places where people swim to the right, and places where people swim to the left, I guess you just have to whatch what is happening at that pool. As for those "get it your way" types, well, that is the main reason I will only train with a squad. I just can’t train with these thoughtless people who have no idea what is going on around them. No matter what, there always seems to be one person doing slow breatstroke up the centre of the lane. In fact, they often seem to wait until it looks like someone is swimming seriously, and then start in that lane. Anyway, enough of a winge, I would just try your best to find a lane with the least people and/or the peopl that look like they are actually swimming. BTW – these are probably the same people that yell at you for taking up all that space on the road riding your bike! -Paul – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a question. I was swimming today and it was crowded. I swim in a public pool, where about half the pool is marked with floating lane dividers in  lanes and the other half is not.People swim in both sections. All along the entire bottom of the pool there are the black arrows you swim along. I was always taught to swim to the right of them and in a circle.   Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt think straight after that.   Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard? thanks, al marvelli Check out: http://members.aol.com/KybrSose/giantstridePage1.html

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I don’t want to beat a dead horse, but posts (in this thread and my related Housewives/Hairdo’s line) are running about 2-to-1 against what I’ll call the "apparently clueless" swimmers.  The serious-competitive-swimmer sentiment has been expressed compellingly and, of course, in a way that made me smile, by Tri-Baby.  I just want to offer a couple more words on behalf of the apparently clueless.  My basic point is that I think we need to make sure we distinguish between the legitimate Wicked Clueless Horde — a tiny group, I think — and the huge Genuinely Doing Their Best Group.  Too often, folks in the latter category are lumped with those in the former.  I think it’s inconsistent with RST karma not to try our best to keep the groups separate. usually seeding myself properly in the Fast lane at my pool, a pool where the people in the Slow lane are pretty much going backwards.  (More about my pool — "Fast" includes people doing sprints and people swimming fast 1500s.  The Medium lane is for people doing 25 meters in 60 seconds or so, and Slow, as I said earlier, is basically for those in reverse.  This is not an easy situation for anyone.)  I taught swimming for a number of years — kids, adults, disabled people — and I worked as a lifeguard at pools that had very mixed-ability populations.  Old people, kids, competitive swimmers. Interestingly, I spend way too much time filled with rage at car drivers when I’m on my bike or running or walking around town.  For some reason (maybe because I’m actually one of the Clueless Horde . . .?) I’m a pretty serene swimmer.  I get knocked around a bit in the water, sure, but then I just smile and go on. First, I do think a lot of the problems we’re talking about would be solved if lifeguards would take more responsibility for managing lane use.  I used to do it — I was a kid and kind of got off on the power thing, probably — and I was often told by my aquatics manager how much it was appreciated by the swimmers.  Obviously, lifeguards have to pay attention to the pool and can’t spend all their time monitoring swim speed, but most lifeguards I see seem to have plenty of time available to help manage lane use.  They should do it. Second, rude and clueless people don’t deserve any quarter.  They get none from me, and I’m not suggesting that anyone else give them special etiquette passes. But, but, but . . .  What I wish some of us would consider is our quick attribution of bad motives, meanness, willful ignorance and thoughtless self-centeredness to the "apparently clueless."  Many of the disturbing behaviors Tricia and others have mentioned — definitely not all of them — have benign explanations.  New swimmers and old old people and other "apparently clueless" types can’t always swim at constant speeds the way we can.  They can’t control every frog kick or backstroke the way we can.  They suddenly swallow water and thrash.  They can only get their hair done on Mondays and only swim on Tuesdays.  They can’t wear goggles because of eye or skin problems.  They swim at a rate of 30 seconds per 25 meters but can’t use the Medium lane without running over 3 swimmers every two laps. I’m not saying these people don’t have a responsibility to stay out of the Fast lane or a responsibility not to hurt other swimmers.  But I think we can respond better to them than we do.  Tricia’s post had a road rage element to it that I recognize from incidents I’ve seen at my own pool (and, interestingly, from my own reaction to cars that turn in front of me when I’m on my bike or on foot!). Maybe we should talk more to the clueless.  People don’t think to talk at pools. (Digression:  I read an excellent short story a few years ago that explored the odd relationship you develop with people you see at the pool and in the shower but never talk to.  Anyone else remember it?)  These aren’t evil people, by and large.  They’re not necessarily the people who make right turns on red without stopping for pedestrians and runners.  Those people are wicked.  Some of these people, yeah, they need a good talking to.  But I really think most are trying as hard as they can to stay out of our way, swim compactly and at a constant speed and get some exercise.  They don’t always manage to do it right.  We can help clue them in, and think we’ll have more success if we lose the attitude that these people don’t deserve to share our space. Now I’ve spent too much time here and I *can’t* go to the pool! Have a good weekend, all.                               — Marc

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We have one fellow here who does this ugly bastardized form of backstroke wherein both arms, spread wide to encompass the world, are thrown backward in unison, while his legs trail behind executing a spastic frog kick. Ugly to watch, and even uglier to come in contact with.

A guy named Dave Costill does backstroke that way.  In 1997, he did a 2:30.3 200yd backstroke like that.  At age 61.  He probably doesn’t do it in a lane with other circle swimmers, though.  Beauty is in the eye of the beholder… Ken "look him up on the AltaVista" Lehner

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Maybe I’m the only one out here who swims in a pool where lane sharing isn’t done? …

Actually, at the pool here at UAB circle swimming is prohibited and no more than 2 people per lane are allowed. (Although they’ll let more than 2 people aquajog in the deep end of a lane, the need for that is infrequent.) Fortunately, the pool is open enough to spread the "swimming crowd" out and so it is very, very rare that someone has to wait for a spot to open up. I thought about bringing this up earlier in the thread, but don’t assume that circle swimming is allowed when you go to a new pool.   — Chuck    Department of Biology,  University of Alabama at Birmingham             http://www.uab.edu/uabbio/amsler.htm

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Maybe I’m the only one out here who swims in a pool where lane sharing isn’t done? … Actually, at the pool here at UAB circle swimming is prohibited and no more than 2 people per lane are allowed.

This always blows my mind.  But then that’s probably from the years and years of various swim teams.  4 or 5 people in a lane is pretty normal, and I’ve been sandwiched into as many as 10 or more in a lane (25 yd pool.  10 is no problem in a 50m pool) It is actually hard sometimes to not circle swim.  You become used to going into your flip turn, and coming out with a slight push off to the other side of the lane.  Usually during taper for the big end of season meet our coach would do turn drills, and force us to swim straight down the middle, flip, and come out straight again.  It would really piss him off to see you circle swimming in a meet.  (Every little bit of distance counts!) Now swimming right next to lane line to draft off the other team’s swimmer is a different story, but then we don’t want to get into a drafting argument, now do we? ; Eric

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Strangely enough I think it’s related to the side of the road that the country drives on… don’t ask me why it’s got anything to do with swimming, just a correlation I’ve noticed. Similarly walking on the footpath — people seem to share a footpath in the same way that they do their roads. I’ve noticed that visitors and/or immigrants from right-hand-drive countries continue to walk on the right-hand half of the footpath, despite the fact that they are walking into everyone else… — MB. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – they need to have their own lane(s) as they swim in the opposite direction to us (we swim on the left side of the lane down here). — MB. is this due to the coriolis effect?  i assume that swimming counterclockwise in the southern hemisphere is faster than swimming clockwise because of this… will

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 Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt think straight after that.    Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard?  

Speaking as a lifeguard, I have dealt with this before. We have the "golden oldies" as we call them, people who have been members for years if not decades (pool was built in 1947). These people have acquired a sense of ownership with the pool. I simply inform them that they are mistaken and that it is MY pool when I am working, and if they don’t obey the rules, I will ask them to leave. Since I am not the typical snot-nosed teenage lifeguard (being 34), they listen to me. As far as being whacked by the board weilding woman, if I had seen that while guarding, she would be looking for a membership elsewhere.

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The Medium lane is for people doing 25 meters in 60 seconds or so, and Slow, as I said earlier, is basically for those in reverse.

Holy cow! At your pool, *I* would be in the fast lane. That’s the scariest thing I’ve every heard! No wonder people kick each other in the face. But, but, but . . .  What I wish some of us would consider is our quick attribution of bad motives, meanness, willful ignorance and thoughtless self-centeredness to the "apparently clueless."  Many of the disturbing behaviors Tricia and others have mentioned — definitely not all of them — have benign explanations.

Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained with stupidity. Rick "Words to live by" Denney

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This may sound a bit goody goody two shoes (as they say or used to) but there is not one single swimmer, walker, elementary backstroker, or even wall-holder-upper whose purpose in the pool is even a tiny bit less important than mine.  I swim at a time restricted to the old, the invalid, the injured, etc.  Those less able than I would prefer not to be in my lane, but sometimes there is no other place.  I reassure them that it will be okay and I try to be as considerate of them as they always are of me.  If a housewife in a flowered cap wants to get out of the house and socialize at the end of the pool and walk a bit for some exercise, I think that’s a good enough reason to be there. There’s nothing about swim training for triathlon that gives my use of the pool some special significance. I limit butterfly to one-arm drills until they’re gone, but yes I do all those other terrible strokes, too – even elementary backstroke. Ruth Kazez

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She was obviously totally wrong, however if you’re outside the lane dividers, then you’re sorta asking for it — it’s a jungle out there in the un-laned world. Even in the lanes you gotta watch it, but most people sharing lanes seem to know the rules. At my local pool (SIAC – Homebush) I have the luxury of two pools. The floral-cap set use the so-called "training pool" and the main pool (we are talking the Sydney Olympics site here) is fully laned and a sign on the pool entrance says lap swimming only. The lanes are all clearly marked with the expected speed and/or stroke (eg Fast, Med, Slow, Breastroke etc) — really neat — and everyone know the rules — except… when a swim squad turns up from somewhere in Europe — they need to have their own lane(s) as they swim in the opposite direction to us (we swim on the left side of the lane down here). — MB.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have a question. I was swimming today and it was crowded. I swim in a public pool, where about half the pool is marked with floating lane dividers in  lanes and the other half is not.People swim in both sections. All along the entire bottom of the pool there are the black arrows you swim along. I was always taught to swim to the right of them and in a circle.  Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt think straight after that.  Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard? thanks, al marvelli Check out: http://members.aol.com/KybrSose/giantstridePage1.html

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Maybe I’m the only one out here who swims in a pool where lane sharing isn’t done? The small pool at our health club has two designated lap lanes, but no one EVER shares a lane. I don’t know why, other than the fact that there are few "serious" swimmers. Mike "Frankly, I’d be worried about sharing a lane with most of them" Tennent "TriBop" ‘98 Ironman Canada, 16:17:03

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All good points, Tricia. The sad thing of course, is that only fairly serious swimmers are reading this thread. Your comments and the post that started this thread ought to be posted on the wall at every swim center in the country. Sure, let’s applaud beginners, seniors  and other folks for making the attempt to get some exercise by swimming, no matter their ability level. But shame on the pool directors and life guards for not doiing their jobs and monitoring the lanes during lap swimming. Lanes should be posted. Beginners should stick to the slow lanes, and walkers should not be in lap lanes, period. Laura – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – As for those "get it your way" types, well, that is the main reason I will only train with a squad. I just can’t train with these thoughtless people who have no idea what is going on around them. No matter what, there always seems to be one person doing slow breatstroke up the centre of the lane. In fact, they often seem to wait until it looks like someone is swimming seriously, and then start in that lane. That’s the key—these people are *thoughtless*.  "Clueless" and "Oblivious" are other apt adjectives.  And they render me incredulous. How is it possible to be so self-absorbed and so devoid of common sense? How much effort does it take to assess a situation like a swim lane full of fellow swimmers and then tailor your actions to cause the least disruption possible to everyone’s experience? WARNING:  PURE WINGE AHEAD.  Read at your own peril.  Disclaimers apply. The ones who really blow my mind are the folks who plant themselves in a lane that is clearly too fast for them, then refuse to get out of the way of a faster swimmer coming up behind.  You can be right on their feet when they hit the wall, but instead of thoughtfully pulling over to the side at the wall and waiting for you to flip and go past them, they continue on their merry way, making their turn and ignoring your presence virtually on top of them.  Then, at the odd moment when they do choose to stop at the wall, they never fail to remain in the middle of the wall rather than making an effort to scrunch up as far to the side as possible to get out of the way of approaching swimmers. AAARGH. Then there are the backstroke boobs who haven’t a clue about doing backstroke correctly, nor are they aware that their wide-armed flailing poses a serious threat to the well-being of those sharing their lane (not to mention those in adjacent lanes).  Right alongside them go the breast stroke bobos who fail to see the wisdom of curtailing their kick when another swimmer passes.  Ouch! We have one fellow here who does this ugly bastardized form of backstroke wherein both arms, spread wide to encompass the world, are thrown backward in unison, while his legs trail behind executing a spastic frog kick. Ugly to watch, and even uglier to come in contact with. The stubbornly blind swimmers baffle me.  There’s one woman at the pool I frequent most often on campus who refuses to wear goggles, for whatever reason, but this means that she always swims with her eyes closed.  You can imagine the problems that this causes.  Even some who wear goggles seem to swim with their eyes closed.  I’ve actually been punched in the nose by some idiot who couldn’t be bothered to pay attention to what was going on in the lane. There are a handful of people you see regularly at the pool who always fill your heart with dread.  Blind Lady, Backstroke Man, Scuba Fin Idiot, Clueless Slow Swimmer, and that guy who swims with that ridiculous, enormous board that acts as a single fin connected to both feet (there oughta be a law about using those things in a shared lane–they’re lethal!). Anyway, enough of a winge, I would just try your best to find a lane with the least people and/or the people that look like they are actually swimming. Easier said than done.  Swim space is at a premium.  Even if you choose a brilliant lane initially, there’s no guarantee that it won’t be invaded sometime in the course of your workout by one of the Clueless Horde. Yeah, I know, this was a completely unproductive bitch-fest on my part, for which I apologize.  But I have to say, after reading the defenses posted of the part-time and recreational swimmers ("Housewives and Hairdos"), I still have to say that there is no defense for self-centered, thoughtless behaviour. I don’t care how experienced or inexperienced a swimmer you are, how fast or slow you are, or how regularly you swim.  Never mind specific rules of pool etiquette; how hard is it to exercise your brain enough to think, "Hmmm, how do my actions affect other people around me?  Am I getting in someone’s way?  How can I best avoid disrupting other people’s workouts?" It doesn’t take much, folks.  You could say it’s just common sense, but y’know, the older I get, the more I realize that the expression "common sense" is a total misnomer. END OF WINGE. — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie

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they need to have their own lane(s) as they swim in the opposite direction to us (we swim on the left side of the lane down here). — MB.

is this due to the coriolis effect?  i assume that swimming counterclockwise in the southern hemisphere is faster than swimming clockwise because of this… will

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As for those "get it your way" types, well, that is the main reason I will only train with a squad. I just can’t train with these thoughtless people who have no idea what is going on around them. No matter what, there always seems to be one person doing slow breatstroke up the centre of the lane. In fact, they often seem to wait until it looks like someone is swimming seriously, and then start in that lane.

That’s the key—these people are *thoughtless*.  "Clueless" and "Oblivious" are other apt adjectives.  And they render me incredulous. How is it possible to be so self-absorbed and so devoid of common sense? How much effort does it take to assess a situation like a swim lane full of fellow swimmers and then tailor your actions to cause the least disruption possible to everyone’s experience? WARNING:  PURE WINGE AHEAD.  Read at your own peril.  Disclaimers apply. The ones who really blow my mind are the folks who plant themselves in a lane that is clearly too fast for them, then refuse to get out of the way of a faster swimmer coming up behind.  You can be right on their feet when they hit the wall, but instead of thoughtfully pulling over to the side at the wall and waiting for you to flip and go past them, they continue on their merry way, making their turn and ignoring your presence virtually on top of them.  Then, at the odd moment when they do choose to stop at the wall, they never fail to remain in the middle of the wall rather than making an effort to scrunch up as far to the side as possible to get out of the way of approaching swimmers. AAARGH. Then there are the backstroke boobs who haven’t a clue about doing backstroke correctly, nor are they aware that their wide-armed flailing poses a serious threat to the well-being of those sharing their lane (not to mention those in adjacent lanes).  Right alongside them go the breast stroke bobos who fail to see the wisdom of curtailing their kick when another swimmer passes.  Ouch! We have one fellow here who does this ugly bastardized form of backstroke wherein both arms, spread wide to encompass the world, are thrown backward in unison, while his legs trail behind executing a spastic frog kick. Ugly to watch, and even uglier to come in contact with. The stubbornly blind swimmers baffle me.  There’s one woman at the pool I frequent most often on campus who refuses to wear goggles, for whatever reason, but this means that she always swims with her eyes closed.  You can imagine the problems that this causes.  Even some who wear goggles seem to swim with their eyes closed.  I’ve actually been punched in the nose by some idiot who couldn’t be bothered to pay attention to what was going on in the lane. There are a handful of people you see regularly at the pool who always fill your heart with dread.  Blind Lady, Backstroke Man, Scuba Fin Idiot, Clueless Slow Swimmer, and that guy who swims with that ridiculous, enormous board that acts as a single fin connected to both feet (there oughta be a law about using those things in a shared lane–they’re lethal!). Anyway, enough of a winge, I would just try your best to find a lane with the least people and/or the people that look like they are actually swimming.

Easier said than done.  Swim space is at a premium.  Even if you choose a brilliant lane initially, there’s no guarantee that it won’t be invaded sometime in the course of your workout by one of the Clueless Horde. Yeah, I know, this was a completely unproductive bitch-fest on my part, for which I apologize.  But I have to say, after reading the defenses posted of the part-time and recreational swimmers ("Housewives and Hairdos"), I still have to say that there is no defense for self-centered, thoughtless behaviour.   I don’t care how experienced or inexperienced a swimmer you are, how fast or slow you are, or how regularly you swim.  Never mind specific rules of pool etiquette; how hard is it to exercise your brain enough to think, "Hmmm, how do my actions affect other people around me?  Am I getting in someone’s way?  How can I best avoid disrupting other people’s workouts?" It doesn’t take much, folks.  You could say it’s just common sense, but y’know, the older I get, the more I realize that the expression "common sense" is a total misnomer. END OF WINGE. — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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-snip- We have the lane jumping lady. She comes to the side and just hops right in. on top of you if you’re making a turn or in front, right next to you and then of course it’s your fault for not watching where you’re going. My advice, stick to the lanes if you have the option. Oh and smile, pisses them off big time. Al Kormesser

Where I swim we have names for chronic offenders:  - Road Block Boy (aka RBB) and RBB2 (aka Road Block Man since he is older ) – we only have 2 lane line dividing our 6 lane pool, so the faster swimmers swim in the middle (designated for "Interval" workouts) – usually going up the right lane and back the left. There’s plenty of room for everyone to pass since 2 lanes are being used. Any way the RBBs somehow manage to take up more space and block us and the turns are particularly hairy!  They don’t angle the turns – they swim to the end then kind of slide across the entire wall thus blocking anyone who is attempting to pass them on the turn. – Snorkel Man – named for obvious reasons.  He only appears from time to time but will occassionally turn up in the middle of one of our interval workouts and just do continuous lap swimming without any concern that he is in the middle of 9 swimmers doing the same work out. (The next lane over is designated for "Continuous" swimming, so he either has trouble reading or likes to mix things up in the "Interval" lane). – The Silver Bullet – wears a flesh colored old nylon bathing suit that invariably shows his butt crack and a silver swim cap.  He stares at the women swimmers all the time and will, without any warning whatsoever, shoot across our lane (from the continuous swimming lane over to the leisure lane) not worried about whether any one happens to be swimming by at that moment. I have been hit and there have been many close calls! These are just a few of the beloved characters at our pool. Recently a man forced me purposely into the lane line, kicked extra hard as to splash me in the face when I was using the kickboard and then told me I was swimming wrong. He was of the RBB variety and had no clue how to approach the wall.  Then he told me I didn’t know the proper way to circle swim!!! Let’s see, he is an occassional recreational swimmer and I’ve been swimming competitively for well over 20 years and coaching for 9 years, but yeah, he is the expert.  This interaction just about killed me!  He went off on me, and promised "I’ll be back!" I haven’t seen him again but I think I’ll call him Arnie or the Terminator. -hug

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: what is pool ettiqute for something like that? – First suggestion is to do what was already mentioned, talk to

     swimmers before getting in the lane.  Make sure everyone is on      the same page.  As is the case in most grop situations, good      communication is the cornerstone to successfull results.      Also, tapping the feet is another way of telling a lap swimmer      you want to pass.  This however, is not something novice lap      swimmers would know.  So chances are it would only piss the      unaware off.  Home Page: http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~twm/TTH.html

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Another lane? Another time of day?.  I have, also, ended up with the housewives  in an out of town pool, who invariably take up more of a lane than serious, considerate, competitive swimmers. If you must go at that time of day, "interview" each lane member;  find out who is at your level of ability. Sometimes introducing yourself and ‘asking’ if you may share "their" lane, makes all the difference !

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I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line."

You were right, she was wrong. And she had absolutely no justification to strike you. One should only strike another for self preservation. I assume you did not threaten her life. Unfortunately you will always find these clueless people, who of course already know all there is to know in the universe ( ya right ! ). We have the lane jumping lady. She comes to the side and just hops right in. on top of you if you’re making a turn or in front, right next to you and then of course it’s your fault for not watching where you’re going. My advice, stick to the lanes if you have the option. Oh and smile, pisses them off big time. Al Kormesser

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I have a question. I was swimming today and it was crowded. I swim in a public pool, where about half the pool is marked with floating lane dividers in  lanes and the other half is not.People swim in both sections. All along the entire bottom of the pool there are the black arrows you swim along. I was always taught to swim to the right of them and in a circle.   Anyways I am swimming in the area without floating markers and this lady is kick boarding near by. I am trying to swim around the markers on the bottom and she swims into my head with her kickboard and then smacks me with it. I stood up and she starts yelling, " im not going to swim around you if you cant swim in a straight line." I was so shocked she would hit me in the head with her kickboard I didnt say a word, and I was so angry I just left cause I couldnt think straight after that.     Anyways what is pool ettiqute for something like that? I thought I was doing what I should have and that no matter what she had her head up and could see what was in front of her and she shouldnt have hit me. Is that wrong? What would you do, should I have complained to the lifeguard?   thanks, al marvelli Check out: http://members.aol.com/KybrSose/giantstridePage1.html

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Question:

Don’t EVER sell your guns. You never know when you might lose the right to buy them again.

Never fear.  I just sold them to a couple kids at the local grammar school. Gun ownership is alive and thriving here in Pennsylvania.  "Sportsmen" are not being denied their revolvers and automatic what-have-you’s.  I only had one little old shotgun for small game.  I also sold my bow and arrows and stuff.  I never did hit anything with it anyhow. Ruth Kazez

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My 1st wife!!              G.Cook

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Jose’ A. Grimaldo, Jr.  says… I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

If anything I’ve taken up more sports since I started triathlon.  Before I started triathlon I basically only ever did speed skating and beach volleyball. (I watched more sport on TV than I actually physically did)   Now I do indoor climbing, mountain biking, body boarding, touch footy, as well as tri training. Give up a sport? Nope just expand my horizons more. AJ — If swimming is so good for the figure, explain whales Simon Haigh Illawarra Triathlon Club – Australia http://queene.epsb.edmonton.ab.ca/itc      

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I gave up softball.  Actually softball kind of gave up on me.  It seems like the teams I was on were always disappearing after a year and it got to be too much of a hassle trying to get together another one.  On occasion, I even miss it.  But with triathlon I don’t have to worry about trying to find a bunch of people to field a team.  I wonder if that’s why I do all my training by myself. — Steve Noone ‘Everybody has to believe in something.  I believe I’ll have a beer.’

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If it’s a Nautique or Mastercraft with less than a few hundred hours, let’s talk!  Better yet, bring it to Mrs. T’s and we’ll take it for a spin! — Mark – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip …. Anybody wanna buy a real expensive water ski boat that’s only good for pulling skiiers, and nothing else? Schwing

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If I had to give up Tri’s I would still run, that has always been my favorite of the 3 sports.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Turning it around… Would you give up tris for anything ??? Personally… If Liz Hurley were to insist I gave up tris to spend more time with her… well… I’d probably be forced to comply… — MB — just day-dreaming again… I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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Are you going to keep the pick up truck with the gun rack and Confederate flag??  :)  ( a joke)   I could use a gun for the a-holes hat like to hassle cyclist…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun Hmmm… sounds like a perfect anti-drafting tool to me… — MB. I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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Got rid of the Husky 250WR (Enduro motorcycle). Nothing quite like riding dirt to free the adrenaline ! I’ll sure miss it.  But then, every now and then I miss the ex also. why get rid of a perfectly good bike? ..Took too long to recover from the crashes…. they tell me it has something to do with age… I don’t believe them. (It’s due to poor riding ability!) So what did I do Friday?  Took dirt samples with every side of my body.  Damn I hate going into off-camber turns with WAY too much speed…. and that was the road bike !  It fared far better than I. …wanted a new helmet, yeah, but that’s a hell of a way… Love them tri.s ciao, ricardo – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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Turning it around… Would you give up tris for anything ??? Personally… If Liz Hurley were to insist I gave up tris to spend more time with her… well… I’d probably be forced to comply… — MB — just day-dreaming again… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun

Hmmm… sounds like a perfect anti-drafting tool to me… — MB. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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Golf.  No time with IM training.  Besides, I was always in the rough anyway. If I wanted to be in the rough and get credit for it I could take up mountain biking! Speedskating.  I’d much rather freeze my butt off riding for 6 hours and running for three in the winter than hanging our in a cold ice rink all weekend.  (This is a good trade?  Sorta like trading Randy Johnson for no-names!) Tennis.  Too social.  I’d much rather run with a partner who is panting too much to talk rather than one who criticizes my lousy backhand and net game. Bridge.  Demands skill and brains.  I’m good at repeating something way too long until I sorta get it right.  Bridge gives no points for endurance. Sex.  No time, no energy, partner’s asleep after my evening workout. What a sport, triathlon! –Lee (Tri-Hard)

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David Barclay confessed: 5.  Participation in both sports resulted from a "little man complex".

That’s funny. For me it resulted from a "large man complex." Rick Denney Take what you want and leave the rest.

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Don’t know about completely giving up another sport but I’ve definately put hanggliding 2nd to triathlon. I was planning on dropping a couple of grand on a kite and this damn triathlon thing came around. There goes the cashflow, new bike, new stuff. Oh well, I’ll still fly when the ocasion presents itself ie. vacation in the mtns , Just have to rent the wing. Later, Byron – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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Don’t EVER sell your guns. You never know when you might lose the right to buy them again.

<snip waterskiing stuff Schwing

No kidding.  I have four 15 round clips that I bought with my Glock in ‘92 that are now worth about $150 each.  Nothing that I’ve bought for triathlon would appreciate in value quite like a high-capacity magazine!!  :-) Cameron "I swear I’m not a gun nut" Martz

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Turning it around… Would you give up tris for anything ???

I never thought I’d lose the motivation I’ve had for several years but in the last 6 months I’ve effectively given up. I raced in Cleveland at the Worlds and again at Perth (home town race!) and they were both out of season. I had a blinder at Perth and then I think it left me flat after training so solidly through two winters for the worlds and then backing up for a local season which just didn’t quite have the same buzz about it. I’m a little frustrated but am presuming that once the weather warms up I’ll feel a bit keener, something will spark my drive again and I’ll get back into the routine. Note I’m still running a lot, especially off-road but the competitiveness of triathlon has taken a back seat for now for the enjoyment of running in the bush. I hope I get back into it as I love it for most of those reasons in that recent thread "Why do you do tris.." Tooms

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

I gave up golf!  I was shooting scores in the upper 70’s and low 80’s and feeling pretty good about my game. Now, I play about once a year when I get together with my father-in-law. I’ve found that triathlon has improved my muscle tone (obviously) and that my golf game is almost as good now as it was when I gave it up 7 years ago. I’ve only lost some touch around the greens.  I can hit the little ball as far or farther than I ever did. I’ve also noticed that my bowling has improved even though I’ve only bowled a couple time in the past several years. I will probably never give up swimming, running and biking, even if I stop competing because the physical benefits are so great!

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Mike Bundy  says… Turning it around… Would you give up tris for anything ???

<day dream snipped — MB — just day-dreaming again…

At the moment I’d only give up tris if my family wanted me to give up tris. AJ — If swimming is so good for the figure, explain whales Simon Haigh Illawarra Triathlon Club – Australia http://queene.epsb.edmonton.ab.ca/itc      

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I gave up bowling. I was a pretty good bowler in high school (close to 170 average one year), but gave it up. I just had to compare the two sports. Just look at the typical bowler physique and the typical triathlete physique and the choice was obvious.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   ‘98 IMC, GCT, BSLT IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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I gave up bowling. "Iron Pete" Priolo

Did they use to call you "Iron Pin Priolo"? I gave up Motorcycle road racing, and sold, two BMW race bikes, and found out what it takes to climb a hill on 2 wheels at 8mph instead of 80mph. It’s also a lot more fun to crash at 18mph in the dirt, than at 130mph on the back straight of Daytona.  I’ve once asked my Orthopod if he can replace all the Stainless Steel  pins in my body for Titanium. Dan Herrema

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

I also sold my shotgun as well as my kayak, canoe, bike panniers, and lots of camping stuff.  I discontinued my participation with USMS, too, but I’ll resume the swimming when tri’s are no longer feasible.  I hope that’s not today; I have an appointment in one hour with the doc who I hope will work magic on my sprained back.  I should get rid of my weights, too, it seems. Ruth Kazez

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

 I gave up rock climbing for triathlon’s.  I was to the point where I was very competitive in indoor comp’s and climbing some great big walls outside.  Now I can’t give up triathlon’s to go back to climbing!! — Tri Your Hardest!   /O     ___o      o  ~~~~   _ <,_    <|        (*)/ (*)      / Darrin Bartlett

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Don’t EVER sell your guns. You never know when you might lose the right to buy them again. I pretty much gave up water skiing due to triathlon. Anybody wanna buy a real expensive water ski boat that’s only good for pulling skiiers, and nothing else? Schwing – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

I haven’t given up other sports, but I have given up: 1.  A normal social life. 2.  Acutally, *any* social life. 3.  Late night TV. 4.  Actually, late nights in general. 5.  Leg hair. 6.  Bacon double cheeseburgers and chocolate shakes from Burger King. 7.  About 20lbs. However, there are sports that I’d like to try, but can’t because I’m a triathlete: 1.  Sumo wrestling. 2.  Extreme curling. 3.  Freestyle bunjee jumping. 4.  Beer-league bowling. 5.  Roller derby. 6.  World’s Toughest Man competitions. I still turkey hunt whenever I find myself in Pennsylvania during the season, though I ride my mountain bike to and from my hunting spot to get some miles in!!  God’s honest truth. I’m still holding onto my two Remington 12 gauges, Colt Anaconda .44mag, Glock 10mm, CZ-75 subcompact .40S&W, and two Marlin .22 rifles.  So, you better think twice before drafting me… Cameron

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

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I enjoy triathlons so much I am willing to sell my very expensive shotgun for more tri training gear.  Have you ever thought about giving up a sport for another? What are your thoughts?

I recently amazed and confused my wife when an opportunity to play football for the local semi-pro team presented itself – and I turned it down. Football had been an obsession with me throughout my youth and even I thought that I would choose that sport over any in existence.  Strangely though, she had no problem with football practices 4 afternoons a week but there is no way in hell I could regularly go to masters swim during the week.  Go figure, I guess football is a lot more fun to watch than triathlon. Dan

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Question:

Does anyone have information about the Reston Triathlon this year? I can’t find anything about it in any of the publications or on the Web. Thanks in advance for the help! I think it is closed by now but you can call (73) 476-RTRI.  Good luck.

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Does anyone have information about the Reston Triathlon this year? I can’t find anything about it in any of the publications or on the Web. Thanks in advance for the help!

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Does anyone have information about the Reston Triathlon this year? I can’t find anything about it in any of the publications or on the Web. Thanks in advance for the help! I think it is closed out by now.  If you want to try, call (703) 476-RTRI

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at : non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! : Tri-Baby Me too, Tricia, in fact I think I’ll head on down to the Gulf Coast Triathlon this weekend and see what I can do about it -Charlie I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Actually, TB, I was telling Charlie that very same thing at St. Anthony’s. The majority of violations seem to be blocking – people stacking left and staying there until it’s difficult or illegal to get around’em.  I yelled "On your left" til I was hoarse & they’d still just sorta sit there….

Oh, I can top that!  I had a couple of people actually get pissed at me for hollering "On your left!" and passing on their left when they were way the hell over in the lane.  I think they thought I should have just passed them on their right.  I went by and said, "It’s illegal to pass someone on the right, and you’re supposed to stay to the right all the time unless you’re actively passing."  Of course, the next time the road went uphill just a bit, they’d pass Miss Clydesdale here right back and there they’d be once again, just sitting there on the left. It’s easy enough to forgive ignorance, but when they continue to break the rule after having been informed about it, that’s just plain rude.  I just couldn’t believe this one woman who got really pissed at me; I yelled "On your left!" twice, and by that point I was right on top of her and committed to passing, and she would NOT move over.  I actually wound up crossing over the center line because my hands were nowhere near the brakes and I couldn’t/wouldn’t pass on the right.  She screamed something angrily at me and I hollered right back that she was blocking.  A minute later she passed me back and stuck like glue to the left side of the lane.  I eventually dropped her like a bad habit, but I was positively amazed by her rudeness. In contrast, there were two guys out there whom I passed while warning them that they were blocking, and as soon as they caught up to me again one of them said, "Sorry about the blocking; I didn’t know about it."  I gave him a friendly 10-second explanation of drafting/blocking rules, for which he thanked me.  The second guy caught up just then and said, "What’s the rule?  I couldn’t hear."  So at least some folks out there WANT to follow the rules—they just don’t know ‘em. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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<big snip Actually, TB, I was telling Charlie that very same thing at St. Anthony’s. The majority of violations seem to be blocking – people stacking left and staying there until it’s difficult or illegal to get around’em.  I yelled "On your left" til I was hoarse & they’d still just sorta sit there…. Chaz

Ditto.  I started about 2/3 back on the bike in my tri last weekend (slow seeded swim times will do that for ya), and saw no drafting but a ton of blocking as I edged my way up.  "On your left" usually met with no sign of recognition (was I speaking French?).  Some people (maybe some who buy USAT 1-day passes) just don’t know what blocking is, but others just don’t seem to worry about it.  Drafting was denounced in our info packets, but blocking wasn’t mentioned.  Perhaps a little more race-day education would cure some of the center-line attraction. — "The 100% Anti-Draft" Dragon MechE – Nokia Mobile Phones The man who believes he can do anything is probably right; So is the man who believes he can’t.

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I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Tri-Baby

I have notices that some of the worst riding positions are found in the pro women’s field. The usual drill: glued to the center line with noone else in sight. Two or three loud "on your left"’s and then a pass on the right by me. The worst part is then the same woman will then scream at another rider "on your left! ON YOUR LEFT!" until they get out of the way. Maybe the stress level is a bit higher when you’re racing for you dinner. I wonder if the pro rule that states that cyclists must be staggered across the road is the reason for this riding style. If so, how do the officials differentiate between the pros and amateurs at a race like Wildflower where they’re both on the course at the same time? On the drafting front, I did not see much if at any. Maybe a few "in the zone" for a while, but no wheel sucking. Then again I did not see to many cyclists either. When you are pretty much alone, I would rather see a pair of people riding side by side and not drafting then right behind one another. Even though both are technically illegal. Mini race report; apply to all races until further notice: Great swim. Good bike. Died on the run. End report. myke — Tellmesomethingidontknowtellmesomethingicanusepushthebuttonconnectthegoddam ndots

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Sheesh. My view from a little further up in the race merits a full SHEESH!  Not only was blocking completely rampant, it was mighty drafty as well.  I saw a lot of motorcycles and only one time was an athlete so much as warned — and that was for a minute-long yellow line violation.  Granted, it was crowded out there for the first 10-15 miles, but there seemed to be minimal effort by officials and many athletes to follow the rules. Could have used old C.J. out there.  Yup, that cowboy would have cleaned up the place. Mark Vande Kamp

As one of the officials at the International distance race on Sunday, I’d just like to note that blocking and drafting were high on the officiating agendas for the long course and international.  From what I understand, somewhere between 60-70 blocking or drafting fouls were "awarded" on Saturday – this is 6-7% of the total number of participants. The number of position fouls called on Sunday were less, primarily due to the fact that there are few places on the out/back bike course that were conducive to drafting, although blocking fouls were looked for everywhere, especially on climbs. Joe Sventek

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Distribution:

: As one of the officials at the International distance race on Sunday, : I’d just : like to note that blocking and drafting were high on the officiating : agendas : for the long course and international.  From what I understand, : somewhere between : 60-70 blocking or drafting fouls were "awarded" on Saturday – this is : 6-7% of the : total number of participants. : The number of position fouls called on Sunday were less, primarily due : to the fact : that there are few places on the out/back bike course that were : conducive to drafting, : although blocking fouls were looked for everywhere, especially on : climbs. : Joe Sventek Way to go, Joe!  Glad you were there! -Charlie

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Oh, Charlie, would that I were!  Dan was giving me grief from here to next Tuesday at Wildflower, pushing, prodding, cajoling, GUILTING me to come to Oceanside, but alas, I have the triathlete’s age-old excuse for this one (did everyone see that article in Inside Tri last month?):  I have to go to a wedding the night before the race.  As a matter of fact, I’m a bridesmaid in said wedding (oh, always a bridesmaid!), so there is no slinking out of this one.

I assume it’s because you won’t be in town for the race.  I did a triathlon the morning after my *own* wedding in September. Ken "got permission way ahead of time" Lehner

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at : non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! : Just my $.02. : Tri-Baby Me too, Tricia, in fact I think I’ll head on down to the Gulf Coast Triathlon this weekend and see what I can do about it -Charlie I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Sheesh. Tri-Baby                                     _                                  -    o     ‘             –  __o       –    </_ `     ‘         –    <         – __/   /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

Actually, TB, I was telling Charlie that very same thing at St. Anthony’s. The majority of violations seem to be blocking – people stacking left and staying there until it’s difficult or illegal to get around’em.  I yelled "On your left" til I was hoarse & they’d still just sorta sit there…. Chaz

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even : worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in : the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would : politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and : rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just : don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all : the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone : penalized? Well. I’m coming to USTS Oceanside, so I’ll get a chance to see how folks in California are riding these days.  Will you and your famous TR bars be there? -Charlie

Oh, Charlie, would that I were!  Dan was giving me grief from here to next Tuesday at Wildflower, pushing, prodding, cajoling, GUILTING me to come to Oceanside, but alas, I have the triathlete’s age-old excuse for this one (did everyone see that article in Inside Tri last month?):  I have to go to a wedding the night before the race.  As a matter of fact, I’m a bridesmaid in said wedding (oh, always a bridesmaid!), so there is no slinking out of this one. I’m bummed, too, ’cause it sounds like it’s going to be a total hoot. Between Dan’s "anti-drafting device" and your presence, it’s sure to be the cleanest race ever seen in California to boot. *sigh* Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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: events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at : non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! : Just my $.02. : Tri-Baby Me too, Tricia, in fact I think I’ll head on down to the Gulf Coast Triathlon this weekend and see what I can do about it -Charlie

I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Sheesh. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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: I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even : worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in : the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would : politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and : rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just : don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all : the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone : penalized? Well. I’m coming to USTS Oceanside, so I’ll get a chance to see how folks in California are riding these days.  Will you and your famous TR bars be there? -Charlie

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: events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at : non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! : Just my $.02. : Tri-Baby Me too, Tricia, in fact I think I’ll head on down to the Gulf Coast Triathlon this weekend and see what I can do about it -Charlie

Charlie –   And you’ve assured me that Memphis is marshalled quite rigorously, right? Are you there? Chaz

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To draft or not to draft? This is the problem! Drafting is nowadays a very controversial issue. Living in Europe I’m in favour of allowing drafting for the simple reason that in the majority of our competitions the cycling phase develops on narrow roads and the number of officials available doesn’t allow a credible control. Legal drafting is better than an illegal one which in our roads and with the actual controls would take place anyway.

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To draft or not to draft? This is the problem! Drafting is nowadays a very controversial issue. Living in Europe I’m in favour of allowing drafting for the simple reason that in the majority of our competitions the cycling phase develops on narrow roads and the number of officials available doesn’t allow a credible control. Legal drafting is better than an illegal one which in our roads and with the actual controls would take place anyway.

In events where the course/conditions make it literally impossible to avoid drafting, I’d say the race director should consider making it a draft-legal event.  It’s ridiculous to deny cold hard realities like narrow roads combined with large, competitive fields. I’ve got nothing against draft-legal racing per se; it’s just that rules have to be established one way or the other, and then enforced.  And I personally don’t feel that draft-legal racing should be representative of our sport to the world at large—in other words, I don’t think the Olympics or the World Championships should be draft legal.  For other events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! Just my $.02. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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: events, sure, why not?  But I sure hate seeing people drafting at : non-drafting races, pisses the hell outta me! : Just my $.02. : Tri-Baby Me too, Tricia, in fact I think I’ll head on down to the Gulf Coast Triathlon this weekend and see what I can do about it -Charlie

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I was wishing you were there at Wildflower this weekend, Charlie.  Even worse than the one or two instances of blatant drafting that I saw way in the back was all the stupid, ignorant blocking.  Even after I would politely inform people that what they were doing was called blocking and rendered them subject to penalties, they’d continue doing it.  I just don’t understand!  Why on earth does anybody need to ride practically all the way over on the center line???  Do they want to get killed, let alone penalized? Sheesh.

My view from a little further up in the race merits a full SHEESH!  Not only was blocking completely rampant, it was mighty drafty as well.  I saw a lot of motorcycles and only one time was an athlete so much as warned — and that was for a minute-long yellow line violation.  Granted, it was crowded out there for the first 10-15 miles, but there seemed to be minimal effort by officials and many athletes to follow the rules. Could have used old C.J. out there.  Yup, that cowboy would have cleaned up the place. Mark Vande Kamp

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To draft or not to draft? This is the problem! Drafting is nowadays one of the most controversial issues of triathlon and it cannot be dismissed with a few words in favour or against. In Europe, the cycling phase of a race in the majority of the competitions, develops on narrow roads where a credible control by the officials is often impossible. For this reason I think that official drafting is to prefer to illegal drafting which would take place anyway!

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Question:

In past years there was a Half Iron-Man race near Ottawa late in the season.  I believe it may have been called the Ganaraska Triathlon.  This year I haven’t seen anything on this race.  Is it on?  If someone knows a phone, fax, or email for the organizers, I’d love to see it. Thanks Lance — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Lance W. Robinson               |"As soon as you have made thought, laugh Fax: (519)763-7771              |"Necessity may be the mother of invention, Tel: (519)763-0260              |but play is certainly the father." http://www.web.net/~lrobinso    |                          - Roger von Oech <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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In past years there was a Half Iron-Man race near Ottawa late in the season.  I believe it may have been called the Ganaraska Triathlon.  This year I haven’t seen anything on this race.  Is it on?  If someone knows a phone, fax, or email for the organizers, I’d love to see it.

        There is the Ottawa River Half-Ironman at Wilderness Tours in Beachburg on September 1st. It is approximately 1 and half hours from Ottawa. (5 with my car) For additionial information you can look at the TBM home page at http://www.cyberus.ca, or call them at 613-737-6042.         On August 18 there is the 1000 island triathlon at Gananoque (750/20/5), perhaps you confused the two races.         Good luck, see you at the race. "Yes, makin’ mock o’ uniforms that guard you while you sleep, Is cheaper than them uniforms,an’ they’re starvation cheap;"                                                 Rudyard Kipling, 1892

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Question:

(Paul Wilson) writes:

Are you the same Paul from Australia that qualified for Hawaii 92 in Canada??  If it is you, you also sold me your Zipp wheel.   Marco and I are planning a trip to down under Dec 22- Jan 8.  We hope to do some training over there, specially biking since it will be winter in NY at the time. Do you have any suggestions as to where we should go so we can have fun and get our training in?  Suggestions on hotels, etc are welcome. Also any news on any events happening over that period? THanks a lot

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hello. does someone have as close as possible a set schedule of triathlons/biathlons in the sydney/melbourne area for december 27-january 12? if not where might i get that? i need to get some things going if i can get that info. thanks john

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hello. does someone have as close as possible a set schedule of triathlons/biathlons in the sydney/melbourne area for december 27-january 12? if not where might i get that? i need to get some things going if i can get that info.

Dear John, I wrote to you a while back with some info for the Melbourne area. I have since uncovered some info about the Sydney region too. Sorry I did not back, it has been sitting in my diary since. Once again, the tri calendars are still in beta version so you will need to check with the relevant governing bodies. My pre-release calendar showed a race or two in both states at that time of year. You need to contact: MELB: Triathlon Victoria, PO Box 960, Mount Waverley, Victoria, 3149       Phone: +61 3 803 8800       Fax: +61 3 803 8800 SYD:  Triathlon NSW, PO Box 112, Manly, NSW, 2095       Phone: +61 2 976 2444       Fax: +61 2 977 1797 Hope this helps. Drop me a line when you are in town or e-mail me before departure and I will give you my phone number. Happy Training!! Melbourne, AUSTRALIA             snail-mail: PO Box 4340, Parkville, Vic 3052

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