Question:

You want honesty?  You really want honesty??? OK then: we’re all too tired, too worn, too enervated to have another ranting thread about True Triathlon vs all the pretenders.

Wussy. I think I’ll go and have a lie down.

Old wussy. Getting all the loud, painful, badly behaved snowboarders to go to the US and leave the alpine slopes to the skiers for a week or so?

Old wussy fussbudget. Most of the ones I’ve come across couldn’t straighten up long enough to be able to focus on the bottle.

Bitter old wussy fussbudget.

Response:

So, everyone went nuts because Triathlete magazine did an issue about adventure racing and that isn’t triathlon. Personally, it didn’t bug me too much because I’m always behind in my reading and I got to take that issue "off."

What’s the problem? They don’t call it "Triathlon", they call it adventure racing. It’s a different sport with great crossover appeal and a good option for cross training. And it looks like a lot of fun! Hoping to try one this year. I noticed they did some stuff about the winter triathlon championships (run, mountain bike, freestyle cross-country ski). Did this bug people as much as the adventure racing stuff? Also, there’s apparently talk of putting winter triathlon in the Olympics. Thoughts? -Harold

Whatever. Name them whatever you want. Adventure racing, winter triathlon, International triathlon, draft legal tri, traditional tri, "real" tri (whatever that is). There will only be one form of the sport that truly tests the individual athlete’s ability against that of his/her competitors in a swim/time trial/run contest. It’s a shame the pros work for all those years in one format, and then end up competing for gold in something entirely different, IMHO. Tom

Response:

So, everyone went nuts because Triathlete magazine did an issue about adventure racing and that isn’t triathlon. Personally, it didn’t bug me too much because I’m always behind in my reading and I got to take that issue "off."

How did I miss that one?  Too many people here need to live somewhere else, perhaps where there are only three seasons.  Multisport is multisport.   I’m going to have fun with the Hitec series at least once this year.   Also, there’s apparently talk of putting winter triathlon in the Olympics. Thoughts?

XC, shooting, and ???  Ski jumping, perhaps? — Jason O’Rourke www.jor.com

Response:

So, everyone went nuts because Triathlete magazine did an issue about adventure racing and that isn’t triathlon. Personally, it didn’t bug me too much because I’m always behind in my reading and I got to take that issue "off." I noticed they did some stuff about the winter triathlon championships (run, mountain bike, freestyle cross-country ski). Did this bug people as much as the adventure racing stuff? Also, there’s apparently talk of putting winter triathlon in the Olympics. Thoughts? -Harold

Response:

So, everyone went nuts because Triathlete magazine did an issue about adventure racing and that isn’t triathlon. Personally, it didn’t bug me too much because I’m always behind in my reading and I got to take that issue "off." I noticed they did some stuff about the winter triathlon championships (run, mountain bike, freestyle cross-country ski). Did this bug people as much as the adventure racing stuff?

It should, if they’re honest. Also, there’s apparently talk of putting winter triathlon in the Olympics. Thoughts?

Screw the Olympics.  It’s just a media circus.   Know what the best thing about adding snowboarding to the winter Olympics was? They had a sport where the best of the best had no interest in the Olympics, and instead went to the winter X games.  Granted, it was because they couldn’t pass the "fill the bottle" test, but it’s still a hoot.

Response:

So, everyone went nuts because Triathlete magazine did an issue about adventure racing and that isn’t triathlon. Personally, it didn’t bug me too much because I’m always behind in my reading and I got to take that issue "off." I noticed they did some stuff about the winter triathlon championships (run, mountain bike, freestyle cross-country ski). Did this bug people as much as the adventure racing stuff? It should, if they’re honest.

You want honesty?  You really want honesty??? OK then: we’re all too tired, too worn, too enervated to have another ranting thread about True Triathlon vs all the pretenders. Also, there’s apparently talk of putting winter triathlon in the Olympics. Thoughts?

I think I’ll go and have a lie down. Screw the Olympics.  It’s just a media circus.

Change the channel. Know what the best thing about adding snowboarding to the winter Olympics was?

Getting all the loud, painful, badly behaved snowboarders to go to the US and leave the alpine slopes to the skiers for a week or so? They had a sport where the best of the best had no interest in the Olympics, and instead went to the winter X games.  Granted, it was because they couldn’t pass the "fill the bottle" test, but it’s still a hoot.

Most of the ones I’ve come across couldn’t straighten up long enough to be able to focus on the bottle. Mark M

Response:

Question:

Unless, of course, it was in hell, where it would certainly be snowing the day you spent $2500 on a bike… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You can bet, if I spent $2500 on a bike, it would never even hear the word ’snow.’

Response:

Don’t listen to the "do it yourselfers" unless you are one also…because you may spend $3,500 trying to make "a great deal" fit you correctly. Instead, call  John Cobb of Bicycle Sports, Shreveport, LA.  Make arrangements to spend a whole day with him riding several different models, with different set-ups, and different components (although he currently does not carry Cervelo). Then, you have at least given it your best shot.  And, you can do the whole thing for under your budget. Or, find another worthy bike shop Nytro, etc. and go through the same ritual. — Rick Loggins

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unless, of course, it was in hell, where it would certainly be snowing the day you spent $2500 on a bike… You can bet, if I spent $2500 on a bike, it would never even hear the word ’snow.’

Response:

I absolutely expect to go faster.  With a new bike and the increased training I dreamed I was going to be doing this winter I see no reason why I can’t knock 1/2 an hour off my Ironman bike split.  That will happen 9 months from now at Ironman California 2001.   As soon as I get the bike I’ll have the "eye of the tiger" and will ride like hell all winter though blinding snow and  bone chilling cold and I’ll emerge in the springtime as a new man with the ability to qualify for the Hawaiian Ironman. Yeah that’s it .. I’m already pumped  .. I’m going out to my garage to find some nails to chew on. Thanks everyone for the bike pointers, I’ll use that information as a starting point.   Paul

Response:

As soon as I get the bike I’ll have the "eye of the tiger" and will ride like hell all winter though blinding snow and  bone chilling cold

You can bet, if I spent $2500 on a bike, it would never even hear the word ’snow.’

Response:

Once you ride a Cervelo- you will never go back to anything else. Quality and customer service is first class DD

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m 5′11" 170 lbs We are almost exactly the same size.  I love my Cervelo P3.  FYI – previous bikes have been Softride, Felt, Litespeed.  The Cervelo is very comfortable and fast.  I have also found the company very helpful and easy to deal with. david Never give up, Be satisfied w/ your best, Do unto others…..

Response:

I would agree about rec.bicycles.marketplace.  I am now the proud owner of a $2000 litespeed frame for less than 1/2 the price.  Lets face it most high end stuff is taken care of well.  You can get some good deals there.

Response:

I’m going to show my greeness here. I consider myself a pretty good cyclist and have yet to be able to ride 100 miles solo at  a just over 18mph pace. I think you are short changing yourself or I don’t have a clue as to my own abilities. I guess I’m saying all of that to ask with the times you are posting, do you think a bike for that kind of money will improve your speed that much? I hope I’m not coming across in the wrong manner, it’s a serious question. chris freeman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – All,     I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  I realize that part of that depends on how it feels to me, however I don’t think I’ll have the luxury of trying out all my various options for any length of time.  I’m 5′11" 170 lbs and I’m about an average cyclist (I did last years IMC bike leg in 6:07 and this years IMUSA bike leg in 6:13).  The bike I currently have is a 1996 Lemond carbon fiber Chambery.  I do about 5-8 triathlons a year ranging from sprint distances up to Ironman distance.  Any help in pointing me the right direction will be much appreciated.  I few I’ve thought about include the Trek Hilo 2000 and the Litespeed Saber or Blade.  Any thoughts on those?  Thanks Paul

Response:

Paul, I’ve got one for you. I’m 6′/160lbs, I do sprints through Ironman, and I’m selling the bike I did Hawaii w/last year (it–i had nothing to do with it–went a bit over 5 hours). I also used it in sprint/od races. Set up for road (73/74 degree angle) which I find is the most comfortable/powerful setup. It’s a 56cm Fondriest megaAl, ultegra 9spd, profile bladed straight carbon fork, embroidered fondriest saddle, look pedals, spinergy wheels. It’s a $2500-$3000 bike new, I used if for 3 months and am selling for $1200. (I no longer use it because the team i ride w/on road got new giants)…

See what I mean?  That leaves at least $1300 to invest.

Response:

Paul, I’ve got one for you. I’m 6′/160lbs, I do sprints through Ironman, and I’m selling the bike I did Hawaii w/last year (it–i had nothing to do with it–went a bit over 5 hours). I also used it in sprint/od races. Set up for road (73/74 degree angle) which I find is the most comfortable/powerful setup. It’s a 56cm Fondriest megaAl, ultegra 9spd, profile bladed straight carbon fork, embroidered fondriest saddle, look pedals, spinergy wheels. It’s a $2500-$3000 bike new, I used if for 3 months and am selling for $1200. (I no longer use it because the team i ride w/on road got new giants)… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – All,     I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  I realize that part of that depends on how it feels to me, however I don’t think I’ll have the luxury of trying out all my various options for any length of time.  I’m 5′11" 170 lbs and I’m about an average cyclist (I did last years IMC bike leg in 6:07 and this years IMUSA bike leg in 6:13). The bike I currently have is a 1996 Lemond carbon fiber Chambery.  I do about 5-8 triathlons a year ranging from sprint distances up to Ironman distance.  Any help in pointing me the right direction will be much appreciated.  I few I’ve thought about include the Trek Hilo 2000 and the Litespeed Saber or Blade.  Any thoughts on those?  Thanks Paul

Before you buy.

Response:

then stick the leftover $1500-2000 in a nice mutual fund, because ain’t neither of the candidates really gonna be able to fix Social Security, and you’ll want to retire to something better than cat food, or PowerBars (which one is worse?)

Given those options for my 20 or so planned golden years, I’d go with cat food.  If you puree it you can mash it around, yum yum. Before you buy.

Response:

well—–i would encourage you to look at a yaqui.   i got one this year (my 3rd triathlon bike) and i’ve been very pleased with it, both in training and in racing.   i do happen to go faster, but am still not sure if it’s the bike itself, or because it fits me better than the last one.   or that i’m now trying harder.   in any event, it’s a wonderful, very comfortable bike, so i’d advise at least checking it out. peggy

Response:

All,     I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  

Go to rec.bucycles.marketplace, cherry pick the primo deals for frame, wheels, components, buy the 10% you can’t find there at discount mail order, and get a bike that would cost $3000 if you rolled it out of a bike shop for under $1000, with the added benefit that, having built it yourself, you are intimately familiar with its workings and repair, and then stick the leftover $1500-2000 in a nice mutual fund, because ain’t neither of the candidates really gonna be able to fix Social Security, and you’ll want to retire to something better than cat food, or PowerBars (which one is worse?)

Response:

Take a good look at Cervelo…… sam – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon All, I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  I realize that part of that depends on how it feels to me, however I don’t think I’ll have the luxury of trying out all my various options for any length of time.  I’m 5′11" 170 lbs and I’m about an average cyclist (I did last years IMC bike leg in 6:07 and this years IMUSA bike leg in 6:13).  The bike I currently have is a 1996 Lemond carbon fiber Chambery.  I do about 5-8 triathlons a year ranging from sprint distances up to Ironman distance.  Any help in pointing me the right direction will be much appreciated.  I few I’ve thought about include the Trek Hilo 2000 and the Litespeed Saber or Blade. Any thoughts on those?  Thanks Paul

Response:

I’m 5′11" 170 lbs

We are almost exactly the same size.  I love my Cervelo P3.  FYI – previous bikes have been Softride, Felt, Litespeed.  The Cervelo is very comfortable and fast.  I have also found the company very helpful and easy to deal with. david Never give up, Be satisfied w/ your best, Do unto others…..

Response:

Check www.slowtwitch.com for the bike reviews. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – All,     I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  I realize that part of that depends on how it feels to me, however I don’t think I’ll have the luxury of trying out all my various options for any length of time.  I’m 5′11" 170 lbs and I’m about an average cyclist (I did last years IMC bike leg in 6:07 and this years IMUSA bike leg in 6:13).  The bike I currently have is a 1996 Lemond carbon fiber Chambery.  I do about 5-8 triathlons a year ranging from sprint distances up to Ironman distance.  Any help in pointing me the right direction will be much appreciated.  I few I’ve thought about include the Trek Hilo 2000 and the Litespeed Saber or Blade.  Any thoughts on those?  Thanks Paul

Response:

All,     I plan on buying a new bike sometime before next spring and I’m willing to spend in the range of $2500-$3000.  For that amount of money what would you recommend?  I realize that part of that depends on how it feels to me, however I don’t think I’ll have the luxury of trying out all my various options for any length of time.  I’m 5′11" 170 lbs and I’m about an average cyclist (I did last years IMC bike leg in 6:07 and this years IMUSA bike leg in 6:13).  The bike I currently have is a 1996 Lemond carbon fiber Chambery.  I do about 5-8 triathlons a year ranging from sprint distances up to Ironman distance.  Any help in pointing me the right direction will be much appreciated.  I few I’ve thought about include the Trek Hilo 2000 and the Litespeed Saber or Blade.  Any thoughts on those?  Thanks Paul

Response:

Question:

as to this current situation, especially since this seems to be a QR wetsuit, i hope the poster doesn’t sit on this problem until wildflower,

Definitely not, Dan, that’s why I posted this cry for help.  It is a QR suit and I’m quite pleased with it as a product.  But I’m having difficulty getting the technique on my own. I think the main reason this problem came up is because I didn’t get enough practice before the event ( L A Tri Series) and didn’t have time to do a good warm up at the race.  Inexperience seems to be the main factor at this point.   But my main reason for doing this race was to tune up for WF. This weekend I intend to get in some open water swimming and either work out the bugs or start working on a contingency plan.  Worst case is I’ll have to rent a sleeveless for WF. Larry

Response:

Dan: About time you returned. I was forced to pick up your slack. Now you owe me two "mai-tai’s"! Keith — Ironman Triathlon Wetsuits Website: www.ironmanwetsuits.com toll free order line: 800-897-6464 international calls: 804-288-6000

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it normal for a full wetsuit to have a noticable effect on stroke difficulty? i’ve been away visiting bike factories in the orient for the past week and have just returned to find the post, and the replies.  at the risk of sounding preachy, i might remind the original poster, and others as well, that there is a solution to problems like this that is often overlooked, which is to go to the source of the issue, the manufacturer who made the product.  often the customer calls us directly in such case as the retailer can’t provide a service solution, and we send out some other sizes and styles in order to match the customer to the right suit.  in the case of our product just not working, we have a two week money back guarantee, so that an end user won’t have to sell his/her new wetsuit as a used one if he/she doesn’t like it. i think that’s the downside of the ‘net, sometimes one is so used to getting working out their problems here that they forget the old fashioned way, which is to demand service from the provider of the product, from whence the service should rightly come. as to this current situation, especially since this seems to be a QR wetsuit, i hope the poster doesn’t sit on this problem until wildflower, there are still a couple of weeks until the race, plenty of time to have us, or the retailer, fix the problem by suggesting the right technique to putting on and/or swimming in a fullsuit, vs sizing, vs full vs john, providing other sizes or styles to provide a better match, and finally, in the last resort, sending it back for a full refund and getting an ironman/orca/aquaman, or whatever works better. i do agree with keith that our hydros can be somewhat more forgiving, since the rubber is more flexible (although in a normal situation, where it is an easy fit between customer and our patterns, there will be no real difference).  but this is really just the case in the torso, since the rubber used in the arms, shoulders, and armpits, in the ultrafull is the same as that in a hydro.  but as to keith’s point, this is yamamoto’s #39 SCS rubber that is used throughout in the hydro suits, rubber which i think is a must if you are going to spend over $300 in a suit.  i’d demand that this is the rubber you’re buying if a top o’ the line suit.  i’m sure keith agrees. qrman

Response:

Is it normal for a full wetsuit to have a noticable effect on stroke difficulty? I’m pretty sure that I’m in the correct size wetsuit but it still seems difficult to move my arms for any length of time.   Yesterday, I swam about 100 yards and had to rest.  After that, I could go 50 – 75 yards until my arms fatigued.  My arms are still sore and the whole swim was only 500 yards.  Does this sound like I just need to get out and practice in the suit or is it more likely that I still need to go up another size?  At 6′, 185 lb., the charts call for a ML – L.  Or maybe I should just forget the full suit and get one that’s sleveless. At this point, there’s no way I can swim 1.2 miles in this wetsuit.  Are wetsuits available for rental at Wildflower just in case I don’t have this worked out by then? Larry

Response:

Is it normal for a full wetsuit to have a noticable effect on stroke difficulty?

No, this is not normal. I’m pretty sure that I’m in the correct size wetsuit but it still seems difficult to move my arms for any length of time.   Yesterday, I swam about 100 yards and had to rest.  After that, I could go 50 – 75 yards until my arms fatigued.  My arms are still sore and the whole swim was only 500 yards.  Does this sound like I just need to get out and practice in the suit or is it more likely that I still need to go up another size?  At 6′, 185 lb., the charts call for a ML – L.  Or maybe I should just forget the full suit and get one that’s sleveless.

It sounds like the size is correct. Judging by the size chart, I take it you purchased a "QR". Did you buy the Standard or Hydrophobic? This could be part of the problem. In my opinion, the standard rubber suit is a bit too restrictive for use on a fullsuit. Putting this suit on properly is as important as purchasing the correct size. Try the following procedure before giving up on your new fullsuit. 1. Make certain you pull the wetsuit as high into the crouch as possible prior to bringing the suit up past the waist. (This will allow you ample room in the torso) 2. The arms of the suit should be pulled up high and above the shoulder. (It is not uncommon to have a small crease of rubber above the shoulder area) Make certain the rubber under the arm pit is flush against the skin. You can test this by raising one arm at a time, using the opposite hand to poke underneath the arm socket. There should be no space between your arm pit and the suit material. Try rotating your arms out of the water. You should immediately feel the difference after making this minor adjustment. Hopefully, this will solve your dilema. At this point, there’s no way I can swim 1.2 miles in this wetsuit.  Are wetsuits available for rental at Wildflower just in case I don’t have this worked out by then?

I doubt anyone will have rental at the race. Feel free to call if you would like a list of retailers who offer rentals from their shop. (You can do this by UPS) Good luck- Keith www.ironmanwetsuits.com

Response:

Thanks for the advice, Keith.  I’m really inexperienced in this area and not doing real good at figuring it out for myself. I’ll pay more attention to adjusting the arms next time.  I guess what I need to do is spend some time at the beach over the next couple of weeks to master the fine points. Thanks again, I appreciate your help. Larry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – snip Good luck- Keith www.ironmanwetsuits.com

Response:

Is it normal for a full wetsuit to have a noticable effect on stroke difficulty?

i’ve been away visiting bike factories in the orient for the past week and have just returned to find the post, and the replies.  at the risk of sounding preachy, i might remind the original poster, and others as well, that there is a solution to problems like this that is often overlooked, which is to go to the source of the issue, the manufacturer who made the product.  often the customer calls us directly in such case as the retailer can’t provide a service solution, and we send out some other sizes and styles in order to match the customer to the right suit.  in the case of our product just not working, we have a two week money back guarantee, so that an end user won’t have to sell his/her new wetsuit as a used one if he/she doesn’t like it. i think that’s the downside of the ‘net, sometimes one is so used to getting working out their problems here that they forget the old fashioned way, which is to demand service from the provider of the product, from whence the service should rightly come. as to this current situation, especially since this seems to be a QR wetsuit, i hope the poster doesn’t sit on this problem until wildflower, there are still a couple of weeks until the race, plenty of time to have us, or the retailer, fix the problem by suggesting the right technique to putting on and/or swimming in a fullsuit, vs sizing, vs full vs john, providing other sizes or styles to provide a better match, and finally, in the last resort, sending it back for a full refund and getting an ironman/orca/aquaman, or whatever works better. i do agree with keith that our hydros can be somewhat more forgiving, since the rubber is more flexible (although in a normal situation, where it is an easy fit between customer and our patterns, there will be no real difference).  but this is really just the case in the torso, since the rubber used in the arms, shoulders, and armpits, in the ultrafull is the same as that in a hydro.  but as to keith’s point, this is yamamoto’s #39 SCS rubber that is used throughout in the hydro suits, rubber which i think is a must if you are going to spend over $300 in a suit.  i’d demand that this is the rubber you’re buying if a top o’ the line suit.  i’m sure keith agrees. qrman

Response:

One thing I forgot is that it is essential that you can find a suit that fits your body type. A suit that can’t do that will be useless and will even have a negative effect. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have been putting off buying a wetsuit but am beginning to think i should get one.  I hate the cold water, and i would rather swim in a nice cozy suit.  I am sure this has been discussed many times but here it goes again, I am wanting to spend about 200 – 300 bucks, what should brand should i look for? Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

We have sold both QR and Ironman and have had great success with the Ironman suits. Sizing has been very accurate and we have had positive feedback from customers on their Ironman suits. We also have started selling the Orca suits but that is still a new line to us so I can’t relay a personal history with that brand although it has been positive so far. If I can be of help in choosing a suit and the proper size, please give me a call. thanks, Diane Tarver http://Tri-Specialties.com 1-337-625-4214 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have been putting off buying a wetsuit but am beginning to think i should get one.  I hate the cold water, and i would rather swim in a nice cozy suit.  I am sure this has been discussed many times but here it goes again, I am wanting to spend about 200 – 300 bucks, what should brand should i look for? Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

I had QR for 10 years, switched to Ironman full siut. I set PR’s for every course, and it’s fast getting off too. Bill

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have been putting off buying a wetsuit but am beginning to think i should get one.  I hate the cold water, and i would rather swim in a nice cozy suit.  I am sure this has been discussed many times but here it goes again, I am wanting to spend about 200 – 300 bucks, what should brand should i look for? Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

Thanks for the advice, i went out today and tried on a few QR’s but ended up with an Ironman suit.  It fits a whole better in the chest area.  I did not expect the amount of difficulty in putting the thing on.  it took me a good hour to try on three different suits.  I was tired and swetty afterward, i hope with some practice and Pam spray I can get the thing on in a hurry.  I hope to swim with it tomorrow and see how different everything feels. Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

I had great results with the QR. hydro, long john. Since there aren’t arms it makes it easy to get out  of and you still have full range of motion. Chuck Garabedian – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have been putting off buying a wetsuit but am beginning to think i should get one.  I hate the cold water, and i would rather swim in a nice cozy suit.  I am sure this has been discussed many times but here it goes again, I am wanting to spend about 200 – 300 bucks, what should brand should i look for? Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

i have been putting off buying a wetsuit but am beginning to think i should get one.  I hate the cold water, and i would rather swim in a nice cozy suit.  I am sure this has been discussed many times but here it goes again, I am wanting to spend about 200 – 300 bucks, what should brand should i look for? Thanks Again Ron C

Response:

Question:

Let’s start with the basics.  When you sit on a flat surface, your weight is supported by the "sit bones" (Ischial tuberosities) which are part of your pelvis.  This keeps your weight from pressing against the soft tissue (muslces, nerves and blood vessels) in your peri area (perinium- the area between your rectum and your genitals), which is *not* designed to support your weight.  Your sit bones should also be the part of you supporting your weight on a bicycle saddle.

Totally 100% agree! Unfortunately, most modern bicycle saddles seem to be designed for very narrow-pelvis individuals.

Yes – and just who are these people? Sometimes it seems that designers think that Marco Pantani is you typical cyclist. These saddles may not be wide enough to support your sit bones, with the result that your weight is concentrated on your peri area which results in pain, numbness, etc. An upright sitting position, preferred by many people, only makes matters worse by putting more of your weight on your butt and also rotating your pelvis into a more upright position.

I think we are singing from the same hymn-sheet… For most people, a comfortable saddle is one that’s widen enough to firmly support the sit bones and keep pressure off the perinium.  There are two characteristics of comfortable saddles, actually:  width and flatness.  Overly soft, heavily padded or gel saddles often are more uncomfortable than a firm, wide, flat saddle because the material "bunches up" under the peri area.

This concurs exactly with my experience! Here are a few suggestions for wider, flatter saddles: WTB (Wilderness Trail Bikes) SST Brooks B.17 Champion Standard, B.72, B.66, etc (bit not all Brooks saddles; Pro and Swift are narrower) Avocet Air 02 40M (for men) or W (? I think, for women; R is narrower for racing)

Let’s face it, what self-respecting lycra fettishist is going to be seen dead astride a B17. So many of my cycling friends (particularly women who seem to be more prone to saddle-sensitivity than men) baulk at the idea of fitting their latest shiney Italian masterpiece with what they percieve as an old-man’s cardigan of a saddle. Well I have happily gone one step further down the road of unfashionability and ride a "Champion Flyer" – basically a B17 with springs. — Baker Atlas GEOScience      Tel: +44 (0)208 202 2433 154 Brent Street,           FAX: +44 (0)208 202 2287 London, NW4 2DR, ENGLAND.   WWW: http://www.zands.com

Response:

Specialized Body Geometry comp and the Terry Liberator Fly Saddle

I have used both, and returned them. Make sure you can do the same. I think they are both too soft. It feels cushy in the store, but with my 180# on it it they crush down and are worse than a harder saddle. Others have written here about sitting on their ischial tuberosities. However, in the aero position you will not be. You will be rotated forward and sittting on the softer places. No saddle company as yet addressed this problem with any effective solution. Also as others said, it will be your own personal search for the best saddle for you. I would say this as a rule of thumb. Look for a saddle that has a nose that curves down, for that "ride the nose" aero tri position. The Specialized Body Geometry does not. If you can crush the saddle cushioning easily in the store with your hand don’t buy it. Beyond those tow things it is a shot in the dark to finally find what works for you. Barring all that, if you do have a tolerable saddle that maybe just needs a wee bit better comfort, then try a QR saddle cover and see how that works. They are only about $20. Were we all riding mountain bikes or regular road bikes the saddle problem is much more easily solved because you essentially ride in a more upright position and can utilize some of the features in the newer saddles. My mountain bike has a comfortable saddle, but I cannot just switch it over to my tri bike. It fails to be good enough for that use. Ken (still searching himself for that "perfect" tri saddle)

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However, in the aero position you will not be. You will be rotated forward and sittting on the softer places. No saddle company as yet addressed this problem with any effective solution. Also as others said, it will be your own personal search for the best saddle for you.

       My solution for this problem is to skew the saddle .5 cm one way or the other and then to sit on the big muscle down there instead of the soft stuff. See John Cobb’s suggestions at bicyclesports.com        Using this method I have been riding a Flite since they were 1st introduced (10 years or so) with no problems even on very long rides.         Good luck and happy sitting! Never give up, Be satisfied w/ your best, Do unto others…..

Response:

Others have written here about sitting on their ischial tuberosities. However, in the aero position you will not be. You will be rotated forward and sittting on the softer places. No saddle company as yet addressed this problem with any effective solution. Also as others said, it will be your own personal search for the best saddle for you. Ken (still searching himself for that "perfect" tri saddle)

I am getting ready for the MS150 ride from Houston to Austin, so I’ve been going on longer rides. My saddle, which was perfectly good for 25 mile rides, gets very uncomfortable for longer rides. Is it just a fact of life that long rides will hurt? Is it possible to find a saddle that is _reasonably_ comfortable to sit on for hours at a time? I’m going to talk with my LBS and see if they can help; I was just wondering if I’m looking for a holy grail or something which can actually be achieved. Thoughts? Vanessa "sore" Smith

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My saddle, which was perfectly good for 25 mile rides, gets very uncomfortable for longer rides. Is it just a fact of life that long rides will hurt? Is it possible to find a saddle that is _reasonably_ comfortable to sit on for hours at a time?

     It is possible!!  Remember, it is just not the saddle, but also saddle adjustment.  have someone assist you w/ for/aft, tilt, skew, and height. Obviously there is no magic formula so what you need is a good start and then some trial and error.       Good LSBs will let you demo a saddle. David Never give up, Be satisfied w/ your best, Do unto others…..

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Keep trying as suggested… the saddles I ride now, different ones for different applications (road,mtn,triathlon) were chosen to keep me comfortable for short and long rides. Certainly try saddles with different amounts of tilt though the knee over pedal is a good rule to follow for fore-aft positioning. Also, expensive saddles don’t equate to comfort for everyone. Some (certainly not all) saddles though do need a period to break in. My Avocet O2 is my favorite road saddle and it took about 1500km before it was nice and gentle on my backside. Cheers, Jason – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Others have written here about sitting on their ischial tuberosities. However, in the aero position you will not be. You will be rotated forward and sittting on the softer places. No saddle company as yet addressed this problem with any effective solution. Also as others said, it will be your own personal search for the best saddle for you. Ken (still searching himself for that "perfect" tri saddle) I am getting ready for the MS150 ride from Houston to Austin, so I’ve been going on longer rides. My saddle, which was perfectly good for 25 mile rides, gets very uncomfortable for longer rides. Is it just a fact of life that long rides will hurt? Is it possible to find a saddle that is _reasonably_ comfortable to sit on for hours at a time? I’m going to talk with my LBS and see if they can help; I was just wondering if I’m looking for a holy grail or something which can actually be achieved. Thoughts? Vanessa "sore" Smith

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Mark,         I use the Serfas Cosmos seat and love it.  Have one on my racing and training bike.                                 DJ (junior triathlete)

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I am looking for a new saddle.  I have a Cannodale R1000 with the stock saddle and am thinking about trying one of the more anatomic saddles.  I have looked at the Specialized Body Geometry comp and the Terry Liberator Fly Saddle but have not ridden either one.  Im just trying to get a saddle that is more comfortable on longer rides.   Any information or recommendations with this saddle would be great. Thanks, Mark Roberts

Before throwing away that saddle, you might want to modify it to see if you can make it to work for you.  Assuming that your stock saddle is the cheaper type with a molded polyethylene shell, you can cut out a relief hole by drilling a series of connecting holes with a hand drill and a pair of tin snips. Here is one that I have so modified: http://www.geocities.com/thoblahbui/saddledrilledandcut.jpg Start with a small cut-out, and increase as you go, esp. if you’re ….generously built; else you may find yourself riding for a few miles with a broken saddle. Tho

Response:

I am looking for a new saddle.  I have a Cannodale R1000 with the stock saddle and am thinking about trying one of the more anatomic saddles.  I have looked at the Specialized Body Geometry comp and the Terry Liberator Fly Saddle but have not ridden either one.  Im just trying to get a saddle that is more comfortable on longer rides.   Any information or recommendations with this saddle would be great.

Let’s start with the basics.  When you sit on a flat surface, your weight is supported by the "sit bones" (Ischial tuberosities) which are part of your pelvis.  This keeps your weight from pressing against the soft tissue (muslces, nerves and blood vessels) in your peri area (perinium- the area between your rectum and your genitals), which is *not* designed to support your weight.  Your sit bones should also be the part of you supporting your weight on a bicycle saddle. Unfortunately, most modern bicycle saddles seem to be designed for very narrow-pelvis individuals.  These saddles may not be wide enough to support your sit bones, with the result that your weight is concentrated on your peri area which results in pain, numbness, etc. An upright sitting position, preferred by many people, only makes matters worse by putting more of your weight on your butt and also rotating your pelvis into a more upright position. For most people, a comfortable saddle is one that’s widen enough to firmly support the sit bones and keep pressure off the perinium.  There are two characteristics of comfortable saddles, actually:  width and flatness.  Overly soft, heavily padded or gel saddles often are more uncomfortable than a firm, wide, flat saddle because the material "bunches up" under the peri area. Here are a few suggestions for wider, flatter saddles: WTB (Wilderness Trail Bikes) SST Brooks B.17 Champion Standard, B.72, B.66, etc (bit not all Brooks saddles; Pro and Swift are narrower) Avocet Air 02 40M (for men) or W (? I think, for women; R is narrower for racing) I have had personal experience with the WTB, Avocet Air 02 40M and the B.17 and Brooks Pro.  I like ‘em all; my favorite is the B.17 which fitted me like a glove from the start, although many people report needing lengthy and uncomfortable break-in periods for these saddles. The WTB is a very firm saddle, looks a little odd but so far I have liked it quite a bit.  I use the Avocet on my folding bike and haven’t had as much experience with it yet, but it has been nice for rides up to 45 miles; I previously had the Racing model which was, for me, an ass-hatchet but I know other people who relly like them. YBMV (you butt may vary) Hope this helps.

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Question:

Hi All,     As with all newer people on the list I am in need of advice.     I sent to Total Immersion for the video. That should be a good start. However if anyone knows of any books about swimming and bicycling please suggest them to me. I am interested in Tri’s but I am only a mortal. I want to gain riding technique and I would be interested in training schedules. Thanks in advance. Ciao CHiL (Charlie in Leesburg) "It’s better to burn out than it is to rust" Neil Young

Response:

 As with all newer people on the list I am in need of advice.    I sent to Total Immersion for the video. That should be a good start. However if anyone knows of any books about swimming and bicycling please suggest them to me. I am interested in Tri’s but I am only a mortal. I want to gain riding technique and I would be interested in training schedules. Thanks in advance.

WE carry several good titles on swimming and triathlons. Based on the information you gave I would recommend the following books: Total Immersion (Book) Additional info than just the video Triathlon 101 by John Mora Triathlete’s Training Bible by Joel Friel Endurance Athlete’s Edge by Marc Evans Timesaving Training For Multisport Athletes by Rick Niles The Essential Swimmer by Steve Tarpinian In Fitness and In Health by Phil Maffetone Training For Endurance by Phil Maffetone You can get descritions for these items from www.swiminfo.com in the Swim Shop. Swimmingly, Michael Collins UCLA Bruin Masters 310-607-9956 x105 http://www.spma.net/uclabruins Visit http://www.swiminfo.com for all your swimming needs Books – Videos – Posters – Equipment –

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Question:

Not possible? Maybe you can’t ride on the road but I’ve seen lots of people do it, including me.  Simply take one foot out of the pedals and pedal with the opposite leg.

I once had to one-leg it for about 25 miles in the Hill Country around Austin, TX. I broke one of those notoriously unreliable Dura-Ace AX cranks and had no other way of getting home (expect perhaps by hitching a ride). The funny thing was, I got into a little race with a couple of other riders, w/ me passing them on the uphills on FM 512, FM 2222, and Loop 360, but then falling behind as they spun past me on every descent. Man, was that one leg tired the next day! Andrew Coggan

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mather callaghan  says… -you can hammer flat out more safely on a trainer than you can on the road. there aren’t any potholes or anything like that to hit when you’re gunning for 50km/h or something.  plus if you fall off your trainer it’s nothing more than a mouthfull of carpet,

Not to mention the embarrassment factor of having to explain the carpet rash on the side of your head. as opposed to a body cast.

AJ (Who agrees with all the previous comments on the subject) — If swimming is so good for the figure, explain whales Simon Haigh Illawarra Triathlon Club – Australia http://members.xoom.com/ajsimon/index.htm   <—- New web site      

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-you can do drills on a trainer.  i remember triathlete mag. doing a thing on this with roch frey a while back.  one-legged drills and things like that just aren’t possible on the road but are still very beneficial. Not possible? Maybe you can’t ride on the road but I’ve seen lots of people

do it, including me.  Simply take one foot out of the pedals and pedal with the opposite leg.   JT

        Another alternative:  rollers.  Maintains some of the bike-handling skills and balance.         Dan T.

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-you can do drills on a trainer.  i remember triathlete mag. doing a thing on this with roch frey a while back.  one-legged drills and things like that just aren’t possible on the road but are still very beneficial.

Not possible? Maybe you can’t ride on the road but I’ve seen lots of people do it, including me.  Simply take one foot out of the pedals and pedal with the opposite leg.   JT

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Preciate the advice everyone. I’m thinking the best thing(safest) is to use the trainer in the core of the off season except maybe weekend group rides. then a couple of weeks before the first tri do completely road workouts to get the auxillary muscles back in gear. I lift too so that should keep those muscles from deteriorating too much. Thanks, Byron – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m thinking of purchasing a trainer to put under the back wheel (not rollers). How much better is it to actually ride than to use the trainer. The roads are starting to scare me a little and think it might be better to ride indoors except on race days. Thanks, Byron I just got back from doing Ironman New Zealand. After doing about 95% of the bike indoors on the Computrainer, then being asked to ride 112 miles in the race, brought up some interesting realizations: 1) The indoor trainer does work on maintaining your core fitness on the bike. I did the 112 miles in a tad less than 20MPH, which I feel is pretty respectable from a person doing his bike workouts indoors. 2) Despite the good news above I found my bike handling skills lacking. I’ve seen this for about a week every year when I switch from indoors to outdoors. Not being able to be comfortable on the bike during turns and such is pretty critical from my standpoint. It is very important to develop and re-develop these skills from a safety standpoint. 3) During the race, I found the subtle nuances of bike riding lacking as well. I had no climbing power for the hills, didn’t have much energy to surge past people who were just slightly slower than me on the course, etc. Although I could probably adjust my indoor program to handle these ineffeciences, I find that I can do these much more naturally in a outdoor setting then on a trainer. 4)Intangibles. After several months on the trainer I find myself yearning to go out again. I can’t see myself relying solely on the indoor trainer for months at a time. It’s boring! One reason I love to ride is to be outdoors. From a fitness standpoint, the trainer can be a great  offseason/winter tool, or a great way to compliment your outdoor riding during the racing season. But, after these observations I recommend not to use the trainer as the only method for riding. Hope this helps.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMNZ, IMC ‘99 IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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i don’t have a trainer myself, but there are a few benefits that didn’t get mentioned that i feel i should throw out there for consideration.  first off i’ll say that i agree with everything said above — i just plain love cycling and all of the things associated (wind on your face, the sunshine, the scenery, the pavement zipping by) all goes out the window with a trainer.  BUT…. -on a trainer, you never get intersections, traffic, dogs, turns, etc.  it’s a pure quality workout.  it’s ideal for intervals or whatever else in which you need to go hard for a certain period and recover for a certain period regardless of what the road’s doing. -you can hammer flat out more safely on a trainer than you can on the road. there aren’t any potholes or anything like that to hit when you’re gunning for 50km/h or something.  plus if you fall off your trainer it’s nothing more than a mouthfull of carpet, as opposed to a body cast. -you can do drills on a trainer.  i remember triathlete mag. doing a thing on this with roch frey a while back.  one-legged drills and things like that just aren’t possible on the road but are still very beneficial. all this considered, i’d say that trainers are fine within their field — usefull for certain things.  in a perfect world, we’d be able to ride safely and enjoyably on the roads all the time, but living in canada i know what it’s like to be shut in several months each year.  so some times, a trainer’s not just the best choice, but the only choice. i’ll still take the road, though. my 2 cents, mike callaghan

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I’m thinking of purchasing a trainer to put under the back wheel (not rollers). How much better is it to actually ride than to use the trainer. The roads are starting to scare me a little and think it might be better to ride indoors except on race days. Thanks, Byron

Response:

I’m thinking of purchasing a trainer to put under the back wheel (not rollers). How much better is it to actually ride than to use the trainer. The roads are starting to scare me a little and think it might be better to ride indoors except on race days. Thanks, Byron

I just got back from doing Ironman New Zealand. After doing about 95% of the bike indoors on the Computrainer, then being asked to ride 112 miles in the race, brought up some interesting realizations: 1) The indoor trainer does work on maintaining your core fitness on the bike. I did the 112 miles in a tad less than 20MPH, which I feel is pretty respectable from a person doing his bike workouts indoors. 2) Despite the good news above I found my bike handling skills lacking. I’ve seen this for about a week every year when I switch from indoors to outdoors. Not being able to be comfortable on the bike during turns and such is pretty critical from my standpoint. It is very important to develop and re-develop these skills from a safety standpoint. 3) During the race, I found the subtle nuances of bike riding lacking as well. I had no climbing power for the hills, didn’t have much energy to surge past people who were just slightly slower than me on the course, etc. Although I could probably adjust my indoor program to handle these ineffeciences, I find that I can do these much more naturally in a outdoor setting then on a trainer. 4)Intangibles. After several months on the trainer I find myself yearning to go out again. I can’t see myself relying solely on the indoor trainer for months at a time. It’s boring! One reason I love to ride is to be outdoors. From a fitness standpoint, the trainer can be a great  offseason/winter tool, or a great way to compliment your outdoor riding during the racing season. But, after these observations I recommend not to use the trainer as the only method for riding. Hope this helps.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMNZ, IMC ‘99 IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

Response:

Pete, Interesting observations and I would concur in almost everyway. For years I was very much anti-trainer. In the winter I cross-country skiied and put the bike away for 3 – 4 months. Now, with less time to ski and less time to train over all, I have started to use the trainer more and more in the last two years. To be in top form, you need to put in the miles outdoors on the road. I have come to the conclusions that nothing can beat "real" cycling. However, the right kinds of indoor work-outs on stationary trainers can maintain a certain level of core or base fitness that will allow one to achieve a certain level of performance. Steve Fleck – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just got back from doing Ironman New Zealand. After doing about 95% of the bike indoors on the Computrainer, then being asked to ride 112 miles in the race, brought up some interesting realizations: 1) The indoor trainer does work on maintaining your core fitness on the bike. I did the 112 miles in a tad less than 20MPH, which I feel is pretty respectable from a person doing his bike workouts indoors. 2) Despite the good news above I found my bike handling skills lacking. I’ve seen this for about a week every year when I switch from indoors to outdoors. Not being able to be comfortable on the bike during turns and such is pretty critical from my standpoint. It is very important to develop and re-develop these skills from a safety standpoint. 3) During the race, I found the subtle nuances of bike riding lacking as well. I had no climbing power for the hills, didn’t have much energy to surge past people who were just slightly slower than me on the course, etc. Although I could probably adjust my indoor program to handle these ineffeciences, I find that I can do these much more naturally in a outdoor setting then on a trainer. 4)Intangibles. After several months on the trainer I find myself yearning to go out again. I can’t see myself relying solely on the indoor trainer for months at a time. It’s boring! One reason I love to ride is to be outdoors. From a fitness standpoint, the trainer can be a great  offseason/winter tool, or a great way to compliment your outdoor riding during the racing season. But, after these observations I recommend not to use the trainer as the only method for riding. Hope this helps.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMNZ, IMC ‘99 IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

Response:

I agree with the points below. Sometime back I tried the 3D computrainer at an expo. Good workout, and I worked up a decent sweat. But it wasnt like -biking-. A running equivalent would be hiking with a heavy backpack. Towards the end of the session, the company rep jokingly said something to the effect of – there’s the finish line, sprint for it. I took him literally and that was the biggest comedown. You know! when you get up off the saddle, rock the bike and accelerate. No! Not the same thing. And the same with hills, down as well as up. There are definite benefits I am sure. I know I could do with some ability to sustain speed on the flats, and a trainer would probably help. But it isnt the same thing. Though… your (Byron) point about the roads being scary is quite right. Perhaps the biggest (only?) reason to get a trainer. Still, making it the exclusive bike training sounds unreasonable, especially if you intend to use aerobars. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m thinking of purchasing a trainer to put under the back wheel (not rollers). How much better is it to actually ride than to use the trainer. The roads are starting to scare me a little and think it might be better to ride indoors except on race days. Thanks, Byron <snip 3) During the race, I found the subtle nuances of bike riding lacking as well. I had no climbing power for the hills, didn’t have much energy to surge past people who were just slightly slower than me on the course, etc. Although I could probably adjust my indoor program to handle these ineffeciences, I find that I can do these much more naturally in a outdoor setting then on a trainer.

Response:

I just got back from doing Ironman New Zealand. After doing about 95% of the bike indoors on the Computrainer, then being asked to ride 112 miles in the race, brought up some interesting realizations: 1) The indoor trainer does work on maintaining your core fitness on the bike.

Agreed. 2) Despite the good news above I found my bike handling skills lacking. I’ve seen this for about a week every year when I switch from indoors to outdoors.

Agreed. One possibility would be to alternate trainer and roller workouts, although that means more $$ and equipment, and only partially address the problem. 3) During the race, I found the subtle nuances of bike riding lacking as well. I had no climbing power for the hills, didn’t have much energy to surge past people who were just slightly slower than me on the course, etc. Although I could probably adjust my indoor program to handle these ineffeciences, I find that I can do these much more naturally in a outdoor setting then on a trainer.

Again, I concur – with a trainer or ergometer you have to deliberately work on things that you are automatically forced to do when cycling outdoors. Riding a trainer for only an hour or so also doesn’t do much to condition all the ancillary muscles that are used during long races – I once jumped into a district road race championship (121 miles) with only about one hour a day of stationary bike training under my belt (and on a borrowed bike, since mine had been stolen about 6 months before). I was sufficiently fit that I almost stole the race, but boy, did I pay a price – my neck, hands, feet, back, etc., were killing me afterwards because I wasn’t used to riding a bike for 5-6 hours while wearing helmet, cycling shoes, etc. Of course, for those of us with time constraints that prevent outdoor cycling except on weekends and/or lengthy summer days, a trainer is about the only alternative…. Andrew Coggan

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Question:

Wobbet: I think the main thing to consider in training for the longer distance events is to know that you are able to do those distances.  In other words, you should be able to do any section of those longer races during training.  The only way to do that is really just to spend the time to do so.  In my first year of doing tris, I’ve been able to initially do a sprint triathlon to olympic distance and even a 1/2 ironman without much trouble.  I personally just increased my distance from the sprint early in the season to the 1/2 IM and did a lot of olympic distance races before and after.  One thing you touched upon is wanting to know what it takes to finish (and not perform).  I think for the longer races, especially the 1/2 IM, that it is part psychological.  You need to believe that you can do the distance and you need to train your mind/body to do so.  Everybody has their own formula for getting ready, and there are some plans available that you can get.  It might take some experimentation, but you are probably the best judge of how you feel. As for a tri specific bike, I did fine this whole year (sprint to 1/2 IM) on a road bike (Trek 5200) with no problems.  My legs did feel kind of funky after the biking portion, but that wore off after a little bit in the run.  If you have the money, plan to stay doing tris for a while, want a new toy, etc., then by all means, consider buying a tri-specific bike. Hope that helps. That’s my two cents.  If you need any other info, let me know. Kendall – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have been doing one sprint tri a year for the past four years and have finally decided to upgrade my efforts. my goals for the next few years are as follows: 1999 – 2-4 olympic distance + my annual sprint 2000 – 2-4 olympic, 1 1/2 IM, + sprint after i finish the 1/2 IM my wife i will decide whether or not i have the time and the motivation to train for a full IM in 2001. my first questions about gearing up for this are: 1) how much time is needed to train in order to finish the olympic distance and still feel good physically. i am not going for a top finish, probably about 3-3.5 hours. 2) same question for the 1/2 IM. desired finish time in the 6-6.5 hour range. i am a decent swimmer (can swim 2:00/100m for a decent period of time), not spectacular rider (18-20 mph during tri on flat course), not spectacular runner (8:30/mile on a dedicated 10k). i am planning on improving my times, but want an idea of what it takes to finish, not to perform. my second question is – i will be doing a majority of my riding with some non-tri friends and i am planning on sticking with my road bike and aero bars for riding the tris for a good while. but, i have thought about buying a tri bike for the future. at what threshold (number of races, number of races at what distance, coolness of buying a new toy, etc.) should i start to seriously consider a tri specific bike? thanks, wobbet

Response:

i have been doing one sprint tri a year for the past four years and have finally decided to upgrade my efforts. my goals for the next few years are as follows: 1999 – 2-4 olympic distance + my annual sprint 2000 – 2-4 olympic, 1 1/2 IM, + sprint after i finish the 1/2 IM my wife i will decide whether or not i have the time and the motivation to train for a full IM in 2001. my first questions about gearing up for this are: 1) how much time is needed to train in order to finish the olympic distance and still feel good physically. i am not going for a top finish, probably about 3-3.5 hours. 2) same question for the 1/2 IM. desired finish time in the 6-6.5 hour range. i am a decent swimmer (can swim 2:00/100m for a decent period of time), not spectacular rider (18-20 mph during tri on flat course), not spectacular runner (8:30/mile on a dedicated 10k). i am planning on improving my times, but want an idea of what it takes to finish, not to perform. my second question is – i will be doing a majority of my riding with some non-tri friends and i am planning on sticking with my road bike and aero bars for riding the tris for a good while. but, i have thought about buying a tri bike for the future. at what threshold (number of races, number of races at what distance, coolness of buying a new toy, etc.) should i start to seriously consider a tri specific bike? thanks, wobbet

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Question:

I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance.

Response:

DS Trainers are what I use.  I alternate with Shimanos, run 60 to 80 miles a week, mid foot strike, and weigh 165.  Never had a problem (with the shoes). They wear well, are relative light, very flexible, and comfortable.  Only complaint is that I can’t seem to get them to go fast enough to break any world records, but that may not be the shoes fault!

I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance.

Response:

Last years model was great. Find it if you can. "The running machine is broken…and that’s the bottom line!" —     O —  <^_ — / —–

Response:

I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance.

I like the DS Trainers (current and last 2 models) better than the 2020’s.  I actually find the current orange/white/green model to be better cushioned than the 2020’s and wider in the toe box.  In addition, the Trainers outersole seems to hold up better than that of the 2020’s. Ron

Response:

I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance.

I got a pair of DS trainers about 100 miles back, so I can’t tell you how long they will last.  They are now my favorite shoe, after replacing the original insole right away.  I transitioned from 2020’s and found them to be very good for me, except for the original insole, which I’ve found to be very cheap in all Asics since my 2001’s.  I have a  narrow heel, wide fore-foot, slight pronation, and weigh 185, and the DST’s have almost perfect cushioning and stability for me, so far.  I’ve been told that the DST’s may break down faster than the 2020-2030 types, especialy with my weight.  I guess time will tell. Rusty Southwood CMRA#342

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I just the bought the DST’s yesterday and went for a run right after.  I only went about 3 miles for I am trying to get back into tri-shape after 4 months off.  The guy at the store said if comparing these to the Nike Air Max Triax, (I know, a lot of people don’t like them.  Please don’t hurt me.) the DST’s wear out about 50-100 miles faster.  Not a big deal in my book, but worth noting for the comparison people.         So far, the one test run gave good cushioning, decent stability and a LIGHT shoe (~10.5 oz).  I think it will do the trick for me. Howie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance. I got a pair of DS trainers about 100 miles back, so I can’t tell you how long they will last.  They are now my favorite shoe, after replacing the original insole right away.  I transitioned from 2020’s and found them to be very good for me, except for the original insole, which I’ve found to be very cheap in all Asics since my 2001’s.  I have a  narrow heel, wide fore-foot, slight pronation, and weigh 185, and the DST’s have almost perfect cushioning and stability for me, so far.  I’ve been told that the DST’s may break down faster than the 2020-2030 types, especialy with my weight.  I guess time will tell. Rusty Southwood CMRA#342

Howie "Triathlon is not life.  It is a game to use to test your personal limits, not your personal worth.  Enjoy yourself when you train and race." -Sue Latshaw, Perennial top-10 Ironman finisher

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Can anybody tell me approximate cost of the DS Trainer and where in Nova

Scotia I might buy some? THanks, John

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Had to try out the running figure:-)) ___  O __  <^_ __  V _____

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I’m thinking of buying the ds-trainer now that the gt 2020 is discontinued and I don’t care for it’s replacement. I’m 140 lbs.,  a mid-foot striker, and I need a daily training shoe to train for a marathon in the spring. I run about 35-40 miles weekly. Any opinions on this shoe? Thanks in advance. I like the shoe.  There’s an unusual way to tie the laces.  I had one pair on which the top eyelet of one shoe came off, and the store from which I bought it replaced the pair and showed me the trick.  You run the lace straight up through the top two eyelets, the red ones, and use the resulting lace connection between those two eyelets as the final eyelet for the opposite lace.  You can play with that to get a good tight fit (which I prefer) and it reduces the strain on the top eyelets themselves.  It’s difficult to describe, and you may already know it, but once you figure it out, it’s easy. Regards, Joe Garland

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lace connection between those two eyelets as the final eyelet for the opposite lace.  You can play with that to get a good tight fit (which I prefer) and it reduces the strain on the top eyelets themselves.  It’s difficult to describe, and you may already know it, but once you figure it out, it’s easy. Regards, Joe Garland

Joe that is an alternate lacing method we show to a lot of our customers. It works best with that extra eyelet put up in the collar of a lot of the shoes. It then works to cinch the shoe and stop heel slipage. Have a great day, Jerry Tel-a-Runner, Inc. 1-800-835-2786 http://www.telarun.com

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I did buy these shooes about 2 years ago. They costed about 800FF ($120) in France. They are very good shooes, but they dured very few time (about 800 kms, when my other running-shooes dure 1500-2000 kms) Sorry if my english level is bad… Nicolas GRINNAERT, from France Marathon de Paris 24/04/94           : 5h22′53" Marathon des Hauts de Seine 12/11/95 : 4h46′52" Marathon de Paris 05/04/98           : en pr

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  Several texts on training (Training Distance Runners by P. Coe and D. Martin, or to mention a recent one In fitness and in Health by P. Maffetone) recommend a period of several month of strictly aerobic training, what we usually refer to as base work (to be correct Coe & Martin recommend something like 1 workout below AT / month during this period)   For a weak swimmer like me this is a problem. I need to work on my technique, esp. body position, which puts me quite close to AT. Lately I’ve noticed that after 2 out of 3 swimming sessions I’m down with a cold for 1 day (bye bye schedule) while running and biking (indoors) is fine.   Should I cut down to 2 or 1 swimsess./week and try to keep the pace or use a buoy to do arms and legs separately and lower the pace to something more aerobic? Any advice ? jarek

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Jarek: Great insight about how poor technique handicaps a triathlete (who does not have a formal swim bkgrnd) from following the conventional swim training recommendations. So many people who advise triathletes to follow a "cookbook" training sked (X parts AT, X part VO2max, etc) for swimming just as they do with running and biking, don’t realize that if your basic swim skills aren’t good, workouts don’t work. I teach hundreds of triathletes a year at Total Immersion Adult Swim Camps that they have to turn their swim "workouts" into swimming "practices" and they have to practice proper technique. I tell them that fitness is something that happens to you while you’re practicing technique. You do it through drills and "effective" swimming — stroke counting, minus cycle swimming, mixed drill-swim sets, etc. most of it set up on intervals similar to swim sets, but with different intentions than simply working the CV system. I don’t know how to send you info by E-mail, but if you send your address or fax# to me by E-mail I can send you a booklet of drills to do. Everyone who has adopted this system has improved dramatically over the results they’d been getting by just working out.

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  Several texts on training (Training Distance Runners by P. Coe and D. Martin, or to mention a recent one In fitness and in Health by P. Maffetone) recommend a period of several month of strictly aerobic training, what we usually refer to as base work (to be correct Coe & Martin recommend something like 1 workout below AT / month during this period)   For a weak swimmer like me this is a problem. I need to work on my technique, esp. body position, which puts me quite close to AT. Lately I’ve noticed that after 2 out of 3 swimming sessions I’m down with a cold for 1 day (bye bye schedule) while running and biking (indoors) is fine….

It sounds like you need to learn to relax when you swim (which by the way is the key to swimming fast).  If you are truly doing technique work, you shouldn’t get close to your AT.  My first reaction is that you are breathing incorrectly.  Two common breathing mistakes are 1) not exhaling underwater and 2) taking too big of breathes.  By doing either 1) and/or 2) you tend to approach hyperventilation quickly and subsequently push your heart rate sky-high.  The simple remedy is to think "breathe easy and breathe often".   Hope this helps!  If I’m off the mark, email me a more detailed description. Pat —    W.Patrick Brug, Ph.D.  _-           -_    Los Alamos National Lab -__       __-                                       /    cis:      72410,3372        /  

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Luberek) writes:

<<<I need to work on my technique, esp. body position, which puts me quite close to AT. Lately I’ve noticed that after 2 out of 3 swimming sessions I’m down with a cold for 1 day (bye bye schedule) while running and biking (indoors) is fine.  Should I cut down to 2 or 1 swimsess./week and try to keep the pace or use a buoy to do arms and legs separately and lower the pace to something more aerobic? Without knowing anything else about you, consider using a heart monitor in your swim sessions but stay aerobic. If you do this, and nothing is metabolically wrong, 2-3 swims a week shouldn’t be a problem. It also sound like you need to build more base. Just my opinion. Philip Maffetone

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Question:

I agree with Rolf. I ride with bike racers (aka "bikies") twice a week at lunch.  It’s a good speed workout and sure beats going out head-down-and-solo. I encourage folks to give some bike races a try.  I’m a "top 3rd" finisher in an international distance tri and I can go out and win the typical local "citizens" bike race. For example, I participated in the State Timetrail  Championships this past weekend  here in  Colorado.  I did  the 40k in  58:29.  I won the  citizens class in my age and here is where I would have placed in the  Catagories if I had a cycling license:    Cat 5       1st    Cat 4       5 out of 28    Cat 3       17 out of 29    Cat 1/2/pro 20 out of 21 My specialty in tris is cycling so your mileage may vary . . . — LSC

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I think I have more fun learning new training methods than racing sometimes.  I am a triathlete, but I thought the experience of riding with purist cyclists would be fun to share.   —– This insane idea gripped me, and it became an insane reality this week.  I rode with an A+++ ride of a local cycling club.  I went in with humble attitude.  "I’m a triathlete and you guys need to tell me what to do/ not to do, etc…." Well, to be safe I sat in the back of the line (12 of us) for the first few miles.  Suddenly I realized the line was about 200 yards ahead and I was sitting behind a slowpoke.  I dropped him and caught the group. Rule #1:  Keep contact with the fast guys. The lead rider called a right turn so I jumped right immediately, only to find myself having turned early onto a deadend street.  A furious sprint and I caught the line again. Rule #2:  Follow the leader and pay attention.   The pace quickened to a hefty 28-30 mph SUSTAINED.  Now, I am strong cyclist, but in the draft line tucked in tight I was huffing pretty good.  The end of the line was loose and ragged, caused by a nervous rider ahead.  I soon figured out that I needed to move up and maintain a clean line. Rule #3:  Keep bike path straight and predictable. I was now in the third position behind two guys on tribars.  I was tempted to attack (??? right term ???) and drop them, but I figured, hey I am a triathlete too, so I’ll just suck wheel for, oh, another 15 miles or so.   Rule #4:  When near the front, take your pull or you’ll piss people off. Towards the end of the ride I felt fine and fresh in the legs.  Guys attacked every now and then, but I stayed with each one of them.  It was kind of fun. Around corners I remembered the basics: Rule #5:  Approach a corner wide, take it tight and accelerate out. At the end of the ride I outsprinted my two triathlete buddies to the "finish".  The benefit of having drafted for 28.5 miles.  Their response? "We didn’t see you up front."  OK.  I got the message.  See Rule #4. After the ride, the "purists" asked me to ride with them again.  I took it as a very big compliment. Rule #6:  Ride with confidence, not arrogance. I am eagerly awaiting my next ride with them.  It was coooollll man. Pedalin’ fool in NJ, Rolf Arands

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