FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE SACRAMENTO, Calif. — James Raia, who has been reporting on endurance sports for nearly 25 years, has begun writing and publishing the free electronic magazine, Endurance Sports Newsletter (ESN). The twice-monthly publication, which includes articles on long-distance running, cycling, triathlon as well as travel and human-interest topics, is free. It is distributed via e-mail every other Monday morning. The first issue of ESN, Vol. 2 was published Aug. 20. A former straff writer for three daily newspapers, Raia has been a freelance writer since 1987. He contributes endurance sports articles to numerous regional, national and internatonal publications and news organizations, including Associated Press, Reuters, USA Today, Los Angeles Times Syndicate, Runner’s World as well as several airline and specialty magazines. He has written the syndicated running and fitness column On Pace since 1989. In addition to reporting on such events as the Tour de France, Hawaiian Ironman Triathlon World Championship, World Cycling Championships and Winter Olympics, Raia is a middle-of-the-pack runner who has completed more than 60 marathons and ultramarathons. The newsletter is an "opt-in" publication. In other words, you receive it only if you subscribe. To subscribe to ESN, visit the link: http://www.topica.com/lists/endurance or send a blank e-mail to: For more information, contact James Raia, 2301 J St. #205, Sacramento, Calif., 95816; Tel. (916) 448-5122; E-mail: ***
All the best with your newsletter! — In health and on the run, Ozzie Gontang Maintainer – rec.running FAQ http://www.faqs.org/faqs/by-newsgroup/rec/rec.running.html Director, San Diego Marathon Clinic, est. 1975 Mindful Running http://www.mindfulness.com/mr.asp
Hi, Does anyone know of a site which will tell me what events are going on in France please? thanks
Try these sites: http://www.space-management.com/, http://fr.dir.yahoo.com/sports_et_loisirs/Sports/Course_a_pied/ http://www.courirenfrance.com/. Ken Hi, Does anyone know of a site which will tell me what events are going on in France please? thanks
Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html
OK, I’ll bite. What’s an omnium?
A "stage race" (really a multiple race series) that uses points instead of time to determine general classification. In a real stage race, once you have established a time gap, you just need to mark those near you on time to win. In an omnium you have to be pretty consistent about scoring points in every race. — Todd Rowell Institut f
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage? I thought it was one of the best pieces of sports coverage I have ever seen.
I taped it, watched it, watched again. Even my wife found it interesting enough to avoid saying "Oh no, you’re not going to watch that marathon again." I liked how they could make an otherwise longish and somewhat boring competition into the most interesting coverage of the year (even outdoing this year’s Boston, Chicago and NYCM coverages).
It seemed like they put a lot of creativity into the broadcast. Of course, Chicago and the others were aired as a live events (more or less), so they didn’t have a whole lot of time to get creative. Following all the stories associated with the various athletes was very interesting. When the Hoyts cross the finish line it puts a smile on my face and a tear in my eye every time I watch it. Spectacular! -Phil
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage? I thought it was one of the best pieces of sports coverage I have ever seen.
Agree 100%. Damn Oleg, there goes that stereotype of the heartless Russian eating their children alive. :) Not a big fan of triathlons (not yet), but I watched it with my brother who is a serious biker and triathlete, and he was just glued to the screen. Despite an obvious Boston bias of the coverage (Hoyts, Smyers
There is something about the Hoyts that is truly inspiring. and that mother of 5), I liked how they could make an otherwise longish and somewhat boring competition into the most interesting coverage of the year (even outdoing this year’s Boston, Chicago and NYCM coverages). Just my 2 roubles.
Add a few pennies… — Caveat Lector!
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage?
I’ve taped it the last couple of years. Real motivator. How about knocking out a 2:41 marathon after swimming 2.4 miles and biking 112, unreal.
I heard it was horrible coverage. Just fluff stories and they didn’t show the marathon.
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage? I’ve taped it the last couple of years. Real motivator. How about knocking out a 2:41 marathon after swimming 2.4 miles and biking 112, unreal.
Does anybody have any data about how a top level Ironman cat triathlete would fare in a marathon? I am thinking about some of the best runners like Van Lierde, Peter Reid … The guys that can do 2.35 to 2.45 after the swimming and cycling. Can these guys touch 2.15-2.25?
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage? I thought it was one of the best pieces of sports coverage I have ever seen.
It was one of the better coverages of IMH they’ve done. The consensus among net-triathletes is that they finally gave age groupers some decent coverage. They usually don’t. One personally interesting note – remember when they DQ’d the lead bike for following the camera truck? I was wondering if the ref was going to catch hell. Well the ref is a net acquaintance who I’ve met at a few races – Charlie Crawford. Charlie is one of the most respected (and tough and fair) refs in the game. He’s one of very few who could have done that without any qualms. He was assigned the job of monitoring the lead pack for just that reason. Cool. As inspiring as the Hoyt’s are, I was not happy to see them bend the rules to let them continue on the run. They were a full 1 1/2 hours off the bike cut off. Other non-celebrities who missed the cut-off by a few minutes were not allowed to continue. If I was one of them, I’d be pretty upset. I liked how they could make an otherwise longish and somewhat boring competition into the most interesting coverage of the year (even outdoing this year’s Boston, Chicago and NYCM coverages).
That’s one of the benefits of not covering it live (it was run in October). Lots of time to edit the tapes to fit the outcome. Triathlon is the ultimate non-spectator sport. I have no idea why anyone would watch a live race – especially an IM. My wife refuses to go and I don’t blame her. You have the start, which is sort of cool, then you watch this mass of unidentifiable swim caps move slowly around a course for an hour or an hour and a half. You catch a brief glimpse of the person you know as they come out of the water, then they disappear on the bike for 5-7 hours. If the run course isn’t looped, you see them again at the start of the run, then at the finish 4-5 hours later. And then what you’re left with is a dehydrated, smelly, exhausted, incoherent zombie who is grinning from ear to ear and babbling like an idiot. Mike "Been there" Tennent "IronPenguin" Ironman Canada ‘98 16:17:03 Great Floridian ‘99, 17:13:38
: One personally interesting note – remember when they DQ’d the lead : bike for following the camera truck? I was wondering if the ref was : going to catch hell. Well the ref is a net acquaintance who I’ve met : at a few races – Charlie Crawford. Charlie is one of the most : respected (and tough and fair) refs in the game. He’s one of very few : who could have done that without any qualms. He was assigned the job : of monitoring the lead pack for just that reason. Cool. hehe, either Mike is alive or Jenn killed him and broke into his account. I was wondering about that DQ also – they didn’t say much, and it seemed he got punished for something he did quite a few miles ago. He also got DQ the moment he became the leader. In a way it was the most tragic moment of the whole Ironman. Could you imagine being that belgian guy? — Oleg
Maybe 2:20-2:25 for the best runner/triathletes. 2:15 is a whole ‘nother ballgame.
Good to see you back, Mike! Jean S.
Oleg: As Charlie has explained elsewhere, the TV coverage was discontinuous, so you don’t get a full sense of the infraction from watching. Lothar Leder was actually penalized (the second, disqualifying time) for riding to the left side of the lane for an extended period. (This may seem to be an odd rule to runners, but it has an important purpose.) Incidentally, Charlie did not issue the first penalty; happily, I didn’t either. For those of you who don’t know about the arcana of triathlon, there is a very particular set of rules for the bike leg that is designed to provide fair and safe competition (no drafting, blocking of passes, right-side passing, etc.). More than 20 certified USA Triathlon officials patrolled the bike portion of Ironman Hawaii, and we issued fewer penalties this year than any year since the present system was put in place. To see so many very capable competitors race so cleanly was a real pleasure. David (USAT Cat. 3 official) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : One personally interesting note – remember when they DQ’d the lead : bike for following the camera truck? I was wondering if the ref was : going to catch hell. Well the ref is a net acquaintance who I’ve met : at a few races – Charlie Crawford. Charlie is one of the most : respected (and tough and fair) refs in the game. He’s one of very few : who could have done that without any qualms. He was assigned the job : of monitoring the lead pack for just that reason. Cool. hehe, either Mike is alive or Jenn killed him and broke into his account. I was wondering about that DQ also – they didn’t say much, and it seemed he got punished for something he did quite a few miles ago. He also got DQ the moment he became the leader. In a way it was the most tragic moment of the whole Ironman. Could you imagine being that belgian guy? — Oleg
hehe, either Mike is alive or Jenn killed him and broke into his account.
She’s high maintenance not violent…..I think?…. I was wondering about that DQ also – they didn’t say much, and it seemed he got punished for something he did quite a few miles ago. He also got DQ the moment he became the leader. In a way it was the most tragic moment of the whole Ironman. Could you imagine being that belgian guy?
Mike, since you’re close to the sport and the course road guard, could you shed a little more light on the infraction? I’m trying to assume he was not so dense that he thought he could draft off the photographers vehicle… Welcome back. Brother Indy has been is state of depression. :) — Caveat Lector!
Oleg: As Charlie has explained elsewhere, the TV coverage was discontinuous, so you don’t get a full sense of the infraction from watching. Lothar Leder was actually penalized (the second, disqualifying time) for riding to the left side of the lane for an extended period. (This may seem to be an odd rule to runners, but it has an important purpose.) Incidentally, Charlie did not issue the first penalty; happily, I didn’t either.
So what is the purpose of this rule? I thought it was just to avoid blocking the pasage of other ciclists. I cannot not see how riding on the left of the lane can create any danger specially when you are on the lead or far from anybody else. (that seem ed to be the case with Lothar).
In this specific case, Leder was moving to his left in order to draft off of race-vehicles. He was warned (and I think flagged for it), and got DQed after already having been penalized.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Oleg: As Charlie has explained elsewhere, the TV coverage was discontinuous, so you don’t get a full sense of the infraction from watching. Lothar Leder was actually penalized (the second, disqualifying time) for riding to the left side of the lane for an extended period. (This may seem to be an odd rule to runners, but it has an important purpose.) Incidentally, Charlie did not issue the first penalty; happily, I didn’t either. So what is the purpose of this rule? I thought it was just to avoid blocking the pasage of other ciclists. I cannot not see how riding on the left of the lane can create any danger specially when you are on the lead or far from anybody else. (that seem ed to be the case with Lothar).
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Oleg: As Charlie has explained elsewhere, the TV coverage was discontinuous, so you don’t get a full sense of the infraction from watching. Lothar Leder was actually penalized (the second, disqualifying time) for riding to the left side of the lane for an extended period. (This may seem to be an odd rule to runners, but it has an important purpose.) Incidentally, Charlie did not issue the first penalty; happily, I didn’t either. So what is the purpose of this rule? I thought it was just to avoid blocking the pasage of other ciclists. I cannot not see how riding on the left of the lane can create any danger specially when you are on the lead or far from anybody else. (that seem ed to be the case with Lothar).
I can’t comment on the intent of the rulemakers, as I have had no involvement in the development of triathlon rules. But from my perspective, and as you’ve noted, the primary purpose is to prevent blocking. Secondarily, it prevents an overtaking rider from having to choose between passing over the centerline or on the right, both of which are illegal (and dangerous). Other considerations: As is the case with most triathlons, the Hawaii bike course is not closed to vehicular traffic; the lane must be shared with everything from camera crews to tour buses. Also, riding to the right prevents cyclists from shortening large-radius lefthand corners by riding to the inside of the curve. I should have made it clear in my previous post that Leder must have ridden to the left for longer than 15 seconds ("an extended period") for this penalty to have been imposed. Brief excursions are permitted. David (USA Triathlon official)
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage? I thought it was one of the best pieces of sports coverage I have ever seen. Not a big fan of triathlons (not yet), but I watched it with my brother who is a serious biker and triathlete, and he was just glued to the screen. Despite an obvious Boston bias of the coverage (Hoyts, Smyers and that mother of 5), I liked how they could make an otherwise longish and somewhat boring competition into the most interesting coverage of the year (even outdoing this year’s Boston, Chicago and NYCM coverages). Just my 2 roubles. — Oleg
Did anyone else watch Ironman Hawaii coverage?
Yes! I thought it was one of the best pieces of sports coverage I have ever seen.
I did too, although I have been hearing from triathlete friends that the coverage seemed a little too ‘human interest’ to them. I think this could be the equivelent of my wanting to see more ‘average’ marathoners and not the extreme ends of the spectrum. Not a big fan of triathlons (not yet), but I watched it with my brother who is a serious biker and triathlete, and he was just glued to the screen. Despite an obvious Boston bias of the coverage (Hoyts, Smyers and that mother of 5), I liked how they could make an otherwise longish and somewhat boring competition into the most interesting coverage of the year (even outdoing this year’s Boston, Chicago and NYCM coverages). Just my 2 roubles.
I don’t think I’ll ever get tired of seeing the Hoyts in these televised events. I have spoken to these guys a few times (earlier Bostons) and I am always inspired by the attitudes of both Dick and his son. Now, *that’s* hard work! (right Indy?) I have raced marathons, cycle-raced 100 miles (forget the 2.4 swim 
) and I have a lot of respect for people who can put it all together like that! — … tramps like us, Before you buy.
A smoking and a non smoking section is kinda like a peeing and a non peeing section in the pool if it’s not in two completely separate rooms. I walk into a restaurant now and notice if someone in the far corner is smoking, and don’t think twice about going else where if there isn’t a smoke free area. Joel — Joel Sylvester Longest Day ‘98 12:10:33 Me: www.roe.ac.uk/jswww/ Edinburgh Triathletes: www.edintri.u-net.com
– Achim Wilfried Heinle
I’d be interested to know if the current practise in places that have clamped down on smoking is working, ie the numbers of smokers is going down. On my trips to California I’ve enjoyed the smoke free atmosphere in workplaces, restaurants and bars, especially in LA where the air seems cleaner inside than outside. I understand that advertising has been banned in Sweden. I’ve noticed in the UK that over the past 10 years or so smoking has become less and less socially acceptable, and I’ve become less and less tolerant of it as a result. I walk into a restaurant now and notice if someone in the far corner is smoking, and don’t think twice about going else where if there isn’t a smoke free area. I return from an evening out, and I strip off in the hall, the clothes go straight in the washing machine, and I have a shower before I go to bed so the smell of smoke doesn’t get in to the bedroom. There are more and more smoke free restaurants and even pubs. Whether people are giving up or not, my own environment is becoming far more pleasent and healthy. But I don’t think the figures in the UK show that the actual number of smokers is going down. I’m all for banning cigarette advertising and sponsorship, outlawing it in public places and taxing it to death. But I wonder if in countries which are taking the lead against smoking, people are simply retreating to their own homes or actually giving up. – Looking forward to the club Christmas meal and disco. Lots of food, booze, gossip, dancing and NO SMOKE! Joel — Joel Sylvester Longest Day ‘98 12:10:33 Me: www.roe.ac.uk/jswww/ Edinburgh Triathletes: www.edintri.u-net.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
While I support the concept of enough people making the personal choice to eschew tobacco that farmers find themselves switching to other produce which has a better market, I find it sad that so many people subscribe to the "it’s bad, let’s outlaw it", whatever "it" is. You have not only personal choice, but a responsibility to choose wisely. You have the opportunity to influence your children and friends. Frankly, I consider the laws to save us from ourselves to be worse that nuisances, but rather an erosion of the principle of freedoms in life. Just as the (US) government protects our rights to advocate an unpopular point of view, it should also allow consenting adults to have their party without interference from others. This would apply to tobacco growers and smokers in this case.
Amen, brothe Thad. Many could learn from your point of view. Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
There is a local Tobacco festival that sponsors a 5K. While I’ve never done it, it has been staged for several years now. I would think this implies it has been somewhat successful. I wonder what the awards would be? Pack of smokes? Maybe in addition to age groups, they have smoker/non-smoker divisions? Dave B. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
the question: why are cigarettes — undeniably lethal — legal and marijuana, undeniably safer, with admitted benefits for some, illegal? You can’t get past the hypocrisy.
I dunno, I have a hard time swallowing the "undeniably safer" assertion. It strikes me that weed’s mind-altering characteristics render it pretty darned unsafe. And it still isn’t any picnic for the lungs. Having said all that, I agree that legalizing the junk probably is smarter than the current practice. Legalize it, control it, tax it, and make some money off of it. Disgusting stuff. But we all have our vices. I admit to being addicted to endorphines, sugar, and bubble-gum. — Tri-Baby _ – o ’ – __o – </_ ` ‘ – < – __/ /o_ – (()) (()) - / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie
: I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting : events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. : : True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as : directed". : You could say that air kills most of its users.
Air kills it’s users? Oh come on Daniel, does anyone make a fat profit out of making it more addictive and therefore more deadly to it’s users? Well, yes of course they do, the tobacco industry. I’d say I get through a fair bit of air every week and I’m confident that my lungs and circulatory system are in better shape than if I’d combined my air intake with tobacco smoke. Phil Squire – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Daniel.
Get off your high horse Steve. Scott Galehouse
Why? I happen to agree and find nothing "high horse" about it. I would not attend a triathlon or run sponsored by a tobacco company. I quit smoking and find nothing remotely positive about a product that is the antithesis of health. Mike "What’s so unusual about that?" Tennent "TriBop" ‘98 Ironman Canada, 16:17:03
Hey, Maybe we can get a drug cartel to sponser a triathlon too. you know, free speach and all. And the good thing about about Mariajunna, Cocaine, Angel dust, and Heroin is all of them combined kill les than 2% as many people every year as compared to tobacco. So before we let the Drug Kingpins (Tobacco Company Executives) of the deadliest drug known to man sponsor our triathlons, maybe we should start out with some of the not so dangerous drugs. Steve Adams P.S.(Joe Camel is a drug pushing scumbag)
I would run a marathon for a Camel. 
— — Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. It’s legal status is a fact and rather oxymoronic considering it’s distructive nature. I can only hope that in my lifetime it is banned and the tobacco growers can find an alternate product to grow so the current tobacco industry can financially survive.
While I support the concept of enough people making the personal choice to eschew tobacco that farmers find themselves switching to other produce which has a better market, I find it sad that so many people subscribe to the "it’s bad, let’s outlaw it", whatever "it" is. You have not only personal choice, but a responsibility to choose wisely. You have the opportunity to influence your children and friends. Frankly, I consider the laws to save us from ourselves to be worse that nuisances, but rather an erosion of the principle of freedoms in life. Just as the (US) government protects our rights to advocate an unpopular point of view, it should also allow consenting adults to have their party without interference from others. This would apply to tobacco growers and smokers in this case. Then we should consider tinkering with the constitution to ban the free speech rights of those selling products we don’t like anymore. A product we don’t like and a product that distroys life, is not quite the same, at least in my book.
Who is "we"? Certainly not all citizens. As far as destroying life, the same could be said statistically of cars or bicycles. Every person chooses their own risks and pleasures. Yes, I endorse your right to boycott tobacco-sponsored events. And no, I don’t smoke. Thad
Great thread on tobacco sponsorships, but only theoretical, wot? It seems unlikely that we’ll ever hear of the Kool Lite Ironman Championship (although if I’m not mistaken "Lucky 7," the sponsor of an adventure race in China, is a Chinese cigarette co.). Cigarettes are lethal, but also legal. So long as they’re legal, cigarette co.s have 1st Amendment rights and can advertise and sponsor events. Why not? And any individual can choose to participate, stay home, set up a picket line, smoke or not smoke, based on his or her principles, lack of principles, or interest. These ideas seem basic. More interesting, and raised by only one writer that I noticed (hi, Steve), is the question: why are cigarettes — undeniably lethal — legal and marijuana, undeniably safer, with admitted benefits for some, illegal? You can’t get past the hypocrisy. I don’t smoke or use anything (except Zantac, vitamin supplements, soy protein powder, Met-Rx, and daily asperin, natch), but let’s face it — we could erase the national deficit with what we spend on the "war on drugs" (the results of which make Vietnam look like a victory). A Martian, here for only one day, would send home the irrational report that some mind-altering, potentially harmful substances (tobacco, alcohol) are legal with only some (if any) adverse social consequences to their users, and others illegal, with potentially disasterous consequences (life in prison for a 3rd strike, e.g.). What’s the point? So I’m wating for the announcement of the Kona Gold Ironman Championship, with awards for every participant.
Excellent, this got something going, I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as directed". Use, mind you, that is fully a VOLUNTARY action on the part of the user. Must we ban the legal advertisement of a legal product considering smoking is an activity people choose to do?
If I wrote we / you (I’m not in the US) should ban the advertising of a legal product then I don’t recall doing so. What I said was that : True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as directed".
I DID NOT advocate the banning of tobacco advertising. What you seem to be hung up on is the fact that tobacco is legal, and therefore it is OK to advertise it without scruple? FWIW I would not take part in any Triathlon that I knew was sponsored by a tobacco company. Red meat and butter, dare I say, kill their users, too, used as directed. Do you suggest banning them from sponsorship, too?
I DID NOT advocate the banning of tobacco advertising / sponsorship! Red meat and butter are not addictive, nor do the companies who produce them tamper with the product in order to make them more so. I did write: "I’m not familiar with the constitution but I’m sure there are laws regarding certain things which most people find unacceptable, even if they impinge on the so called right to free speech." My intention was to illustrate that if the majority find something unacceptable then something would / should be done. While that is not the case, fine, anything goes. I’m not familiar with the constitution but I’m sure there are laws regarding certain things which most people find unacceptable, even if they impinge on the so called right to free speech. Sure, like yelling "fire" in a crowded theater. However, I’d bet more people find trampling on the constitution much more unacceptable than Marlboro sponsoring a few sporting events.
Absolutely, however I have not suggested the banning of advertising, neither did I suggest trampling upon the constitution. (This constitution/trampling thing is always a good way of getting feelings going) Amendment I. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. I said the "so called" right to free speech because I felt, perhaps wrongly, that there must have been laws passed to change the original bill of rights. Correct me I I’m wrong. This is America.
Well, no it isn’t. This is the Internet, and while America has the majority of subscribers, it is not the Internet. Nor is Usenet. Free speech is for everybody. Usenet is a great example.
Absolutely. OOI do you draw no limits on free speech at all? Phil Squire – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^) Me? Oh I just rant on;-) Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine. If tobacco use did not attract and harm so many of our youth and it wasn’t such a known killer and/or distroyer of quality of life for all, then I would agree.
Doug, you may need government to tell you what you can and cannot put in your body, as long as it doesn’t harm others. I don’t. I do not favor youth smoking. However, I find it ridiculous that we scratch our heads and wonder why teenage smoking is going up considering we’re doing everything to outlaw it—except outlawing it! If it’s so bad, it ought to be outlawed. Period. But the government makes money on cigs, so it will never be so. In the meantime, we tell kids smoking is bad and evil. So naturally, they do it. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. It’s legal status is a fact and rather oxymoronic considering it’s distructive nature. I can only hope that in my lifetime it is banned and the tobacco growers can find an alternate product to grow so the current tobacco industry can financially survive.
So I guess you do need government to tell you what you can, and cannot, put in your body, tobacco-wise. Can you still get them cheap at the PX?
Don’t know. Never smoked. Never will. Never bought ‘em. If tobacco is so bad that we must ban it’s advertising, it should be made illegal. You have my vote. And to think, we would ever agree.
It will never be outlawed because the states are making money off the "tobacco deal." To outlaw it would mean less money for the states. The states make more money off tobacco than the tobacco companies do. A product we don’t like and a product that distroys life, is not quite the same, at least in my book.
And you, Doug, have the choice whether to injest such product. We all have the right to destroy our bodies, right? If your answer is no, do you favor government mandated exercise? I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^) A surprise that you feel the urge to rant or the fact you stopped with one iteration? <g
I’ll keep going as long as this thread does. That’s how I operate. Hi, Doug!! Hugs and kisses to you. Does this mean we can go to the zoo together? :)
Bronx or PDX? Mike — When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as directed".
Use, mind you, that is fully a VOLUNTARY action on the part of the user. Must we ban the legal advertisement of a legal product considering smoking is an activity people choose to do? Red meat and butter, dare I say, kill their users, too, used as directed. Do you suggest banning them from sponsorship, too? I’m not familiar with the constitution but I’m sure there are laws regarding certain things which most people find unacceptable, even if they impinge on the so called right to free speech.
Sure, like yelling "fire" in a crowded theater. However, I’d bet more people find trampling on the constitution much more unacceptable than Marlboro sponsoring a few sporting events. This is America. Free speech is for everybody. Usenet is a great example. I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^) Me? Oh I just rant on;-)
Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
: I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting : events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. : : True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as : directed". : You could say that air kills most of its users. Daniel.
Get off your high horse Steve. Scott Galehouse
It’s not about being on a "high horse". It’s about a group of people without morals or conscience getting rich by peddling a highly addictive and poisinous product. I have watched several friends and a few relatives die as a direct result of tobacco and I will say it again. I would have nothing to do with any athletic event that had a tobacco company sponsor. Steve Fredericks Oceanside, CA
I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine.
If tobacco use did not attract and harm so many of our youth and it wasn’t such a known killer and/or distroyer of quality of life for all, then I would agree. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily.
It’s legal status is a fact and rather oxymoronic considering it’s distructive nature. I can only hope that in my lifetime it is banned and the tobacco growers can find an alternate product to grow so the current tobacco industry can financially survive. Can you still get them cheap at the PX? As a sociey we do set many double standards. We often point at alcohol for valid comparison. I’m sure there are others. If tobacco is so bad that we must ban it’s advertising, it should be made illegal.
You have my vote. And to think, we would ever agree. Then we should consider tinkering with the constitution to ban the free speech rights of those selling products we don’t like anymore.
A product we don’t like and a product that distroys life, is not quite the same, at least in my book. I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^)
A surprise that you feel the urge to rant or the fact you stopped with one iteration? <g Hi, Doug!!
Hugs and kisses to you. Does this mean we can go to the zoo together? :) — Caveat Lector!
Sort of a chicken and egg or selling your soul to the devil problem. Remember in the earlier days of the Ironman, Budlight was a title sponsor. I’m sure MADD if it existed back them would not have been happy. The Budlight sponsorship probably helped the Ironman survive to what it is today. When Hooter’s signed as a major sponsor for the Aloha Bowl there was an uproar here in Hawaii. Let face it unless the the people making the noise can come up another sponsor, the Aloha Bowl has no choice. In fact considering the bad economy in Hawaii, the Aloha Bowl is pretty lucky. All events rely on volunteers to survive. The major events need sponsorship. I know Valerie Silk as much as she loved the Ironman could not put the Ironman on for free. I seem to recall she eventually needed to come up with prize money to continue Ironman’s success. I love participating in triathlons. I know the small events I participate in are successful because of the volunteers. I make it a point to volunteer for sporting events that I don’t particpate in. In fact, it’s a lot of fun watching some kid who look no more than 5 years old or someone who looks like they are in their eightys complete a 1K or 2K swim. Bottom line, we need volunteers and sponors. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
C’mon, the irony of tobacco sponsorship in triathlon is quite amusing. I say let tobacco companies put up their money–I don’t think that they are going to convert many triathletes into smokers. Brian Meyer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. The thought of a tobacco company sponsoring an athletic event is repugnant to me and I would have nothing to do with such an event. Steve Fredericks Oceanside, CA
Get off your high horse Steve. Scott Galehouse
What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events.
The thought of a tobacco company sponsoring an athletic event is repugnant to me and I would have nothing to do with such an event. Steve Fredericks Oceanside, CA
I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily.
True, but AFAIK it’s the only one which kills it’s users if "used as directed". If tobacco is so bad that we must ban it’s advertising, it should be made illegal. Then we should consider tinkering with the constitution to ban the free speech rights of those selling products we don’t like anymore.
I’m not familiar with the constitution but I’m sure there are laws regarding certain things which most people find unacceptable, even if they impinge on the so called right to free speech. I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^)
Me? Oh I just rant on;-) Phil Hi, Doug!! Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign
So true! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
Who cares. I know I don’t. I do not use the products, and am more than willing enough to aloow for lower app. fees, and larger prozes for thos who win (certainly not me). I don’t think the tri sports, or most others for that matter are in danger od being influenced by Joe Camel. I know I personally do not let politically correct decisions run my daily life (I am a cop, i can’t). If they want to write a check, I say give them a pen. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
What is your opinion on tobacco company sponsorship of sporting events. If you subscribe to Triathlon Digest you will have read several days of opinions on this topic. Ken
I frankly don’t care if tobacco companies want to sponsor sporting events. Fine. Tobacco is a legal product whose users injest voluntarily. If tobacco is so bad that we must ban it’s advertising, it should be made illegal. Then we should consider tinkering with the constitution to ban the free speech rights of those selling products we don’t like anymore. I feel a rant coming on, so I’ll stop. :^) Hi, Doug!! Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
Among other things it reveals that secondhand smoke may contain up to TWICE the level of some toxic chemicals as that inhaled directly by cigarette smokers. The complete report is at: http://www.cctc.ca/bcreports/. Although this is somewhat suggestive, it does NOT mean that secondhand smoke constitutes a danger. — [Eric Rescorla
Please read the complete report at WWW.WHO CARES IT JUST STINKS. COM D.J. " did you ever look at a real pretty girl in a car blowing cig smoke out of her mouth at a stop light— YUK" (IRONKID)
Those who supported tobacco sponsorship of triathlons and road races may be interested in a detailed analysis of the product. The province of British Columbia has published the first publicly. detailed analysis of chemicals contained in Canadian cigarettes. Among other things it reveals that secondhand smoke may contain up to TWICE the level of some toxic chemicals as that inhaled directly by cigarette smokers. The complete report is at: http://www.cctc.ca/bcreports/. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web www.runnersweb.com/running.html A running and triathlon resource site. Voting Booth: www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_vote.html
Among other things it reveals that secondhand smoke may contain up to TWICE the level of some toxic chemicals as that inhaled directly by cigarette smokers. The complete report is at: http://www.cctc.ca/bcreports/.
Although this is somewhat suggestive, it does NOT mean that secondhand smoke constitutes a danger. The issue here is that they’re measuring the output in terms of ug/cigarette, but what’s relevant is total intake into your lungs, which is much more difficult to measure. That said, this report is fairly loaded. The quotes for how dangerous the various chemicals are are quite misleading. While I’m sure taht some of these chemicals are quite toxic, let’s take a look at of them: Acetone: "Workers exposed to acetone vapours experienced transient eye and nose irritation." Acetone is widely used in nail polish remover. When I worked in a chemistry lab, we used to use squirt bottles of acetone to dry glassware. Ammonia: "Ammonia can increase susceptibility to viral illness and aggravate chronic respiratory conditions." Ammonia is a common kitchen cleaning agent. It’s one of the components of Windex. Note that both ammonia and acetone have quite noticeable smells, but you can’t smell either of them in cigarette smoke to any noticeable degree. I suspect you get FAR more exposure to ammonia when cleaning the kitchen. Remember, we’re talking about inhaling fumes here, not drinking it. Similarly, listing hydrogen cyanide and carbon monoxide is fairly misleading. They’re both quite toxic, but they’re acute toxins not cumulative toxins. So, if you’re not suffering ill effects immediately, you’re probably not going to. (They interfere with transport). There’s nowhere near enough in secondhand cigarette smoke to do you any damage at all. Your car puts out a lot more CO, for instance. Look, it’s perfectly clear that smoking is bad for you, but this sort of list of toxic chemical without any indication of the generally considered safe amount is just irresponsible. By constrast, it’s not clear that secondhand smoke is bad for you, and this doesn’t add anything to that debate either. -Ekr — eTrain – free triathlon training software http://www.rtfm.com/tri/etrain.html
Eric Rescorla wrote "your car puts out a lot more CO, for instance" I don’t know about you, but I wouldn’t want to sit behind a parked car sniffing the fumes on any kind of a regular basis. Or to compare it to second hand smoke, (Kids don’t do this without your parents permision) Try bringing your car into the living room, close all the doors and windows, start the car, then take a nice little nap. Now you’ve proved your point, your car does put out a lot more CO, and everyone in the house is dead. How does that make second hand smoke not bad for you? Steve "I’d rather sit next to an I.V. drug user than to sit next to a smoker" Adams
In reference to dangerous babbling about the second hand smoke not being a health hazard, you either work for a cig company, have never been out in the real world and exposed to some idiot blowing his/hers putrid smelling smoke in your direction or you need to get off of your daddys computer and not tie up space in this news group dedicated to the ultra fit! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Among other things it reveals that secondhand smoke may contain up to TWICE the level of some toxic chemicals as that inhaled directly by cigarette smokers. The complete report is at: http://www.cctc.ca/bcreports/. Although this is somewhat suggestive, it does NOT mean that secondhand smoke constitutes a danger. The issue here is that they’re measuring the output in terms of ug/cigarette, but what’s relevant is total intake into your lungs, which is much more difficult to measure. That said, this report is fairly loaded. The quotes for how dangerous the various chemicals are are quite misleading. While I’m sure taht some of these chemicals are quite toxic, let’s take a look at of them: Acetone: "Workers exposed to acetone vapours experienced transient eye and nose irritation." Acetone is widely used in nail polish remover. When I worked in a chemistry lab, we used to use squirt bottles of acetone to dry glassware. Ammonia: "Ammonia can increase susceptibility to viral illness and aggravate chronic respiratory conditions." Ammonia is a common kitchen cleaning agent. It’s one of the components of Windex. Note that both ammonia and acetone have quite noticeable smells, but you can’t smell either of them in cigarette smoke to any noticeable degree. I suspect you get FAR more exposure to ammonia when cleaning the kitchen. Remember, we’re talking about inhaling fumes here, not drinking it. Similarly, listing hydrogen cyanide and carbon monoxide is fairly misleading. They’re both quite toxic, but they’re acute toxins not cumulative toxins. So, if you’re not suffering ill effects immediately, you’re probably not going to. (They interfere with transport). There’s nowhere near enough in secondhand cigarette smoke to do you any damage at all. Your car puts out a lot more CO, for instance. Look, it’s perfectly clear that smoking is bad for you, but this sort of list of toxic chemical without any indication of the generally considered safe amount is just irresponsible. By constrast, it’s not clear that secondhand smoke is bad for you, and this doesn’t add anything to that debate either. -Ekr — [Eric Rescorla
You are most wise to invest in a capable coach. By way of recommendation I can think of none better than Tom Price 2X IMC winner and 4th on the Good Training, Good Racing, Joe Joseph C. Foster
Well, I know a lot of people are going to diagree with me comments, but here I go. Firstly, I am not married, and I don’t have kids, but I guess I am just lazy. I think the most important thing is to know, or at least feel confidant you can make the distances on the Ironman. (BTW I’ve done two Oz Ironman races and heading to IMC next year). I always knew I was a good swimmer so that didn’t worry me, but honestly, if you can keep a consistant pace for 3.8K, you should be able to make it in the time you are after. Personally, I think the swim is a lot more important than others seem to, but that’s just me. 50mins is my target. As for the run, the *longest* run I ever did before my first IM was 24K. I felt pretty sure I could keep going for 11 or 12 hours, so what the hell, I hate running, and as it turned out, I ran/walked 4:15 for my first one which wasn’t too bad considering. It’s all a matter of how well you want to do, but if you are just aiming at finishing (which I do), the mental side is half the battle. If you know you have enough of a base to keep going for 12-15 hours, and mentally you are ready for that, then it’s all just a matter of keeping a steady constant pace. Oh – and NEVER STOP. As long as you are moving you are getting closer to the finish. BTW (your gonna love this) – I never eat anything during an IM. I get everything from the drinks. Never had any trouble either, but I would very mush advise you seek other guidence on this matter . -Paul. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So this is my first official chat group entry-I figured a traithlon group would be relatively free of the usual perverts and weirdo’s lurking in cyberspace, but then you have to be pretty weird to be a triathlete, so I guess I’ll just have to risk it. I finally took the plunge and sent in my IMC’99 application and to my horror was actually accepted. I have too much Scottish blood in me to back down at a challenge, so I guess i’m committed. Trouble is my life is crazy with a job and 2 kids aged 2 and 4 and a dog and a husband who travels incessantly ( no I don’ t need a date just yet). I plan on hiring a coach to put together a program but would love to hear from real people with busy lives and not much time to train, and hear your story on how you did it and how much training etc. what to eat , yadda yadda. I loved all the personal stories on the IMC website, very inspiring. I’d love to hear from other woman with kids and jobs who have done an ironman ( or a 190lb god, dark hair washboard stomach…ok I’m digressing, it’s late, just me and my keyboard ) Also looking for any training partners in the Toronto area for the long rides, espec. in the final 12 brutal weeks. Do I really have to go to the pool more than once a week, I hate staring into the baggy shorts of old men, and I just want to survive the swim, est. fin, time 1 1/2 hrs. I’d rather concentrate on the bike/run. Total goal is under 15 hours if my IT band hold out. I plan to do the 1/2 ironman in Collingwood, ON and a few sprints/Olympics in the summer. Do I really need to do a marathon prior? Any info from anybody would be great. I’m an information junky ( I work in publishing!) What is it about this sport, it gets wrapped around your psyche until every spare moment is triathlon obsessed. I think I need therapy.
So this is my first official chat group entry-I figured a traithlon group would be relatively free of the usual perverts and weirdo’s lurking in cyberspace, but then you have to be pretty weird to be a triathlete, so I guess I’ll just have to risk it. I finally took the plunge and sent in my IMC’99 application and to my horror was actually accepted. I have too much Scottish blood in me to back down at a challenge, so I guess i’m committed. Trouble is my life is crazy with a job and 2 kids aged 2 and 4 and a dog and a husband who travels incessantly ( no I don’ t need a date just yet). I plan on hiring a coach to put together a program but would love to hear from real people with busy lives and not much time to train, and hear your story on how you did it and how much training etc. what to eat , yadda yadda. I loved all the personal stories on the IMC website, very inspiring. I’d love to hear from other woman with kids and jobs who have done an ironman ( or a 190lb god, dark hair washboard stomach…ok I’m digressing, it’s late, just me and my keyboard ) Also looking for any training partners in the Toronto area for the long rides, espec. in the final 12 brutal weeks. Do I really have to go to the pool more than once a week, I hate staring into the baggy shorts of old men, and I just want to survive the swim, est. fin, time 1 1/2 hrs. I’d rather concentrate on the bike/run. Total goal is under 15 hours if my IT band hold out. I plan to do the 1/2 ironman in Collingwood, ON and a few sprints/Olympics in the summer. Do I really need to do a marathon prior? Any info from anybody would be great. I’m an information junky ( I work in publishing!) What is it about this sport, it gets wrapped around your psyche until every spare moment is triathlon obsessed. I think I need therapy.
I take two Tylenol PMs before a big race. It has mild sleep-aid that I have never, ever felt the next day. I wake up very refreshed. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everybody ! My problem is: I can hardly get any sleep before my long distance races because I`m woorrying all the time. Last year I got only two hours of sleep before an half IM race. Well, the race worked out fine, but I would have preferred 6-7 hours of sleep. I
What nationality is King Les, And who put him there? Jim
What nationality is King Les, And who put him there?
I believe he is British (furthermore, I believe he comes from my neck of the wood). If he is, I can only say that we’re very sorry to have let him loose on the world. Please accept our humble apologies. Steve Mustard, Surrey, UK Tel: +44 171 637 9111×4105 Fax: +44 1932 869102 Opinions are mine and not those of Logica. That’s all I have to say about that.
What nationality is King Les, And who put him there? I believe he is British (furthermore, I believe he comes from my neck of the wood). If he is, I can only say that we’re very sorry to have let him loose on the world. Please accept our humble apologies. Steve Mustard, Surrey, UK
Steve, you can carry your head high in public once more. He’s now a Canadian for which, I now hng my head in public. He lives in British Columbia, Victoria I think and is also the prez of TriCan. Woe is me. But hey! Aren’t elections coming up? maybe we Just a thought.. TriDork
What nationality is King Les, And who put him there?
Les is Canadian via the UK, as are my wife and her family. There’s lots of that going around in Canada. I don’t agree with most of what Les is currently doing with our sport, and I support Steve Locke’s bid for president. However, I think Steve, and many others who feel as I do, would agree that in a very real way Les McDonald is a personal friend to many of us. Les did start the ITU, and is responsible in no small part for the fact that there are 80 or so member NGB’s, and for triathlon being on the Olympic program. Les has a mission, and his devotion to it in the face of the nay-sayers, doubters, and detractors, has brought the ITU to the point where it now is. The fact that revolutionaries frequently get eaten by their own revolutions should not cause us to forget that, on balance, Les has been a big asset to our sport. Remember that the British booted Churchill from office within a year of the armistice. He was apparently the right wartime leader but not the right peacetime leader (according to those who were being led). Les may not be ready for Churchillian comparisons, but he isn’t the devil either. QRman
McDonald is a personal friend to many of us. Les did start the ITU, and is responsible in no small part for the fact that there are 80 or so member NGB’s, and for triathlon being on the Olympic program.
The perfect time for a clarification and amplification from ITU folks (ideally Sisson and Zag, if they are reading). Here Empfield notes there are 80 or so member countries in the ITU. I think I have heard reference to as many as 109 member countries in the ITU. So, ITU guys, how many are there? And, which countries are they? Katherine Williams
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What nationality is King Les, And who put him there? I believe he is British (furthermore, I believe he comes from my neck of the wood). If he is, I can only say that we’re very sorry to have let him loose on the world. Please accept our humble apologies. Steve Mustard, Surrey, UK Steve, you can carry your head high in public once more. He’s now a Canadian for which, I now hng my head in public. He lives in British Columbia, Victoria I think and is also the prez of TriCan. Woe is me. But hey! Aren’t elections coming up? maybe we Just a thought.. sorry to admit…he is from my home…vancouver BC Canada…marjorie and he speaks with a scottish accent…but heh nationality is not the problem with less
Marjorie I think the reason that Les speaks with a Scottish accent is because he is originally from Britain (See Dan Empfield’s earlier posting). I’ll say again, I’m very sorry to the world of Triathlon for this export. (First Les, then BSE, what next ???) Steve Mustard, Surrey, UK Tel: +44 171 637 9111×4105 Fax: +44 1932 869102 Opinions are mine and not those of Logica. That’s all I have to say about that.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What nationality is King Les, And who put him there? I believe he is British (furthermore, I believe he comes from my neck of the wood). If he is, I can only say that we’re very sorry to have let him loose on the world. Please accept our humble apologies. Steve Mustard, Surrey, UK Steve, you can carry your head high in public once more. He’s now a Canadian for which, I now hng my head in public. He lives in British Columbia, Victoria I think and is also the prez of TriCan. Woe is me. But hey! Aren’t elections coming up? maybe we Just a thought..
sorry to admit…he is from my home…vancouver BC Canada…marjorie and he speaks with a scottish accent…but heh nationality is not the problem with less
I don’t agree with most of what Les is currently doing with our sport, and I support Steve Locke’s bid for president. However, I think Steve, and many others who feel as I do, would agree that in a very real way Les McDonald is a personal friend to many of us. Les did start the ITU, and is responsible in no small part for the fact that there are 80 or so member NGB’s, and for triathlon being on the Olympic program. Les has a mission, and his devotion to it in the face of the nay-sayers, doubters, and detractors, has brought the ITU to the point where it now is. The fact that revolutionaries frequently get eaten by their own revolutions should not cause us to forget that, on balance, Les has been a big asset to our sport. Remember that the British booted Churchill from office within a year of the armistice. He was apparently the right wartime leader but not the right peacetime leader (according to those who were being led). Well put. However (and please correct me if I’m wrong), I don’t remember who these detractors were or who the enemy was with respect to the ITU in the formative days. As far as I can tell, the ITU was formed and supported from a very positive groundswell. As for the Olympics, well, if, as the ITU (as it now is) puts it – we can’t have it without drafting, then the end doesn’t justify the means. Who cares for an Olympic draft legal event – I don’t. When the ITU board loses touch with the sport and spend all their time talking about ‘properties’ and TV rights, that’s the time they have to go. They seem to have forgotten what it’s like competing in a race where the winner is worthy, not someone who hitched a ride. Les may not be ready for Churchillian comparisons, but he isn’t the devil either. No one doubts the value of what Les _did_, and I’m sure we’re all grateful for it. However, I judge people on present character, not their past (even if the latter happens to be seedy). On this count – as far as I’m concerned, Les is persona non grata. Besides, we wouldn’t want QRman to be another advocate for the devil, therefore Les can’t be. — Woof!
Dear rst, I need some help! I’m doing some research into various Tri-bikes. I’m after the good/bad aspects of triathlon machines, from the rider/racer/mechanic piont of view. What is it about a bike that you love or hate (from handling to colour!). If you could help, please email me direct, with a short (i.e. 1 paragraph max.) critique of any of the bikes listed below. If there is enough interest, I’ll post a summary of the reports. Thanks in advance: Cycles I’m interested in hearing about: Softride Power V, Solo, Qualifier Giant CFR1 Zipp 2001 Carbon Corima Carbon Trek 5500, 5200, 5000, 2300 Look Aeroblade 860, KG196, 191, 171 Aerovantage SS1 Tim Dr T.P. Armstrong
I have a 2300, and do not like it for triathlons. It soes not allow me to get into a position that I feel fast in. I love it for long rides, like Pedal the Peaks kind of tours, and seems to be okay doing heavy training group kind of rides. I am getting a new bike real soon . says… Dear rst, I need some help! I’m doing some research into various Tri-bikes. I’m after the good/bad aspects of triathlon machines, from the
rider/racer/mechanic – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -piont of view. What is it about a bike that you love or hate (from handling to colour!). If you could help, please email me direct, with a short (i.e. 1 paragraph max.) critique of any of the bikes listed below. If there is enough interest, I’ll post a summary of the reports. Thanks in advance: Cycles I’m interested in hearing about: Softride Power V, Solo, Qualifier Giant CFR1 Zipp 2001 Carbon Corima Carbon Trek 5500, 5200, 5000, 2300 Look Aeroblade 860, KG196, 191, 171 Aerovantage SS1 Tim Dr T.P. Armstrong
(Forgive spelling and typos please) Tri Heroes? Thanks for all the interest in my questions. I got about 100 responses in two weeks. Compared to the mail recieved when I was on staff at a popular tri mag, this type of response is nothing short overwhelming. The "Who are your Tri heroes?" question was a dud. No one pro or age-group athlete stood out. Most people admired a close friend or age-group triathlete who inspired them. Therefore, there were a lot of different names. One person wrote that only spectator sports need heroes. Since triathlon is not exactly up there with the NBA or NFL or WWF wrestling, this, judging from the Net responses, may indeed be a valid point. It seems that from the Net and the various publications I’ve worked with. Most triathletes are interested in the consumer aspect or grass roots. Such as what is the best bike position, best tires, diet, training etc., instead of focusing the abilities and personality of the Michael Jordans, Ken Griffeys or Charles Barkleys. I’ll compile and post the more interesting component survey and tri mag survey shortly. Thanks again for your feedback. Jeffrey Justice
: (Forgive spelling and typos please) : Tri Heroes? : Thanks for all the interest in my questions. I got about 100 responses in : two weeks. Compared to the mail recieved when I was on staff at a popular : tri mag, this type of response is nothing short overwhelming. : The "Who are your Tri heroes?" question was a dud. : No one pro or age-group athlete stood out. Most people admired a close : friend or age-group triathlete who inspired them. Therefore, there were a : lot of different names. : One person wrote that only spectator sports need heroes. Since triathlon : is not exactly up there with the NBA or NFL or WWF wrestling, this, : judging from the Net responses, may indeed be a valid point. : It seems that from the Net and the various publications I’ve worked with. : Most triathletes are interested in the consumer aspect or grass roots. : Such as what is the best bike position, I for one would be really interested in a bike position survey for both traditional and steep seat tube angle geometries using aero bars. I am constantly changing stem height, aero bar position, saddle fore/aft position and saddle height and make minor improvements but never seem to get it right with all of the variables. A set of ‘rules of thumb’ to stick with and condition yourself with would help. Thanks, Jay : instead of focusing the abilities and personality of the Michael : Jordans, Ken Griffeys or Charles Barkleys. : I’ll compile and post the more interesting component survey and tri mag : survey shortly. : Thanks again for your feedback. : Jeffrey Justice
<snip I for one would be really interested in a bike position survey for both traditional and steep seat tube angle geometries using aero bars. I am constantly changing stem height, aero bar position, saddle fore/aft position and saddle height and make minor improvements but never seem to get it right with all of the variables. A set of ‘rules of thumb’ to stick with and condition yourself with would help.
If people tend to rest on the aerobars closer to their elbows, I have noticed the following trend: 1) Traditional biking geometry can be used more comfortably with pads that extend behind the aerobars (Syntace, Flite Control Flight Pads, Scott RCO). 2) Tri geometries tend toward the pads that are centered above the handlebars (Profile). Note: there are many exceptions, but this is a general rule of thumb. The main exception for #1 is those of us who rest on the pads in the center of the forearm, then pads centered above the handlebars work well. (This is how most traditional bike racers are set-up– Lemond, Indurain etc…) W.Patrick Brug, Ph.D. _- -_ Los Alamos National Lab -__ __- / cis: 72410,3372 /