Question:

The weather was perfect for the 8,000 participants of the Dublin Marathon this morning. A crisp, clear Autumn morning warmed up beautifully as the race went on, with the temperature rising to 11 or 12   centigrade. No wind worth talking about. This was my first marathon and I was quite nervous at the start. I’m only running since April and had only ever completed one previous race, a 1/2 which I ran in 1:53 last month. My longest run during training was a 20 miler. My primary goal was to finish the race, something I wasn’t all that confident about as I’ve had a cold for the last three weeks as well as a right hamstring which has been tightening up during my last few runs. Secondary goal was to finish in less than 4:10. Dream result was a sub 4 hour finish. Anyway, the race got underway at 9am and I crossed the line 90 seconds later. There were participants from all over the world. At least 1/2 the field were visitors and the atmosphere was nice ‘n’ friendly. Whole chunks of Utah and New Jersey seemed to have flown in to support the runners from Joints in Motion and Team in Training, so the sidelines were noisy and cheerful. Reached the halfway mark in 1:53 but at that stage my legs felt like lead. I was walking the water stops at that stage, so that was a short break every three miles. At 15 miles I was uncomfortable, but not so much I had to stop. At 20 miles (3 hours) I’d gladly have sat down. I was f**ked… Covering the last six miles of that race was the most difficult thing I’ve ever done. It was painful. The only thing that kept me going was that walking seemed to be even more difficult. Breathing was fine, as was heartrate, ditto running pace. I just felt extraordinarily tired, and my leg muscles were stiff as they’ve ever been. A water stop at 24 got me going again and I crossed the line at 4:07. Boy, was I happy to see that finish line. What have I learned: Most important, RESPECT THE FREAKIN’ DISTANCE! What they say is true. Don’t run the marathon until you have a full marathon training program done. And don’t do that until you have at least a year’s running under your belt. Anyway, I’m signing up for the Connemarathon tomorrow. http://www.connemarathon.com – I’m a sucker for punishment. But this time I’ll do it right. Thanks for reading. Colm

Response:

Nice to read that somebody else has been to that place … well done on your first marathon. Nice time, too! You kept up the pace pretty well towards the end  despite your suffering if you did the last 10 k in 1.07.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The weather was perfect for the 8,000 participants of the Dublin Marathon this morning. A crisp, clear Autumn morning warmed up beautifully as the race went on, with the temperature rising to 11 or 12   centigrade. No wind worth talking about. This was my first marathon and I was quite nervous at the start. I’m only running since April and had only ever completed one previous race, a 1/2 which I ran in 1:53 last month. My longest run during training was a 20 miler. My primary goal was to finish the race, something I wasn’t all that confident about as I’ve had a cold for the last three weeks as well as a right hamstring which has been tightening up during my last few runs. Secondary goal was to finish in less than 4:10. Dream result was a sub 4 hour finish. Anyway, the race got underway at 9am and I crossed the line 90 seconds later. There were participants from all over the world. At least 1/2 the field were visitors and the atmosphere was nice ‘n’ friendly. Whole chunks of Utah and New Jersey seemed to have flown in to support the runners from Joints in Motion and Team in Training, so the sidelines were noisy and cheerful. Reached the halfway mark in 1:53 but at that stage my legs felt like lead. I was walking the water stops at that stage, so that was a short break every three miles. At 15 miles I was uncomfortable, but not so much I had to stop. At 20 miles (3 hours) I’d gladly have sat down. I was f**ked… Covering the last six miles of that race was the most difficult thing I’ve ever done. It was painful. The only thing that kept me going was that walking seemed to be even more difficult. Breathing was fine, as was heartrate, ditto running pace. I just felt extraordinarily tired, and my leg muscles were stiff as they’ve ever been. A water stop at 24 got me going again and I crossed the line at 4:07. Boy, was I happy to see that finish line. What have I learned: Most important, RESPECT THE FREAKIN’ DISTANCE! What they say is true. Don’t run the marathon until you have a full marathon training program done. And don’t do that until you have at least a year’s running under your belt. Anyway, I’m signing up for the Connemarathon tomorrow. http://www.connemarathon.com – I’m a sucker for punishment. But this time I’ll do it right. Thanks for reading. Colm

Response:

Great effort Colm and enjoyable report. Youll get a sub four in not time. Doug Burke – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The weather was perfect for the 8,000 participants of the Dublin Marathon this morning. A crisp, clear Autumn morning warmed up beautifully as the race went on, with the temperature rising to 11 or 12  centigrade. No wind worth talking about. This was my first marathon and I was quite nervous at the start. I’m only running since April and had only ever completed one previous race, a 1/2 which I ran in 1:53 last month. My longest run during training was a 20 miler. My primary goal was to finish the race, something I wasn’t all that confident about as I’ve had a cold for the last three weeks as well as a right hamstring which has been tightening up during my last few runs. Secondary goal was to finish in less than 4:10. Dream result was a sub 4 hour finish. Anyway, the race got underway at 9am and I crossed the line 90 seconds later. There were participants from all over the world. At least 1/2 the field were visitors and the atmosphere was nice ‘n’ friendly. Whole chunks of Utah and New Jersey seemed to have flown in to support the runners from Joints in Motion and Team in Training, so the sidelines were noisy and cheerful. Reached the halfway mark in 1:53 but at that stage my legs felt like lead. I was walking the water stops at that stage, so that was a short break every three miles. At 15 miles I was uncomfortable, but not so much I had to stop. At 20 miles (3 hours) I’d gladly have sat down. I was f**ked… Covering the last six miles of that race was the most difficult thing I’ve ever done. It was painful. The only thing that kept me going was that walking seemed to be even more difficult. Breathing was fine, as was heartrate, ditto running pace. I just felt extraordinarily tired, and my leg muscles were stiff as they’ve ever been. A water stop at 24 got me going again and I crossed the line at 4:07. Boy, was I happy to see that finish line. What have I learned: Most important, RESPECT THE FREAKIN’ DISTANCE! What they say is true. Don’t run the marathon until you have a full marathon training program done. And don’t do that until you have at least a year’s running under your belt. Anyway, I’m signing up for the Connemarathon tomorrow. http://www.connemarathon.com – I’m a sucker for punishment. But this time I’ll do it right. Thanks for reading. Colm

Response:

Thanks! I enjoyed your report too. I’ve only ever spectated at one marathon before and it was the MCM in 1999. I thought everyone doing it was quite mad. Now I know… BTW, how do you record your mile times? — Colm

: Great effort Colm and enjoyable report. Youll get a sub four in not time. : Doug Burke

Response:

Thanks Jonathan! — Colm

: Nice to read that somebody else has been to that place … well done on your : first marathon. Nice time, too! You kept up the pace pretty well towards the : end  despite your suffering if you did the last 10 k in 1.07.

Response:

A water stop at 24 got me going again and I crossed the line at 4:07. Boy, was I happy to see that finish line. What have I learned: Most important, RESPECT THE FREAKIN’ DISTANCE! What they say is true. Don’t run the marathon until you have a full marathon training program done. And don’t do that until you have at least a year’s running under your belt. Anyway, I’m signing up for the Connemarathon tomorrow. http://www.connemarathon.com – I’m a sucker for punishment. But this time I’ll do it right. Thanks for reading. Colm

Congratulations, Colm! It was tough, but you did it and in a reasonable time. It *is* true what they say about marathons! Sorry you had to experience the hows and whys. Best of luck in training for the Connemarathon (great name!). You’ll find you’ll still be pretty tired but not beat to death when you train fully. I bet you’ll really like it! Teresa in AZ

Response:

Thanks! I enjoyed your report too. I’ve only ever spectated at one marathon before and it was the MCM in 1999. I thought everyone doing it was quite mad. Now I know…

Thnkas Colm. BTW, how do you record your mile times?

I carried a typewriter the whole way. Ok, all seriousness aside, I have a Timex "Ironman Triathlon" watch. It’s something I’d highly recommend. Just set it to the "crono" mode and hit the right button at every mile. When you’re done hit the left button. It can hold 100 splits. Works as a timer and a regular watch too. Doug Burke

Response:

The weather was perfect for the 8,000 participants of the Dublin Marathon this morning.

<snip Good stuff, Colm. Good time too! Well done. — Paul My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): http://paulrooney.netfirms.com Please sponsor me for the London Marathon at: http://www.justgiving.com/london2004

Response:

Oh, yes, I forgot to add: you’ll probably knock half an hour off your next ‘thon. But make sure you don’t get rid of so much salt that your leg muscles begin to cramp towards the end – or eat too many gels and end up vomiting or getting stomach cramps! J

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks Jonathan! — Colm : Nice to read that somebody else has been to that place … well done on your : first marathon. Nice time, too! You kept up the pace pretty well towards the : end  despite your suffering if you did the last 10 k in 1.07.

Response:

Colm – Congrats on your 1st marathon! Looks like your dream sub-4 result is not far away.  Did you have any gels/ sports drink or food along the way? Anthony.

Response:

Congratulations, Colm! Sorry I didn’t spot your number. (Mind you, I passed a good friend of mine somewhere in the last few miles without noticing, so much was I focussed on just getting the end). Best of luck in Connemara! John

Response:

Thanks Anthony, I took 3 gels during the race. I didn’t want to take any more than that because I’ve never used them before. At 4 of the water stops I took both water and Lucozade Sport. I’ll probably use them extensively during training for my next attempt. — Colm

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Colm – Congrats on your 1st marathon! Looks like your dream sub-4 result is not far away.  Did you have any gels/ sports drink or food along the way? Anthony.

Response:

Congratulations to yourself too! Did you enjoy it? — Colm

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Congratulations, Colm! Sorry I didn’t spot your number. (Mind you, I passed a good friend of mine somewhere in the last few miles without noticing, so much was I focussed on just getting the end). Best of luck in Connemara! John

Response:

Good time John! http://homepage.eircom.net/~bhaa/Mar03ProvResult3.htm — Colm

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Congratulations, Colm! Sorry I didn’t spot your number. (Mind you, I passed a good friend of mine somewhere in the last few miles without noticing, so much was I focussed on just getting the end). Best of luck in Connemara! John

Response:

Good time John! http://homepage.eircom.net/~bhaa/Mar03ProvResult3.htm

Thanks for this URL, I hadn’t seen it. My ‘real’ time was actually a whisker under 4 hours (3:59:40), as it was a couple of minutes before I crossed the start line. J.

Response:

Good time John! http://homepage.eircom.net/~bhaa/Mar03ProvResult3.htm

Out of curiosity, how did they measure these times, do you think? I presume photos were taken as people crossed the finish line, which were subsequently scanned for the bib numbers. Personally, I think the whole idea of dropping the chips and using this system at the last minute was a major cockup. There was no recording of at what point each runner crossed the start line, and no recording of the time at the midway point. Did something go badly wrong with the organisation, do you think? John

Response:

Congratulations to yourself too! Did you enjoy it?

Yes had a great time! I was really impressed with the friendliness of the Dubliners lining the route. Are you one of this species yourself? J.

Response:

I’m not sure how they did it. Using the chips would’ve been a whole lot better. The time they’ve posted for me is quicker than the time I calculated. Yours is slower…. Who knows what way they did it? A colleague of mine ran a sub 3 hour and they had his time exactly right. It may be that they weren’t as careful with the slower times. — Colm

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Out of curiosity, how did they measure these times, do you think? I presume photos were taken as people crossed the finish line, which were subsequently scanned for the bib numbers. Personally, I think the whole idea of dropping the chips and using this system at the last minute was a major cockup. There was no recording of at what point each runner crossed the start line, and no recording of the time at the midway point. Did something go badly wrong with the organisation, do you think? John

Response:

I’m not sure how they did it. Using the chips would’ve been a whole lot better. The time they’ve posted for me is quicker than the time I calculated. Yours is slower…. Who knows what way they did it? A colleague of mine ran a sub 3 hour and they had his time exactly right. It may be that they weren’t as careful with the slower times.

The time they posted for me is pretty well exactly what I would expect, given the 2 minutes to the start line. I started my stopwatch as I went over the line, but at the time I didn’t make a detailed note of what the ‘official’ clock was reading. The ‘official’ time of the friend I started off with is 2 minutes slower than his measured one, exactly as mine was, which makes sense, as we crossed the line at the same time. I can’t think why your time would be the way it is. Your sub 3 hour friend, though, presumably started much nearer the front, hence the reduced discrepancy with the official time. They really need a chip system in place again next year (they had it two years ago, my friend says). J.

Response:

They really need a chip system in place again next year (they had it two years ago, my friend says). J.

Did you not have a chip? They had them last year. — Paul My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): http://paulrooney.netfirms.com Please sponsor me for the London Marathon at: http://www.justgiving.com/london2004

Response:

Did you not have a chip? They had them last year.

No. When we turned up to register, they said they weren’t using a chip system this year (despite what it had said on the website only the day before), but were using bar codes instead. The bib numbers had small bar codes at the bottom. Obviously it was impossible to scan all of these in the mass of people at the start, which meant your own race start time could not possibly be recorded, but  I assumed they must have some means of scanning them as we came through the finishing gate. The first time anyone paid any attention to the bar code bit, though, was minutes after the race end when we were corralled past someone who ripped off the bar code section and put it on a spike. This was far too late to be representative of a finishing time, so I assume they must have used something photographic at the actual finish. The whole thing reeks of cockup to me, though. I suspect that something went wrong at the last minute with the chip supply, or something like that, and they pretended to have this alternative in place, which wasn’t a valid alternative at all. J.

Response:

Thanks Teresa! — Colm

: Congratulations, Colm! It was tough, but you did it and in a reasonable : time. It *is* true what they say about marathons! Sorry you had to : experience the hows and whys. Best of luck in training for the : Connemarathon (great name!). You’ll find you’ll still be pretty tired : but not beat to death when you train fully. I bet you’ll really like : it!

Response:

Thanks Paul! — Colm

: : The weather was perfect for the 8,000 participants of the Dublin : Marathon this morning. : : <snip : : Good stuff, Colm. Good time too! Well done. : : — : Paul : My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): : http://paulrooney.netfirms.com : : Please sponsor me for the London Marathon at: : http://www.justgiving.com/london2004

Response:

I’m gonna have to get me one of them…. — Colm

: Ok, all seriousness aside, I have a Timex "Ironman Triathlon" : watch. It’s something I’d highly recommend. Just set it to the "crono" : mode and hit the right button at every mile. When you’re done hit the : left button. It can hold 100 splits. Works as a timer and a regular : watch too.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Did you not have a chip? They had them last year. No. When we turned up to register, they said they weren’t using a chip system this year (despite what it had said on the website only the day before), but were using bar codes instead. The bib numbers had small bar codes at the bottom. Obviously it was impossible to scan all of these in the mass of people at the start, which meant your own race start time could not possibly be recorded, but  I assumed they must have some means of scanning them as we came through the finishing gate. The first time anyone paid any attention to the bar code bit, though, was minutes after the race end when we were corralled past someone who ripped off the bar code section and put it on a spike. This was far too late to be representative of a finishing time, so I assume they must have used something photographic at the actual finish. The whole thing reeks of cockup to me, though. I suspect that something went wrong at the last minute with the chip supply, or something like that, and they pretended to have this alternative in place, which wasn’t a valid alternative at all. J.

That’s bad – it does sound like a cockup. — Paul My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): http://paulrooney.netfirms.com Please sponsor me for the London Marathon at: http://www.justgiving.com/london2004

Response:

Question:

: In training? In a marathon? I’m considering 30 sec each mile. I was wondering : about the experiences of others who may have tried it. when they renamed them to Snickers, I stopped eating them. but my experience was that sometimes the peanuts would get stuck in my teeth. HTH. — Steve Leyland mhm32×16  Smeeter#35 flower: three 6 four 9 five 8 eight 9 Alcatroll Labs Inc collaborator (bongwater maintenance dept)   =^//E0// //E0// ARMY^= Prince Charles and Prince William NEVER travel on the same airplane just in case there is a crash. _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW Meow MeowMeow  M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW* MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW MeoW Meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** _*MEOW*_ Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW Meow MMEEOOWW M*E*O*W MeoW meow ***MEOW*** MeOw mEoW _*MEOW*_ XXXXXX  XX      XX  XX  XXXXXX  XXXXXX   XX  XX       XX  XX XXXXXX  XX      XX  XX  XXXXXX  XXXXXX   XX  XX       XX  XX XX      XX      XX  XX  XX      XX       XX  XX        XXXX XXXX    XX      XX  XX  XXXX    XXXX     XX  XX         XX XXXX    XX      XX  XX  XXXX    XXXX      XXXX         XXXX XX      XXXXXX  XXXXXX  XX      XX         XX         XX  XX XX      XXXXXX   XXXX   XX      XX         XX         XX  XX                ;,._                           _,,-                 `;,  `:.  ,   ;.   .   :’  .;` /                  ; `;;,      .:    :.      ,;;` /                   ‘;/    :: :  . ::/    ;` ;                    ).’ __.._`        ’_..__ `./                    /<  \ /I`,      ,’I //                      /   `;-7/_ — /_7-;’   /                    //.    `"’:" ;; ":`"’     /                     |/ .  .:’ __..__ `.     |                     /|: ./. `=_  _=’ .   |/                        /:(/::.  /  .::) /                         ////=-v-’`-v-=\\  fL                         ///`Nx_;;/_xN’\                        / /   `"w==w"’                           /                 "Warning to all: Steve Leyland is a trolling twat of the highest order. Killfile the muppet now and move on. Even the briefest of searches on his past UseNet posts will reveal the truth. You have been warned. *plonk*" Bastard Bear, uk.rec.motorcycles "It’s a bigger shame that packs of idiots can’t keep their profanities and idiocies in groups where such is the norm, but instead have to go crying for attention in groups that don’t deal in heavy cross posting, cascades, profanity, abject stupidity, and every other moronic thing that Steve Leyland, Dean Humphries, and Eddie Bernard represent." Mike Soja, alt.bad.clams

Response:

A GREAT idea. When I was breaking into long runs (over 2 hours) I would run for 10, walk for 1. Felt like I could go forever.  It also gives your legs a break.If it works for you, thendo it.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – During long runs I walk for about 30-40 seconds every 12-15 min.  I use this time to drink and stretch out my arms.  If I’m taking a gel then I walk for about 1 minute to 90 seconds because my frozen fingers can’t get the damn wrapper open fast enough to consume the solidified "fruit flavoured toothpaste" inside.  I’m still fairly new to long distance running, so I find that the walk breaks really help my endurance at the end of my long runs. Sylvia De Silva

Response:

In training? In a marathon? I’m considering 30 sec each mile. I was wondering about the experiences of others who may have tried it.

I’m training for my first marathon, my LSD is only up to 9 mi. but I’m reading Jeff Galloways "Marathon" and he promotes walk breaks.  During my LSD I run the first 3 mi. non-stop then walk for a min. for every mile after that.  When I’m done I feel great.  During my short runs of 5 mi. I don’t walk at all.  I guess whatever works for you, I’m 44 and I don’t expect to break any records, I’m just happy to be out there doing it. Kelly Lee

Response:

I use the run/walk plan, though nothing formal – no timer set on my watch, no strict distances or times. On training runs, I walk a bit every mile or two.  Maybe a 30 second walk, maybe stop to take a leak, or just a quick stretch.  If you do this, you can make your long runs longer and this will be a good thing. In races – I walk about 20 seconds at every water stop.  It’s a brief walk and it lets me drink without gulping air or spilling it all over myself.  I usually run the last few miles without stopping.  In an Ironman triathlon, I walk 30-45 seconds in every rest stop and I get to pass many, many people on the run. Does it work?  Well, that depends on your goals, I ran a PR on Sunday in the Motorola Austin Marathon and made my qualifying time for Boston, so it worked for me.  Clearly the winner of the race didn’t walk 30 seconds every mile. Alan.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In training? In a marathon? I’m considering 30 sec each mile. I was wondering about the experiences of others who may have tried it.

Response:

I’m considering 30 sec each mile.

If you can run a mile in 30 seconds, you don’t need our advice. Bill R. 00

Response:

During long runs I walk for about 30-40 seconds every 12-15 min.  I use this time to drink and stretch out my arms.  If I’m taking a gel then I walk for about 1 minute to 90 seconds because my frozen fingers can’t get the damn wrapper open fast enough to consume the solidified "fruit flavoured toothpaste" inside.  I’m still fairly new to long distance running, so I find that the walk breaks really help my endurance at the end of my long runs. Sylvia De Silva

Response:

In training? In a marathon? I’m considering 30 sec each mile. I was wondering about the experiences of others who may have tried it.

Response:

In training? In a marathon? I’m considering 30 sec each mile. I was wondering about the experiences of others who may have tried it.

You’ll find almost as many approaches to this as there are runners. When I was first beginning to build my tolerance for long runs in training, I did something like you suggest, or more often 1 minute every two miles, during which I would have time to drink, etc. Over time, I stretched the continuous running to 3, hen 4, then 5 miles, etc. Now, in training runs of 10 miles or less, I don’t schedule walks; over 10, I walk briefly 2 or 3 times about 30 seconds each. In my most recent marathon, last Sunday, I walked three times for about 15 seconds each while drinking more water than usual after taking energy gels at miles 5, 12 and 19, roughly. The trick you may find is not to walk at all in the last three or four miles of a marathon or long run–when you MOST want to walk–because it’s hard to start running again. Like drinking fluids during a long run or race, if you walk, do it before you desperately need it. Good luck. Chris

Response:

Question:

SBR Sports is a local triathlon shop owned and operated by local triathletes.  We are located only a few miles from the athlete village.  Our moto is "for athletes by athletes."  We are excited to help you make this Ironman an event to remember.  As triathletes and locals we can offer you an amazing perspective on the course and local culture.  We want to help you be as prepared for the event as possible.  SBR Sports is also offering a bike shipping program. Instead of sending your bike to the hotel send it to us.  We can professionally but it together and insure it is running properly.  We know you have enough to worry about the week of Ironman (we have been there) let us handle the details.  If needed we can even tune it up for you giving you that extra edge.  SBR Sports also carries a full line of triathlon equipment and accessories.  If you forget it or run out check with us and we will have what you need. For any questions please feel free to contact us.  Our contact (801) 361-9425 Again, we are excited to help you in any way we can.  We love this sport and love helping fellow triathletes succeed.  We look forward to helping you. Aaron Asay  Owner & Triathlete Czar Johnson Owner & Triathlete

Response:

Im local….how do I get to your shop? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SBR Sports is a local triathlon shop owned and operated by local triathletes.  We are located only a few miles from the athlete village.  Our moto is "for athletes by athletes."  We are excited to help you make this Ironman an event to remember.  As triathletes and locals we can offer you an amazing perspective on the course and local culture.  We want to help you be as prepared for the event as possible.  SBR Sports is also offering a bike shipping program. Instead of sending your bike to the hotel send it to us.  We can professionally but it together and insure it is running properly.  We know you have enough to worry about the week of Ironman (we have been there) let us handle the details.  If needed we can even tune it up for you giving you that extra edge.  SBR Sports also carries a full line of triathlon equipment and accessories.  If you forget it or run out check with us and we will have what you need. For any questions please feel free to contact us.  Our contact (801) 361-9425 Again, we are excited to help you in any way we can.  We love this sport and love helping fellow triathletes succeed.  We look forward to helping you. Aaron Asay  Owner & Triathlete Czar Johnson Owner & Triathlete

Response:

Question:

find out how long your pool is.  A mile is 5280 feet, 1760 yards, 0r 1600 meters.  That’s all you need to know.  Once you find out

1609.3m, to be precise.   — Rec.scuba strokes pics page: www.jor.com/strokes Aquashot page: www.jor.com/dive/aquashot

Response:

Once you find out how long your pool is, the rest requires only a pencil and paper.

Yes?  Then what?  Just kidding.  That was what I wanted to know… the conversion from miles to yards or meters.  Don’t seem to have a basic dictionary that lists that kind of stuff anymore… then it occurred to me that a yardstick was 3 feet long.  And I remembered that a mile was 5280 feet.  I think it may have been a momentary mathematical lapse.  Probably due to my anxiety that I would also have to convert to metric… Thanks, PG

Response:

s a "length" up to one end of the pool and then back to where you started?  

a length is one end to the other.  a lap is back to where you started. E

Response:

a length is one end to the other.  a lap is back to where you started.

E Oh good.  This doesn’t sound quite as far. PG

Response:

My masters coach told me I should swim double the length. 1/2 mile is 35.2 lengths.

In YOUR pool!  Paula’s pool may be of a different length.  Paula, find out how long your pool is.  A mile is 5280 feet, 1760 yards, 0r 1600 meters.  That’s all you need to know.  Once you find out how long your pool is, the rest requires only a pencil and paper. Give a man a fish, and he eats today. Teach him to fish, and he eats for a lifetime.

Response:

My masters coach told me I should swim double the length. 1/2 mile is

35.2 lengths. Is a "length" up to one end of the pool and then back to where you started?  Or is it just from one end to the other? PG

Response:

I am doing a sprint triathlon with a 1/2 mile swim.  How far is this in the pool (standard YMCA indoor pool)?  And what is the longest distance I should swim to train for it? PG

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My masters coach told me I should swim double the length. 1/2 mile is 35.2 lengths. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am doing a sprint triathlon with a 1/2 mile swim.  How far is this in the pool (standard YMCA indoor pool)?  And what is the longest distance I should swim to train for it? PG

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Question:

Steve – You probably want the Orange County Triathlon Club. http://members.tripod.com/octriclub/index.htm Have fun, gordo

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I have been doing some general triathlon training for no specific event and am now interested in getting involved in a club.  I live in Irvine, CA which is in Orange County (south of  Los Angeles).  If anyone knows of a club that would be appropriate for someone who has never participated in a triathalon (but is a decent marathoner) I would appreciate a response! Thanks :^)

Response:

The Orange County Triathlon club (http://members.tripod.com/octriclub) is a rapidly growing club in your area. Also, Mission Triathlon Club is out your way and are/were based out of Mission Hospital. I belong to Inland Inferno centered in the San Dimas area (http://www.inlandinferno.com), and we see a lot of OC people at Corona Del Mar on Sunday swims. Do yourself a favor and join up with a club. When I first considered joining a club I was a little intimidated thinking that I was going to be in with all these elite athletes. As it turns out, there is no shortage of very fast triathletes, but there is a good mix of all abilities. Best of all you are sure to meet some really cool people who can really help you in the sport. Good Jeff Roberts – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have been doing some general triathlon training for no specific event and am now interested in getting involved in a club.  I live in Irvine, CA which is in Orange County (south of  Los Angeles).  If anyone knows of a club that would be appropriate for someone who has never participated in a triathalon (but is a decent marathoner) I would appreciate a response! Thanks :^)

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Question:

Anybody has the VineMan phone#? I didn’t check in until the race morning and never got my T-shirt. They told me to call back so they can send me the shirt but I lost the phone number. If anyone has their number please let me know.  Thanks — Cheers,

Response:

Anybody has the VineMan phone#?

Race # on: http://www.slip.net/~leeway/tris.html Regards, Lee Lee Rudin San Francisco Bay Area Triathlon Training Sites http://www.slip.net/~leeway/

Response:

Anybody has the VineMan phone#? I didn’t check in until the race morning and never got my T-shirt. They told me to call back so they can send me the shirt but I lost the phone number. If anyone has their number please let me know. Thanks — Cheers,

its 707  5281630  and they are ordering more, call for more info…

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Question:

I’ve been reading Triathlete magazine for three years, and I think I’ve finally had enough.  They are obsessed with the pros,and give little room to things that are relevant to the age-grouper.  (I’m also tired of Scott Tinley’s column.)  I was thinking ab out Triathlete Today.  Does anyone think it is better?    Or — is there a value to Triathlete that I am missing?

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I’ve been reading Triathlete magazine for three years, and I think I’ve finally had enough.  They are obsessed with the pros,and give little room to things that are relevant to the age-grouper.  (I’m also tired of Scott Tinley’s column.)  I was thinking ab out Triathlete Today.  Does anyone think it is better?    Or — is there a value to Triathlete that I am missing?

        Personally, I find the articles about the pros very interesting. Although I may never be able to compete with them, I have gained an immense appreciation for their talents and accomplishments by seeing and reading about them.  All sports need stars to grow, whether it’s Michael Jordan or Mark Allen.  It’s how sports are marketed in this country and it is essential to the growth of triathlon, because a lot of people won’t even get to the point where they understand the magnificence of either athlete’s talents.  They just want a readily identifiable name and face to root for.         As for Tinley, I don’t always agree with him, but I find his column interesting and provocative, without being obnoxious.  I’d hate to see them drop it, if only because it does create discussion.         Just out of curiousity, what would you have Triathlete cover? They already have what seems like a fair amount of age-grouper material in the magazine.  Any more and they’d become a regional publication, because I don’t care to read a lot about age-group competition in Australia, and they no doubt feel the same way about US age-groupers.         Inside Triathlon (formerly Triathlon Today) is a great magazine, and I subscribe both to it and Triathlete.  If age-group coverage is what you want, there is more of it there, as well as a much more complete race calendar.  But, they too, are going to give more ink to the pros, because companies that sponsor pros usually buy advertising. Timothy Gotsick

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I thought commercial posts were frowned upon in rst land. Has this changed in recent weeks? I think it’s noteworthy that IT, the new leader of the tri industry, Competitor or the little 220 haven’t posted 800 numbers or hawked its wares under the guise of a  sob story to the newsgroup. The sport has evolved Grant. It ain’t 1988 anymore. There are a lot of dedicated people involved the triathlon publishing business these days, and more sources of information. Do the other mags get equal time now? or do we just drop it?

JJ seems to have a double standard here!  I also recall, as TJ Fry mentioned, JJ’s efforts to get more personal gain from rst than Triathlete ever has.  He doesn’t hesitate to announce the launching of the "little 220", ask for letters to the editor and so on.  I think this Grant wanted some constructive criticism instead of the empty insults that JJ loves to see on rst(of course after he left the old regime as the editor there before Bill K.)  I hope I dont see anymore ads for the "little 220" anymore after JJ’s last comments. Andy Dell

Response:

Yes I am from Triathlete.

No I am not hiding. My name is Grant Palmer. I just came on a month ago from Sports & Fitness Publishing in Boulder, CO. Yes the old regime is completely gone.<< Uh,uh,uh Grant, not all….not true…this a newsgroup.. come on, out with it. The new staff could make this magazine valuable once again with solid

input. We are a dedicated group that cares about the sport. Please review the May issue. Give me your address and I’ll send you May at no

cost. Thanks for your comments. They are all very helpful and will better the magazine. Sorry we can not send out any more free issues, but you should be able to find one at your local tri store. If not, let us know and we’ll get it there.<<

???? I thought commercial posts were frowned upon in rst land. Has this changed in recent weeks? I think it’s noteworthy that IT, the new leader of the tri industry, Competitor or the little 220 haven’t posted 800 numbers or hawked its wares under the guise of a  sob story to the newsgroup. The sport has evolved Grant. It ain’t 1988 anymore. There are a lot of dedicated people involved the triathlon publishing business these days, and more sources of information. Do the other mags get equal time now? or do we just drop it? Good luck. JJ

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Triathlete Magazine ….. When this word pops into my head I think of pretty photographs  a cover with Dave, Allen, Tinley or Pigg (Are there stats on this) and news which are 3 months old. Someone once told me that you know a town is small, when people read the newspaper to see if they got the story right. That’s how I feel about triathlete Mag. I really just look at the pics. Oh about this maffetone thing aren’t you the guys who published a picture of him with Allen, Pig and Tim Deboom. What’s up with that! Now many novices to our sport are eating fat partly because you guys make this guy out to be some god guru doctor (sorry chiropractor). How about responsibility in journalism. I suppose Allen Pigg and Deboom where no good before he showed up. Lets see if Mr. Maffetone can turn me into a record breaker. But of course if he did you guys would not give him credit. Well, keep up with the nice photos. I saw a fine UK triathlete Mag the Year in Pictures. I wondered how come there was no US version. It’s your strength so use it. I’ll think of more things to say but I got training to do. Luis Vargas

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Sob story? Come again. Just an earnest effort to fulfill people’s requests to make Triathlete the best it can be. P.S. I apologize for the (800) number. I did not know the rules.

Response:

Take heart, JJ.  We’re not telling this guy what it will take to get back our business.  I can’t stand Triathlete mag–too glitzy and full of fluff, even back during your tenure–and I couldn’t care less if it’s free.  I’m just not going back. As for US 220, what kind of premiere issue promos do you have planned? The title’s intriguing and I’d enjoy another magazine (like IT and VeloNews) with some substance. See you in Tampa- Mike

Response:

Grant — Here’s my pet peeve about Triathlete — too much of the magazine seems like a product placement.  Reviews of products are never critical, and generally, they are no more than basic factual information about what is being reviewed.  In addition, a lot of the articles that are in the news section of the magazine read like press releases from the manufacturer.  It looks like if you took out the material that is supplied by manufacturers and sales reps, there wouldn’t be much left.  There is a free magazine in the Chicago area called Windy City Sports that has a couple sections that seem to be made up of press releases.  I’m in- terested in news from manufacturers and sales reps, and I read the stuff in Windy City Sports and in Triathlete.  I just think that a magazine that makes you pay for a subscription should have more. I also think that the editing in recent issues has been awful — the magazine has more typos and other glaring mistakes than a professional publication should. Finally, in my view, some of the swim/bike/run training pieces are repetitive.  Having seen them for several years, it seems rare that I actually learn anything from them (and believe me, I have a lot to learn).  There are exceptions that I find pretty worthwile. I think that’s just a start.  I get more worked up about this when I first get the magazine.  Some of my points just fade into a general unhappiness with the magazine after a week or two. Good luck. Jeff Mazer

Response:

Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive criticism. We are all in and love the sport. All that is on here is either trash talking. Let’s grow up and leave the immature banter for other sports. We are a small sport that needs to ban together to become stronger. Triathlete has been responsible for a lot of the sport’s growth.  Why slam something you love- something that can help your sport. Any comments you make will be taken seriously in making Triathlete the best voice it can be for the triathlon community.

I agree with Cathy Corning about product reviews.  Triathlon equipment is very expensive, especially biking equipment, but there is little, if any, unbiased and comprehensive information available for us when we’re purchasing.  Take some tips from Bicycling magazine (BTW, I have no financial interest in it), which offers very good product reviews.  For example, they may review all full fully suspended mountain bikes.  In so doing they have several reviewers ride all the bikes and then rate them against one another.  Of course you’ll get individual biases, but most of the reviewers will admit them upfront in the article.  What I like even more, is that they will keep riding the bikes and give a follow-up, long term review at a later date. I realize that Bicycling mag already does this, but they rarely cover tri specific stuff, or if they do it’s just a small portion of what’s out there.  Your magazine is in a position to get these products free just for the publicity.  I feel that your current product reviews are little more than free (or are they?) advertisements for new products. We currently get the above information from other people on rst, but the greatest disadvantage is that very few of us have had the time, money, or opportunity to fully test all the candidate products before we buy one. Thanks,

Response:

Sorry, everyone, I forgot to sign the above.         Stacy J. Hills         Code 8222, Bldg 116                     Phone: (401) 841-4504         Naval Undersea Warfare Center           FAX:   (401) 841-2223         Newport, RI 02841                       DSN:   948-4504

Response:

| Yes I am from Triathlete. | | No I am not hiding. | | My name is Grant Palmer. I just came on a month ago from Sports & Fitness | Publishing in Boulder, CO. | | Yes the old regime is completely gone. | | The new staff could make this magazine valuable once again with solid | input. We are a dedicated group that cares about the sport. Please review | the May issue. | | Reply if you care to. Give me your address and I’ll send you May at no | cost. You need to have better proof readers. For example, the latest issue shows a Zipp 2001 with a caption describing it as the Wynn Wishbone (I think that’s the correct name). Such errors make one wonder about the care taken in putting together the other articles in the magazine as well as the accuracy of the information published. One other thing I’d like to see is greater coverage of age group races/results. I’m not all that interested in what Dave Scott, Mark Allen, Paula Newby Fraser can do in races or what race they compete in. I know i’m never going to race against, compete with, or train like they can/do. I’d like to know more about what people who work at a "regular" job 8 hours a day do for training, how they do in races, etc., etc.

Response:

I just took a quick glance at the May issue, and noticed that it has more meat than the last few skin and bone issues. I liked Riccitello’s typically rambling and irreverent comments, the balanced approach to   seasoned-techno-weenies on one hand, and begginers on the other. Rick Niles’and Joe Friel’s training tips are always straight forward and clear. But the Negril piece was too cream-puffy….how about some text? I suggest you take a look at Inside Triathlon and VeloNews (I’m sure you do); the things they do that I like: thorough and professional race reports, with results going ten, or twenty deep; semi-tangential but well written stories like Browning’s multi-sport musings or (in VeloNews) an inside look at mechanics and soigneurs; LONG results from lots of races (it’s great for anyone to al least make it once into print); more thorough calendars of events (you might even include, gasp!, non-sanctioned events). My two cents worth. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes I am from Triathlete. No I am not hiding. My name is Grant Palmer. I just came on a month ago from Sports & Fitness Publishing in Boulder, CO. Yes the old regime is completely gone. The new staff could make this magazine valuable once again with solid input. We are a dedicated group that cares about the sport. Please review the May issue. Reply if you care to. Give me your address and I’ll send you May at no cost.

Response:

My name is Grant Palmer. I just came on a month ago from Sports & Fitness Publishing in Boulder, CO.

Welcome Grant, but I hope you have a thick skin if you plan to hang around. I hope you can improve the mag and not continue the way it has been over the past year or so. I have actually picked up ttiathlete at the newsstand the past few months just to read the articles that pissed everyone off. ( remember someone once said … its better to be hated than ignored. Bruce Platt

Response:

You’re right they don’t identify anybody.  Whose the athlete in their ad for subscriptions (the female running against the setting sun)?  Shouldn’t we get a name there?

Response:

Thanks for your comments. They are all very helpful and will better the magazine. Sorry we can not send out any more free issues, but you should be able to find one at your local tri store. If not, let us know and we’ll get it there. (800) 842-0357

Response:

I thought that the May issue of Triathlete was fantastic.  Great improvement over the April issue.  It is very exciting to see all of the races listed in the calendar.  I am looking forward to a exciting year of race coverage by Triathlete.  Tom Ziebart

Response:

I think the best sport’s mag currently is Velo news.  I don’t race bicycles, but still find their articles extremely valuable and interesting.  Inside triathlon (same publisher) is close, but doesn’t have the depth yet. I am a bit dissapointed when the same articles are placed in both velo news and IT, however.  The formula for success is this: actually test and review products, giving data that readers can use. Cover races in depth and with interesting writing.  Don’t make silly mistakes or publish statements without verifying them- makes the magazine seem very unprofessional (e.g., in May’s issue, calling a Zipp 2001 a Wynn, saying that all Hed wheels have spokes attached to the aluminum rim, when the CX’s are attached to the carbon fairing, and stating that dairy products are bad because they "coat your throat making it hard to breath" {you must be kidding – does Rushton fill her water bottles with milkshakes- whether she said this or you added it, it is unresponsible to publish such crap}).  Finally, never, ever, ever publish photos without captions!!!! Many of your photos are interesting, but I think most readers would like to know what race they came from if not who is in the picture!  Shape up, and people will buy your mag. We all want to read good stuff about being a triathlete, that’s why you’re so charred right now – we are concerned. I personally think that magazines are one ot the best ways to learn about a particular interest (I currently get Bicycling, Velonews, Inside triahlon, triathlete, runner’s World, Swim, and often purchase Bicycle guide and Winning). There, now I feel better. Dr. Todd N. Kenyon Key Biscayne, FL

Response:

: Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive : criticism. : Any comments you make will be taken seriously in making Triathlete the : best voice it can be for the triathlon community. : My list of comments: – Good list.  I would also add:

       Publish it on paper that can be recycled.  That glossy stuff is        getting a very bad reputation among the environmentally concious.        Plus, the glossy stuff is probably more expensive than lesser        grades. : 1. Don’t call age groupers ho-hum. : 2. Don’t claim that drafting is good for the sport and will add new people :    to the sport. : 3. Don’t feed us articles about pros who drop out of races more times :    than they finish and have a thousand excuses for dropping out. : 4. Don’t publish homophobic irrational letters-to-the editor and omit :    publishing rebuttals. : 7. Provide us with a true product review instead of "it’s blue, weighs 210 :    grams, and costs $210" without some substantive performance information :    about the product and how it compares to others. : I think this newsgroup has been rather restrained in it’s criticism. : What I have to say in public about Triathlete mag is quite polite : compared to the comments I have to myself when I’m reading it. – I agree here too.  I read the posts, and they are very tame for the

     most part.  This is both good and bad. It’s good because the content      tends to be more productive, less destructive. This means less static.      On the other hand, true controversy might be inhibited because people      don’t want to get flamed. -RC

Response:

  I loved the column by Jimmy Riccitello, but he also does a column for an Arizona magazine that we get free here in California bike shops.   I agree, it was nice to see a huge race schedule.  In the article about the Triathlete www, did anyone else notice that they didn’t give the location of the site in the article?  The picture shows a location, but later in the magazine the CompuServe ad gives a different location.  I was just wondering…..   I wish that the article about Fernanda Keller had had more flattering photos…she is really beautiful in "real life" but the pictures didn’t reflect that.   One last thing….I HATE the Hootersman ad.  Do women actually do that race?  Yuck.      TriGal

Response:

I thought commercial posts were frowned upon in rst land. Has this changed in recent weeks? I think it’s noteworthy that IT, the new leader of the tri industry, Competitor or the little 220 haven’t posted 800 numbers or hawked its wares under the guise of a  sob story to the newsgroup. Do the other mags get equal time now? or do we just drop it? JJ

I seem to recall quite a long thread about 220. What was that email I think "Triathlete" should be able to defend itself when it gets flamed to all hell on rst. T.J. T.J. Fry                  : "It takes a big man to cry, but Clemson University        : that man".-DEEP THOUGHTS by Jack Handy Men’s varsity swimming    :

Response:

Yes I am from Triathlete. No I am not hiding. My name is Grant Palmer. I just came on a month ago from Sports & Fitness Publishing in Boulder, CO. Yes the old regime is completely gone. The new staff could make this magazine valuable once again with solid input. We are a dedicated group that cares about the sport. Please review the May issue. Reply if you care to. Give me your address and I’ll send you May at no cost.

Response:

Thanks for your comments. They will be passed on to the Editor and Publisher. We are making every effort to be a valuable resource for the triathlon world. Feel free to comment any time. Triathlete Magazine 121 Second St. San Francisco, CA 94109

Response:

Yes the old regime is completely gone.

Yippeee!! Triathlete published a list of former winners at Wilkes-Barre, an IM qualifier race.  That was very useful for athletes age 49 and down.  As usual the results of the rest were omitted. Another criticism I consider constructive: the "People" style of personality coverage is too superficial to be printed. I liked the product reviews written by Justice.  You need someone of his caliber with absolutely no vested interest in the subjects of the reviews. I checked out your site on-line, but was refused for lack of payment. If the New York Times lets me on free, why not Triathlete? You’re going to recieve a lot of suggestions.  I’ll leave room for others. Ruth Kazez

Response:

Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive criticism. We are all in and love the sport. All that is on here is either trash talking. Let’s grow up and leave the immature banter for other sports. We are a small sport that needs to ban together to become stronger. Triathlete has been responsible for a lot of the sport’s growth.  Why slam something you love- something that can help your sport. Any comments you make will be taken seriously in making Triathlete the best voice it can be for the triathlon community.

Response:

Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive criticism.

As one who has "slammed" the magazine once or twice — who are you? I can tell you why I think the magazine is a waste, but I’d like to know whether I am telling this to another triathlete who is just concerned about the level of discourse on r.s.t, or whether the magazine itself is interested in my or our comments. I seem to recall that people associated or formerly associated with the magazine have posted messages to r.s.t without using their real names. I also know that Triathlete has used r.s.t posts without attribution. If you are really interested in my or comments, reveal your true identity, and maybe someone will be willing to talk to you. Jeff Mazer

Response:

Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive criticism. Any comments you make will be taken seriously in making Triathlete the best voice it can be for the triathlon community.

My list of comments: 1. Don’t call age groupers ho-hum. 2. Don’t claim that drafting is good for the sport and will add new people    to the sport. 3. Don’t feed us articles about pros who drop out of races more times    than they finish and have a thousand excuses for dropping out. 4. Don’t publish homophobic irrational letters-to-the editor and omit    publishing rebuttals. 7. Provide us with a true product review instead of "it’s blue, weighs 210    grams, and costs $210" without some substantive performance information    about the product and how it compares to others. I think this newsgroup has been rather restrained in it’s criticism. What I have to say in public about Triathlete mag is quite polite compared to the comments I have to myself when I’m reading it. Cathy Corning

Response:

Looking for comments on Triathlete magazine. Looking for constructive

criticism. We are all in and love the sport. All that is on here is either trash talking. Let’s grow up and leave the immature banter for other

You must have been reading different posts that I have.  Every post I can remember has included several cogent reasons for disliking Triathlete: – fluffy equipment reviews – unhelpful training advice – too many personality-stories – a blurred line between editorial resposibilities and advertising This list comes from my recollection of past posts, not from my opinion of the magazine (I haven’t bothered to look at it for about a year.) Generally the posts concluded with something like "Triathlete sucks." Maybe this is the only part of the posts you remember.  I saw the "trash talking" at the end of the posts more as a logical conclusion of the detailed criticisms outlined above. Triathlete has been responsible for a lot of the sport’s growth.  Why slam something you love- something that can help your sport.

People have been criticising Triathlete, not triathlons. (Although there is a lot of that, too.  See the drafting threads) Which brings me to the main reason I bothered to respond to this… I was originally pissed off at you for daring to even try to censor discussion on r.s.t.  After re-reading my original reply, I realized that you and I were making the same mistake.  You (surely) aren’t trying to censor the net – you are looking for constructive criticism, even though most of your post is asking people to not write bad things about Triathlete.  If you go back and look at the posts about Triathlete, I think you will find piece of constructive criticism in each one; like I did with your post, the first time you read them you focussed on something that was sensitive to you and missed the information you were looking for. Any comments you make will be taken seriously in making Triathlete the best voice it can be for the triathlon community.

Again, it’s good to hear that you are interested in improving. — Dan Reiley, Ph.D.         AT&T Bell Labs    Naperville, IL

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Why would any responsible age group triathlete ever buy more than one copy of Triathlete Magazine?   I seems to me that most triathletes are of at least average intelligence, reasonably physically fit, competitive in nature and would like to have a pat on the back for their effort. I recently purchased a copy of Triathlete Magazine ( May 1997 ) and read it from cover to cover.   What a big disappointment that was.   Their coverage of events made it appear as though only 8 or ten competitors existed in each event.  Just a few Professionals.  No mention of any age groupers, not once.  How pathetic.   Age Groupers are the backbone of the sport.  They certainly keep the doors open on shops that sell triathlon equipment and clothing.   Professionals do not purchase much of this equipment, it is mostly provided by sponsors. I think it may be time for the manufacturers of equipment as well as all age groupers to start demanding equal coverage/recognition for the age groupers.    I have made a pact with myself to no longer buy the magazine until they change their ways.   I have found the only use for the mag is to see what equipment is available.  I can do the same thing on the Internet so no need for the Magazine.   Without age group results it is totally a waste of money.  If it wont support us, why would we continue to support it? Am I alone on this or do you feel the same way?   How about a thread. Ken

Response:

Why would any responsible age group triathlete ever buy more than one copy of Triathlete Magazine?  

I agree … I’ve bought 1 or 2 mags but only for entry forms to races so that I get them early enough to be able to enter. Ummm … As a junior Australian triathlete I would luv to C age groupers N juniors who I C compete week in N week out get into magazines … B/C I’d like to one day B one of the top in the sport, I try not to worship them like Gods [no offence intended] … so reading about them in tri mags is not really the only exciting tri thang I like Actually, there R some age groupers who have awesome stories to tell about their training n raceing experiences. [most of us do hey ] How about some magazine does a cover story on age groupers as a group N then use that as a way to at least write say 5-10 columns dedicated to "non-professional" triathlon *shy shrug* Dindy

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I’m with you on this one. I buy the magazine to check out the new stuff, too. What I would really like to read is more about age group athletes. Look back to last week on RST and check out David’s Hephzipah Race Report. For those of us out there doing this for pure sport (I’ll never win a race let alone get payed), his race report was a lot more interesting than reading about the current "idol" at the latest Ironman. Come down to earth "Triathlete Magazine." Jeff Roberts

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Looks like with the June issue…the one with Zack on the cover…they are undergoing yet another make-over with staff etc.  To their credit they do have Tim Carlson writing for them, who usually does a fine job and will address issues as well as anyone can in this type of "mainstream"(?) press. I’d rather have it than not, though I must admit that RST does a fine and immediate job of "reporting" the sport these days.  Triathlete’s web-site is pretty pathetic. Mark

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Why would any responsible age group triathlete ever buy more than one copy of Triathlete Magazine?  

Well, I guess I agree with your position, but I do like to be informed about events.  Does Inside Tri do a better job of covering events from the age grouper perspective? Bob J Largo, FL

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Why would any responsible age group triathlete ever buy more than one copy of Triathlete Magazine?  

Triathlete Magazine has some excellent writers, Timothy Carlson, Lisa Lynam, Gale Bernhardt jump to mind but by no means are an exclusive list. However, it also has many problems. Despite some excellent writing, (and of course some really awful stuff that has previously been the subject of RST threads), some of the subjects simply have no interest for me. First, I NEVER read about ITU races. That’s half the magazine right there. Second, there is the almost total focus on the few pros. Not much of the magazine features the amateurs, although there are a few things here and there. And, to state a blasphemy, I am really getting tired of reading Scott Tinley. The brief articles that are thinly veiled product advertisements really annoy me. I wish I had positive suggestions for Triathlete. I know there are people there who love the sport and writing about it, and are really putting effort and energy into making it a success. For some reason, it just doesn’t hold much appeal for me anymore. Cathy Corning

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I feel that way. It is beat by far by Inside triathlon. I think USAT is the same route. Their focus is on Olympics, when most of the age groupers could care less. Ther average age of male triathletes is about 37, so you can see that we are the ones who should get some benefit from our membership. Antway I am in agreement with you, and have not purchased triathlete mag for many years.

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<snip things here and there. And, to state a blasphemy, I am really getting tired of reading Scott Tinley. The brief articles that are thinly veiled product advertisements really annoy me.

I haven’t been reading Triathlete Mag. long enough to determine how it compares to other mags, but Tinley’s article in the latest issue takes a pretty good jab at the ITU (of course without actually saying "ITU"). It will make no difference to the ITU I’m sure, but it is nice to see the opinion so commonly expressed here on RST in national print. — Dragon MechE – Nokia Mobile Phones Take out the ‘XX’ to reply by email.  Spam sucks. The man who believes he can do anything is probably right; So is the man who believes he can’t.

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<comments about Triathlete mag deleted Am I alone on this or do you feel the same way?   How about a thread.

I stopped buying Triathlete magazine about 2 years ago. I forget exactly why, other than my dissappointment with the content and the magazine’s seeming obsession with pro athletes. -Rolf — Call me IronMac …                         … I tri …                                          … I prefer Macintosh! IMC ‘94 – 14:06:47   IMC ‘95 – 11:58:35    IMC ‘97 – 10:45:00

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Hey Treemoss, I missed the tread on this message but I subscribe to Triathlon Mag and have been dissapointed with their emphesis on pros, I am what they call a "wanabee", but I love it and am really beginning to be a contender in my age group, 40-44. (this is my second season). I have shyed away from Inside triathlon mag, it costs twice what Triathlon magazine costs.  Maybe I should give it a tri. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I feel that way. It is beat by far by Inside triathlon. I think USAT is the same route. Their focus is on Olympics, when most of the age groupers could care less. Ther average age of male triathletes is about 37, so you can see that we are the ones who should get some benefit from our membership. Antway I am in agreement with you, and have not purchased triathlete mag for many years.

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I see that USAT responded to my comment about their focus on the Olympics and then went on to tell of other things they do. Such as their junior training program – Well I don’t care too much for that either. Seems like there are enough events around for juniors to participate in right now. What help do they need that USAT has to have a program? Or is this just grooming for the Olympicss? Here we are back at that. Age groupers don’t have a program, we do it because we love it. You should all remember that without age groupers triathlon is nothing. There would not even be any pro races without age group participation. Who could come up with road closures, park use, etc. for a pro field of maybe 20? And what of the fees paid that go to insurance. Last year and again this year when I complained about failure of race directors to send in results for USAT national rankings I was told that they are supposed to send them in with their collected one day USAT fees, for which they then recieve a rebate on the race sanction fee. About 30 races that year had failed to do so. So, my thinking here is, are those athletes who paid their $5 one day license fee covered in those races if the director failed to send in the money? As for Triathlon Times mag, which you say is NOT inexpensive, I say get rid of it. It is a thin brief publication that really offers me nothing. Inside Triathlon does a much better job. Officiating is the one thing USAT does that works for the athletes. I have read enough here and participated in enough events to know that is not always done to the satisfation of many athletes. I have often noted that USAT race sanction is no guarantee of a good race. In fact some of the worst races I have ever been to have been sanctioned and some of the best were not. I just did the Longmont Duathlon on Sunday, a non-sanctioned event, and it was run extremely well. There is nothing that USAT could do for that race that it is not already handling. I wouldn’t say we don’t need USAT, but quit your poormouthing and get your priorities in order. The age groupers should be at the top of the proirity list.

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For instance officiating receives a priority

Ah, Steve, I am glad you mentioned this. I am wondering if you have any explanation for why Blackwater Eagleman had fewer officials show up than were promised to the race. Any idea what happened? The officials that showed up did a great job, we just could have used more of those red shirts out on the bike course. Cathy Corning

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I noted Treemoss2’s comment regarding USAT’s emphasis on the Olympics. That is not quite true. Although the Olympic Games are important, and hopefully if they are well done they will attract many new athletes into our sport(s), they are not our principle mission. Actually, only about 10% of our budget is devoted to Olympic development (and it is USOC funded). We spend a great deal of emphasis upon day to day operation of the sport. For instance officiating receives a priority (hopefully you have noted Charlie Crawford’s many postings regarding officiating throughout the country)(and officiating is not free), the development of junior camps throughout the nation (we have six this year and will continue to expand into the future-the camps are meant to attract new kids into multisport so our sport will have a future), drug testing is ongoing and expensive (both in and out of competition-we are making every effort to maintain the purity and fairness within our sport), USA Triathlon Times, our bimonthly magazine is not inexpensive and is often difficult to assemble, the USA Triathlon insurance program is active and protects many athletes, sponsors, race directors, venue owners, spectators, volunteers and anyone else associated with races to keep race opportunities available for you, the maintenance and upgrading or revision of rules is ongoing and not inexpensive….and the list can go on and on. Most people do not recognize the many programs ongoing within USAT or just take them for granted. The reality is that someone or some organization needs to maintain these programs and many others to keep the sport organized and moving forward. I hope this is helpful. Steve Locke Executive Director USA Triathlon

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Ken: Check out the June 1997 issue. You will notice that the magazine is now published by a new group. The President (Mitch Thrower) is a young age group triathlete himself. Please write a letter or call their new office. I am certain this new group is interested in hearing your opinions. Good Luck — Keith Simmons Ironman Triathlon Wetsuits (800) 897-6464 (804) 288-6000 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why would any responsible age group triathlete ever buy more than one copy of Triathlete Magazine?   I seems to me that most triathletes are of at least average intelligence, reasonably physically fit, competitive in nature and would like to have a pat on the back for their effort. I recently purchased a copy of Triathlete Magazine ( May 1997 ) and read it from cover to cover.   What a big disappointment that was.   Their coverage of events made it appear as though only 8 or ten competitors existed in each event.  Just a few Professionals.  No mention of any age groupers, not once.  How pathetic.   Age Groupers are the backbone of the sport.  They certainly keep the doors open on shops that sell triathlon equipment and clothing.   Professionals do not purchase much of this equipment, it is mostly provided by sponsors. I think it may be time for the manufacturers of equipment as well as all age groupers to start demanding equal coverage/recognition for the age groupers.    I have made a pact with myself to no longer buy the magazine until they change their ways.   I have found the only use for the mag is to see what equipment is available.  I can do the same thing on the Internet so no need for the Magazine.   Without age group results it is totally a waste of money.  If it wont support us, why would we continue to support it? Am I alone on this or do you feel the same way?   How about a thread. Ken

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I agree with a lot of the responses about not enough age-group articles in Triathlete Magazine, but what we need to be doing is contacting the magazine, en masse, and telling them how we feel. The new group that has taken over will hopefully make a big difference (let’s give them a chance at least). Personally I have read the magazine for four years before even doing my first triathlon. I find the articles on the pro’s fun and inspiring. My complaint there is that they never covered (in depth at least) enough on Mark Allen. But, I do agree with everyone else that age-groupers need to be better represented. I would like to see a lot more training articles for us age groupers that work the 40 hour weeks, have family’s, etc. Talk more about transition tips and "behind" the scenes types of things. But… my one big gripe? EITHER MAKE A DECENT WEBSITE OR DUMP IT! That is the way a lot of the media is going now, so make that a viable source of info and keep it updated. I want to see on their weekly what is going on, results, etc., not be reading last months news when the new issue is sitting on my coffee table! thanks, mracg

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When this thread started, I was reading my latest copy of Running Times. About two-thirds of that mag is devoted to non-elite participants, whther racing, training, or just living the life. Likewise Runner’s World. Lots of training tips, health tips, and racing tips. By contrast, Triathlete Magazine reads like the sports page of the newspaper. Just Who Beat Who. But triathlon is not a spectator sport, and we are not spectators. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I like the photo’s and that’s about it. TriJay Jay’s World Web Page http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/Field/2336/index.htm

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I like the photo’s and that’s about it. TriJay Jay’s World Web Page http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/Field/2336/index.htm

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I stopped buying Triathlete magazine about 2 years ago. I forget exactly why, other than my dissappointment with the content and the magazine’s seeming obsession with pro athletes. -Rolf

I hadn’t bought a copy in several years, either. But there I was, stuck in the airport last Monday, and found a copy (June’s) at the newstand. The product reviews on water systems and bike computers was pretty shallow. I hd just seen ESPN’s (?) coverage of the Australian Ironman on tv, so it was interesting to read more details. The interviews were Ok, but not particularly insightful. If this issue was the norm, it’s mostly mind candy. I finished it in less than 45 minutes. I probably won’t subscribe, but I might buy a few issues to see if the new ownership makes a difference. Oh, well. It got me through the layover delay. Mike "TriBop" Tennent WebRunner Running Page http://www.webrunner.com/webrun/running/running.html My Model Railroad Page http://www.webrunner.com/webrun/srr/

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In MY OPINION, I think you’d be better of right now with a high quality hardtail and a high quality front fork.  There are only a handful of full suspension bikes that are light, efficient and even worth owning in terms of durability, performance, and fun.  Also, for most races an fs is very terrain specific. You would need an fs if you have a bad back, ride over a lot of rough terrain for an extended period of time, or have a riding style that an fs would suit more than a hardtail. There are plenty of fs bikes in the market, most of them not good choices for serious racing but most of them are very good for general riding and extended training.  Riding an fs bike requires a different style but is easily learned. IN MY OPINION I’d say get an fs bike if you have more than $2500 to spend because that’s what it’ll take to get an lx/xt/judy xc/26lb bike. Obviously more money gets you lighter weight and better components.  But $2500 would get you a hardtail with xt and maybe xt/xtr with a judy sl or comparable fork that would weigh about 23lbs. I ride a Manitou FS and previously owned a Serotta and Ibis hardtail (both steel).  I would never go back to a hardtail.  Hope this helps.

Well, I used to have a hardtail (recently) and rather than spending on a FS I upograded the components gradualy. Then a cheap FS frame came up (RTS1) so I thought I’d try it out. It is a little heavier but give it two weeks and you get fitter/used to it. You also need the time to set it up right for your style and weight.  I went on a long ride this weekend and found that although I wasn’t at the front of the pack on all the climbs – when the going got rocky/muddy I caught up cause the traction was better. I also found that the next day I felt fighting fit – no aches and pains. This I guess, is cause there was less wear and tear on my legs and back and arse. I was sceptical, but I just built up the old frame with the original components and found it very unforgiving, and not nearly so fun to ride. See ya

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  Although I am an experienced triathlete and roadie, I know little   about   mountain bikes.  I am planning to purchase one in the near future.   In   what situations would I need dual suspension, or I am better off   with   front suspension.  I’m in Colorado right now, but I’ll be doing most   of my   racing in Kentucky and Georgia. Given the terrain you’ll be racing in I’d say get a light hardtail w/ a seatpost suspenison like a Thudbuster.  If the bike’s primary duty is racing a hardtail with a front suspension is the way to go.  The bike will be more responsive, less expensive, and lighter.  For recreational use there’s little reason to get anything other than a full suspension bike, but for racing the weight and responsiveness issues are still a big ones. James

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Although I am an experienced triathlete and roadie, I know little about mountain bikes.  I am planning to purchase one in the near future.  In what situations would I need dual suspension, or I am better off with front suspension.  I’m in Colorado right now, but I’ll be doing most of my racing in Kentucky and Georgia. Thanks Dave David J Scott   303-786-3426 http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/8015

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Although I am an experienced triathlete and roadie, I know little about mountain bikes.  I am planning to purchase one in the near future.  In what situations would I need dual suspension, or I am better off with front suspension.  I’m in Colorado right now, but I’ll be doing most of my racing in Kentucky and Georgia. Thanks Dave

In MY OPINION, I think you’d be better of right now with a high quality hardtail and a high quality front fork.  There are only a handful of full suspension bikes that are light, efficient and even worth owning in terms of durability, performance, and fun.  Also, for most races an fs is very terrain specific. You would need an fs if you have a bad back, ride over a lot of rough terrain for an extended period of time, or have a riding style that an fs would suit more than a hardtail. There are plenty of fs bikes in the market, most of them not good choices for serious racing but most of them are very good for general riding and extended training.  Riding an fs bike requires a different style but is easily learned. IN MY OPINION I’d say get an fs bike if you have more than $2500 to spend because that’s what it’ll take to get an lx/xt/judy xc/26lb bike. Obviously more money gets you lighter weight and better components.  But $2500 would get you a hardtail with xt and maybe xt/xtr with a judy sl or comparable fork that would weigh about 23lbs. I ride a Manitou FS and previously owned a Serotta and Ibis hardtail (both steel).  I would never go back to a hardtail.  Hope this helps.

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Question:

Just moved to Darien Connecticut from Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.  Desperate to find other triathletes to train with for upcoming Ironman Canada (August 24th, Penticton B.C.)  If anyone has any information on Triathlon clubs, groups, (master swim clubs)…etc. I would greatly appreciate the info. Thanks Deborah

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Just moved to Darien Connecticut from Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.  Desperate to find other triathletes to train with for upcoming Ironman Canada (August 24th, Penticton B.C.)  If anyone has any information on Triathlon clubs, groups, (master swim clubs)…etc. I would greatly appreciate the info. Thanks Deborah

Deborah,  I used to live in your area during the summer  and I swam with a masters group at the Y in Wilton (just up the road on Rt. 7)  You may find something closer to you but I liked that the pool had a removable roof so we could train outside in the summer. Also, there are great back roads to cycle on between Ridgefield, Wilton, and Bethel.   Happy Training! Scott Scott Herrick Motorola, Inc. Control Centers Engineering Schaumburg, IL

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Check with the Wolfpack Triathlon Club in Monroe Conn.  The team is sponsored by     Cycle Fitness of Monroe.  This group has a few Ironman Canada, Hawaii, and assorted other Ultra Distance Veterans.  Tell them Dave McCluskey had you call, as I was the previous chairman of the group who now lives in N.C.  They are a great bunch of triathletes who are great training partners, everything is there, motivation, encouragement, and knowledge.  Good Luck and tri hard.

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Question:

TORRANCE BEACH CITIES TRIATHALON September 10, 1995 – 7:00 am Torrance Beach, Torrance, California (LA County) For information call the TORRANCE VISITORS BUREAU Tel. 310/792-2343 Fees: $40 Individuals – $100 Teams Payment by check/money order/credit card Open to Individuals and Teams Individual (Men & Women) 12 & under 13-17 18-24 25-29 30-34 35-39 40-44 45-49 50-54 55-59 60-64 65+ Teams Military Fire Law Enforcement Small Business Corporate Open-Men Open-Women Open-Mixed Family TORRANCE BEACH CITIES TRIATHALON September 10, 1995 – 7:00 am Torrance Beach, Torrance, California (LA County) For information call the TORRANCE VISITORS BUREAU Tel. 310/792-2343 Fees: $40 Individuals – $100 Teams Payment by check/money order/credit card Open to Individuals and Teams

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