I log into the RST NG from two sites. At work, I use MSN and I believe the NG setting is for MSNEWS/REC.SPORT.TRIATHLON. At home, I use a local ISP and log into NEWS.AIRMAIL.NET/REC.SPORT.TRIATHLON. Ok so far? Whenever I post from home, I can see the message at work. However, none of my postings from work are visible at home. Yet I get answers so I know the message got posted to the RST community at large. What gives? How do I fix this so I can keep a copy of MSN messages at home? Thanks mucho!
John, I’m no expert (but couldn’t resist reading). I had the exact same problem about two months ago. I did just about everything I could think of and the only thing that fixed the problem was that on the machine where I could not see the postings from I deleted the entire news account from the news reader, including names, server names, everything – made sure the entire thing was clean, and upon re-establishing the news account info and re-subscribing to the newsgroup everything cleared up. You’re not using Outlook Express as your news reader by any chance are you? that’s what i was using. I never figured out why, just assumed by what fixed it that the local newsgroup folders/database got messed up. Took about a month to figure it out. Hope this helps. Mike
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I log into the RST NG from two sites. At work, I use MSN and I believe the NG setting is for MSNEWS/REC.SPORT.TRIATHLON. At home, I use a local ISP and log into NEWS.AIRMAIL.NET/REC.SPORT.TRIATHLON. Ok so far? Whenever I post from home, I can see the message at work. However, none of my postings from work are visible at home. Yet I get answers so I know the message got posted to the RST community at large. What gives? How do I fix this so I can keep a copy of MSN messages at home? Thanks mucho!
does anyone have the web site for vineman? thanks sue
does anyone have the web site for vineman? www.vineman.com
Thanks for the quick reply. But then was disappointed to see there is no info on it except to print out a entry form!!!! Thats already in the mail. sue
does anyone have the web site for vineman?
Inside Tri has it listed as www.vineman,com.
Although I love Russ and his race, their internet presence is lacking to say the least. It might not give you much info, but hey, its better than swimming in that damn river! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – does anyone have the web site for vineman? thanks sue
does anyone have the web site for vineman?
www.vineman.com — Tri-Baby _ – o ’ – __o – </_ ` ‘ – < – __/ /o_ – (()) (()) - / "Real triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie *New to triathlon? Check out Hulaman’s Simple TriTips: http://www.hulaman.com/triathlon/tritips.html
I was so impressed with myself I decided to see if I could hold this new form over a greater distance… unfortunately, it proved too soon for that. After about three or four laps of continuous swimming it all goes to hell and I’m back swimming crap-style.
The total immersion workbook explains a couple of drills that will help the transition from drills to normal swimming. Once you master them, it is easy to switch back forth between drills and swimming, even on the same lap. I’ve done the drills for two or three years now and they become just as natural to practice as normal swimming. The hardest part about the TI program for me is getting more speed. Terry L. explains there is a tradeoff between stroke length and stroke rate. He also encourages swimmers to continue counting their strokes and playing swim "golf" to keep improving. Swimslug
Before I started triathlon I was a runner. Cycling was easy for me to pick up and now its stronger than my running. Swimming was my only problem… I stunk. I’m still young (17) so I know that I have lots of potential. After a year of grinding through lap after lap with little to no improvement (mile still not under 27) I just got sick of it. After trying to seek professional coaching and discovering that it was out of my price range, I bought the TI video and book. I knew that my stroke was the problem and that it needed to be fixed. Today I went down to the pool and tested out the drills that I read about and saw. I did each of the ten drills. It took me about three to four laps to master each one but I got through them. After over an hour of nothing but drills I decided to take my new stroke out for a spin. At first it was a disaster… I had totally forgotten how to swim it seemed. There I was, flailing around doing some sort of half swim – half drill monstrosity. "Uh, oh.. what have I done?? Now I can’t even swim!!" I thought. I went back the end of the lane and tried again. This time I remembered that this was not a drill and swam normal. I counted my strokes as I went… 11, 12, 13… CLONK!!! "HOLY CRAP!!" I exclaimed as I hit the wall much sooner and in less strokes than I had ever done before. After everyone stopped staring at me I tried it again. 14 strokes, then 13 strokes. This was no fluke and my times were just as fast as before I had started this Total Immersion thing. I was so impressed with myself I decided to see if I could hold this new form over a greater distance… unfortunately, it proved too soon for that. After about three or four laps of continuous swimming it all goes to hell and I’m back swimming crap-style. But hey… that’s not bad. I’ve decided to never take a poor stroke again. So for now, the farthest I will allow myself to swim is 200 yards. I’ve still got quite a bit of work ahead on improving my stroke and how long I can keep it up so maybe this TI stuff isn’t a one day fix. But I’m sure that in the end I will be swimming faster and easier than ever before!! — Salvador "holy crap!!" Santolucito
Last year during track with my college team. There were 4-5 of us doing the workout but everyone else was 15 sec to 1 min behind me so I was pretty much doing it myself. 1.5 mile warmup 5*1 mile (4:53, 4:53, 4:56, 4:56, 4:50) quarter mile job between each 1.5 mile cooldown This year I vow to do the same workout but be in the 4:40’s for each. The most memorable was with the same group of guys. It was low 50’s, pouring rain, strong wind with a windchill in the mid 40’s. We headed out on an 8m run bundled up with long sleve shirts, hats, and gloves. An hour later we came back soaked to the bone and caked with mud with only our shorts and shoes on. The rest of the team couldn’t believe us wierd distance guys. We did the same thing everyday till the rains let up. dube
Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its effect on your fitness or racing ability.. Here’s mine (or one of mine): September 27, 1981: A 17 mile total for the day 9 mile run in the morning easy Evening endurance intervals with 2 minutes recovery finishing with hard 200’s. That evening workout was :…(I have it written exactly somewhere..) 1) easy mile 2) 4 X 1/2 mile average=2:45 3) 8 x 1/4 mile average= :75 4) 4 x 1/8 mile (220yds)=33, 32, 31, and an all out :29 5) 1 x 1/2 mile = 2:45 6) 1 mile easy I have often used the mental abilities I learned from training since there…I don’t often have to run sprints between computers these days…but it seems
I recall a work out I did back in High School in the late 1970’s that still stands out in my mind as one of the "best" work-outs that I have ever done. In retrospect it was even "better" than some of the races that I ran at that time or since. This was no doubt because I had the good luck or misfortune(still have not decided this) to train at that time with several of the top junior runners in the country( Canada). I think I tended to over-do it in work outs . Any way, it was a warm late spring evening(no shirt running weather) and we warmed up as usual for about 2 miles with some fast strides to finish up. The work out: 8 x 800 in 2:15 – 2:16 with a one lap(400m) jog recovery. There was a group of about eight of us doing the work out, so each person got to lead one 800. I recall that my turn came up on the second last one. By them I was completely wasted, but I still managed hang on and keep the time under 2:16. Then the last one I was at the back hanging on for dear life. Another memorable work-out was a run through some villages on the lower slopes of Mt Meru, near the town of Arushya in Tanzania. Sepectacular scenery and kids from the villages joining me along the trails. It was about 5 miles up and 5 miles down. Steve Fleck
Best workout? Two posibilities: First: 2 x 1 mile (800m rest in 4:00) No splits looked at, none given ….. Mile one: 4:26 (I thought it was 4:40) Mile two: 4:27 (I thought it was 4:00!) That was a tough one. Two days later 1500m PR in 3:59 Other: 3 sets of 5 x 400m 30 seconds rest within a set, 2 minutes between sets. Set one: all 65’s Set two: all 63’s Set three: 62, 61, 61, 59, 58. That was FUN
Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its effect on your fitness or racing ability..
Mine was a 70/9 (bike/run) mile "brick" 5 weeks before Ironman Canada. It wasn’t fast or exciting, but the run was surprisingly pleasant and it gave me a feeling of confidence that I would actually be able to do the darn thing. Mike Tennent "TriBop" ‘98 Ironman Canada, 16:17:03
: Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? : You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its : effect on your fitness or racing ability.. I tempted to go down the x number of intervals in y seconds, when I realized the workout I would best like to do over was (mostly) different from that. On vacation, I left in the predawn hours, running through the streets of Waikiki. Up a hill to the entrance road of Diamond Head, then up the hill toward the park, getting nice views of the early morning sky. Got into the volcano bowl and decided, what the heck. Up the trail, through the pitch black tunnel (literally by feel), up the stairs, popping out on the platform on the top of the mountain. A woman looks up and says, "You almost missed it." I look out and see the first rays of the sun come up over the horizon. Wow. Then on the way back, a mile at about 5:00 down the street heading back to the hotel. -pfrench
: Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? : You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its : effect on your fitness or racing ability.. 4 1/2 trips up and down a "hill" that is 5 miles and 2,500 feet elevation gain for the up and the same for the return. That’s 45 miles with about 11K up and 11K down over 11 1/2 hours. Ran the first two laps(20 miles) with a two minute break to get two more fluid bottles. The last 2 1/2 laps were run/power_hike with stops to eat, drink and eat some more.. This was my last training run 3 weeks before a 100. P.S. The race went fantastic, 21:01 was my time and at 50 years of age. I don’t think I made the top 10 in my age group. 
— Caveat Lector!
: Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? : You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its : effect on your fitness or racing ability..
It would have to be a 6 mile tempo I did back in 96 when I was training for Marine Corp. At the time I was trying to break 3 hours in the ‘thon and had signed up with Mark Conover for internet coaching. He had me doing lots of long intervals and brutal tempos on the track. The goals were to a) make 6:51 feel easy, and b) teach me to pace myself. I had a lot of trouble with b. The goal was 6 miles at 6:20. Not a couple miles at 6:10, then a couple at 6:20, then a couple at 6:30, but 6 miles as close to 6:20 as I could keep them. It was hot, and nobody else wanted to join me for the whole workout. I talked a couple people into running every other mile with me. The first three went well, but I could feel the fatigue during the fourth. I was still holding around 6:18 going into the fifth mile. When I hit 5 at 6:17 I knew I was going to make it. I realized about halfway through the 6th mile that if I did another lap I could break 40 minutes in a 10K. Hit the 6 mile mark at 6:19, cruised one lap at what felt like a leasurely 1:40 and finished with a 39:30. Physically the workout sucked. Six miles in the heat at near race pace in the middle of the training week was a big physical and mental challenge. I dreaded doing up beforehand and up through about 5 miles. Once I realized I COULD do it I was elated.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? : You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its : effect on your fitness or racing ability.. It would have to be a 6 mile tempo I did back in 96 when I was training for Marine Corp. At the time I was trying to break 3 hours in the ‘thon and had signed up with Mark Conover for internet coaching. He had me doing lots of long intervals and brutal tempos on the track. The goals were to a) make 6:51 feel easy, and b) teach me to pace myself. I had a lot of trouble with b. The goal was 6 miles at 6:20. Not a couple miles at 6:10, then a couple at 6:20, then a couple at 6:30, but 6 miles as close to 6:20 as I could keep them. It was hot, and nobody else wanted to join me for the whole workout. I talked a couple people into running every other mile with me. The first three went well, but I could feel the fatigue during the fourth. I was still holding around 6:18 going into the fifth mile. When I hit 5 at 6:17 I knew I was going to make it. I realized about halfway through the 6th mile that if I did another lap I could break 40 minutes in a 10K. Hit the 6 mile mark at 6:19, cruised one lap at what felt like a leasurely 1:40 and finished with a 39:30. Physically the workout sucked. Six miles in the heat at near race pace in the middle of the training week was a big physical and mental challenge. I dreaded doing up beforehand and up through about 5 miles. Once I realized I COULD do it I was elated.
A 2:58 marathon on a treadmill. As promotion for a research project looking at glucose utilization during a marathon I ran a sub 3 hour marathon in a lab. To facilitate blood extraction I had a catheter in my left arm from which a nurse would draw blood every 15 minutes. In the last half hour the vein collapsed and they had to use a needle which led to some blood flying around. The medical staff was concerned that this would upset me but I thought it was great. I had water on demand and a large fan to keep me cool and of course, no sun, no wind, no hills to worry about. I actually gained a pound during the marathon as opposed to losing the usual 3-5. I also did a TV interview at 20 miles which was fun. As I recall there was a poster of Grete Waitz (whom I had met at an indoor track meet in Ottawa) on the wall in front of the treadmill for inspiration. A number of runners I knew came by at various times to kibbutz. It was without doubt the easiest marathon I ever ran. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html
Its hard to pick out one of the 6000-some runs, but when there is fantastic and special scenery while your run is going well. Like seeing downtown San Fransisco poke out of the fog at sunrise while running in the Stanford hills … coming around a hill where I live now and seeing the snowcapped Rockies front range glowing red in the sunrise …
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A 2:58 marathon on a treadmill. As promotion for a research project looking at glucose utilization during a marathon I ran a sub 3 hour marathon in a lab. To facilitate blood extraction I had a catheter in my left arm from which a nurse would draw blood every 15 minutes. In the last half hour the vein collapsed and they had to use a needle which led to some blood flying around. The medical staff was concerned that this would upset me but I thought it was great. I had water on demand and a large fan to keep me cool and of course, no sun, no wind, no hills to worry about. I actually gained a pound during the marathon as opposed to losing the usual 3-5. I also did a TV interview at 20 miles which was fun. As I recall there was a poster of Grete Waitz (whom I had met at an indoor track meet in Ottawa) on the wall in front of the treadmill for inspiration. A number of runners I knew came by at various times to kibbutz. It was without doubt the easiest marathon I ever ran.
Excellent story!! Mike When good men are silent, evil will reign "In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer." The Thompson of web pages: http://www.teleport.com/~mthomps/Thompson.htm The Barefoot Lizard Page: http://www.barefootlizard.com
: Here’s an interesting thread: What was the best workout of your life? : You can define "best" as fastest, funnest, or most productive in terms of its : effect on your fitness or racing ability..
My best, I’d have to say, is having its effect long afterward, and only indirectly does it affect my fitness and racing ability. I think is was 1993 or 94, anyway it was early in my running "career". I was finishing a three mile run, going up this rise near my house. I felt tired and was just plodding along. Then I looked to my right and it seemed like he appeared out of nowhere. He was an older gentleman and he quickly struck up a conversation. We got to my house and talked. He left with a promise to do some runs with me. He kept that promise. His name is Don Robins. Since then he has helped me in training runs, coached me through two marathons, and told me countless stories of races, people, and places. During a training run he is almost always talking. He has pushed me in races, both by blowing my doors off and by sticking with me. I’ll never forget that training run when I first met him. Thanks, Don, for all the help! Ed — Ed Prochak Magic Interface, Ltd. 440-498-3702
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -When I was 34 I ran a 5:12 mile on a banked indoor wooden track at the University of NC at Chapel Hill in an all-comers Friday night track meet. I did it as my weekly interval training in preparation for the 1981 Marine Corps Marathon. It was my first and only ever competitive mile. There were about 30 runners in the race. I came in second to a 15 year old boy! In November I ran the Marine Corps Marathon in 3 hours and 30 seconds. I had the splits through the 22nd mile for a 2:49 marathon, but fell apart and couldn’t keep the pace up. I think I averaged 6:12 miles through mile 22. Now at age 52 it is a challenge to run an 8 minute mile. I usually run at an 8:45 pace for 5 miles 5 days a week. I am 6′1" and weigh now 180. In 1981 I weighed 162-165.
Yes I am the original complainer…I decided due to rain that I would not show up for the 1998 Danskin Triathlon in Seattle. There are over 2,000 participants. The waves are elites first, then teams, then age groups, and age groups are divided by alphabet. I just turned 40 and am a "W". The way they had wave starts, the race started at 7:30am and I was scheduled to depart at 9:20. I finish in the top 1/3 of the participants however the elites will have finished almost an hour before my start. The second triathlon is put on by envirosports which is coed buy purely alphabetical. I complained also to them, they said if I reminded them the day before, they would let the last of the alphabet go first. My favorite triathlon this year was men starting 10 minutes before women. I didn’t have to swim over any men and I enjoyed passing men on the bike. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I believe that the original poster was lamenting the fact that he/she had a last name that started with a letter in the latter half of the At the two Ironman races I am most familier with – IMH and IMC – the numbering after the first 100 – 200(for the pros and VIP’s) is alphabetical and they alternate years, from A to Z one year and from Z to A the next year. Consequently if your last name begins with W, you may have your bike racked in the back of the transition zone one year, but the next year you may be at the front. As for the wave starts based on last names, in 15 years of triathlon racing this is the first I have ever heard of this. When waves are required, they are usually by age-group(s). Steve Fleck
The organisers of the ‘Super Sprint’ series (about 6 races over the season in Melbourne) say (and I seem to recall, remembering we’re in the winter over here) that they vary the starting order. Pros always go first, and teams and novices are always at the back of the field, but we age groupers can expect early and later wave starts over the whole series. It doesn’t make much difference for on-off entries, but at least it shows the organisers have thought about the issue. Liz
Charlie, Thank you for the clarification. I did not see the original post. Again, in 15 years of triathlon competition, in Canada and some U.S. States, I have never heard of wave starts based on anything other than age-groups. As for the time trial-starts, this is a race format that I have only encounterd once in my 15 years of triathlon racing. I have vague recollections of using a TT/individual start in my first triathlon ever in 1982. It’s not surprising that this format was used as it was a cross-country ski club who put the race on, as I recall. As you know individual starts are standard fare in competitive xc-skiing. However, since that time every race that I have done has been mass start or wave start. It is interesting to hear that "most" races in the South East are conducted in the TT/individual start format. Why is that? Steve Fleck – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : As for the wave starts based on last names, in 15 years of triathlon : racing this is the first I have ever heard of this. When waves are required, : they are usually by age-group(s). Steve, Sal was referring to Heart O’ Dixie and Sunfish which, like most of our races in the Southeast US, use time trial starts. In the case of heart o Dixie and Sunfish, the athletes are sent off in order of age with a sub order of estimated swim times. So at 17, Sal was fourth in the water at heart o’Dixie. That’s nice, but he got passed by lots of folks, which was the subject of his lament. I heard the same lament from my daughter who was 2nd into the water in the water (but first female out!). -Charlie
I participated in the Danskin Seattle event, and I did not notice that we were started by last name within our age-groups although there were 3 or 4 waves of each age-group. I am glad they separated us out a little more because I would have hated to hit the water with 424 other women(which is how many finished in my age-group) for a 1/2 mile swim. I really enjoyed the Danskin event and plan to do it again next year. Kim
You don’t khnow how lucky you are!!! I’m 17… one of the very few young ‘uns in every race… Both races that I have done put waves in order of AGE!!! I really don’t like being the fourth one into the water… Its bad enough that there is noone to follow for the swim and I get lost. The worst part is that the entire race I get passed up by EVERYBODY (lots of people) that will eventually finnish ahead of me, instead of them being infront of me to begin with. It really messes with your mind when somone passes you and their number is like 250… I think, "Gee, that guy is about 20 minutes ahead of me." –Salvador Santolucito III – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to register my complaint over the use of alphabetical order in triathlon wave starts. Both envirosports and danskin are using alphabet for wave starts. I can’t help it that my last name starts with "W" I decided not to participate in the Danskin in Seattle yesterday because Danskin starts waves based on age group and then alphabet. I would have started 1 hours and 50 minutes after the starters. Since it was raining and I was supposed to get there between 6:00 and 7:00am to get marked and get a good space, I couldn’t see waiting up to 3 hours and 20 minutes to start. It is bad enough that we had to sit in the back of the room through school, can’t we get some relief as adults. Just needed to vent
I want to register my complaint over the use of alphabetical order in triathlon wave starts. Both envirosports and danskin are using alphabet for wave starts. I can’t help it that my last name starts with "W" I decided not to participate in the Danskin in Seattle yesterday because Danskin starts waves based on age group and then alphabet. I would have started 1 hours and 50 minutes after the starters. Since it was raining and I was supposed to get there between 6:00 and 7:00am to get marked and get a good space, I couldn’t see waiting up to 3 hours and 20 minutes to start. It is bad enough that we had to sit in the back of the room through school, can’t we get some relief as adults. Just needed to vent
I believe that the original poster was lamenting the fact that he/she had a last name that started with a letter in the latter half of the At the two Ironman races I am most familier with – IMH and IMC – the numbering after the first 100 – 200(for the pros and VIP’s) is alphabetical and they alternate years, from A to Z one year and from Z to A the next year. Consequently if your last name begins with W, you may have your bike racked in the back of the transition zone one year, but the next year you may be at the front. As for the wave starts based on last names, in 15 years of triathlon racing this is the first I have ever heard of this. When waves are required, they are usually by age-group(s). Steve Fleck
: As for the wave starts based on last names, in 15 years of triathlon : racing this is the first I have ever heard of this. When waves are required, : they are usually by age-group(s). Steve, Sal was referring to Heart O’ Dixie and Sunfish which, like most of our races in the Southeast US, use time trial starts. In the case of heart o Dixie and Sunfish, the athletes are sent off in order of age with a sub order of estimated swim times. So at 17, Sal was fourth in the water at heart o’Dixie. That’s nice, but he got passed by lots of folks, which was the subject of his lament. I heard the same lament from my daughter who was 2nd into the water in the water (but first female out!). -Charlie
Let’s talk gender.
OK 
Last coed triathlon I was in had the men 50-54 leaving before the women 30-34. Not to denigrate all the buff older guys out there, but this was ridiculous. This was a fairly competitive int’l distance race with large waves of women 30-34 and 35-39.
First, let me say that I agree with the problem you presented. For some reason I don’t see the same problems in running, open water swimming, or cycling events.
Well… I have seen a _similar_ problem. However, comparing a triathlon to those events is not valid. In most running events, a fast runner can end up caught in the "mob". I see this in many events. OTOH, wave starts in some races (ie Peachtree 10K; 45,000 participants) provide the correct advantage for *all* faster runners — men and women. However, the comparison is still not valid as the triathlon includes three sports in which participants are not equally strong. In cycling, there is no comparison. Everyone rides in the pack unless on a breakaway (or a TT). There is no overtaking slower waves. I have no idea about open water swimming. Time trial starts for triathlons only partially address the problem. Triathlets who are fast runners or bikers, but slow swimmers, will find themselves facing the same problem you described. At first I thought of the following possible solution for wave starts: like a TT start, have participants estimate their finish times. Create waves based on these times (wave 1 under 1:30:00, wave 2 1:30:00 – 1:45:00, etc.). Note that the waves should have equal numbers of athletes to prevent overcrowding and drafting. Pros and age groupers would be seeded together. However, that may not be the answer. Because our sport has three parts, there still is the possibility that stong cyclists/weak swimmers will face a lot of traffic during the bike. Hmmmmm…. I can see no clear answer. However, I believe that coed waves are one step in the right direction. David W. / maybe I’m at the bottom of the results because of my name reply to wuth – family – atlanta (remove spaces) at att dot net
David, I work in marketing, where there’s a general rule that anything that someone fills out in a survey is not the truth. I’ve been in races that use your suggestion of asking people for their starting time, and the result is just as messy as a "normal" wave start. I like the idea in concept, but I don’t think it normally works in practice. As you point out, there doesn’t seem to be a clear answer. Some of the better races that I’ve been in were seemingly random for placement. Lots of times, day-of registrants get dumped in one wave. This seems to work as well as, if not better than, most other methods. Stephan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … At first I thought of the following possible solution for wave starts: like a TT start, have participants estimate their finish times. Create waves based on these times (wave 1 under 1:30:00, wave 2 1:30:00 – 1:45:00, etc.). Note that the waves should have equal numbers of athletes to prevent overcrowding and drafting. Pros and age groupers would be seeded together. Hmmmmm…. I can see no clear answer. However, I believe that coed waves are one step in the right direction. …
Let’s talk gender. Last coed triathlon I was in had the men 50-54 leaving before the women 30-34. Not to denigrate all the buff older guys out there, but this was ridiculous. This was a fairly competitve int’l distance race with large waves of women 30-34 and 35-39. One reason I stopped doing much coed tri stuff is the nuisance value of things like this. My wave is so far in the back that I feel like a second class citizen….OK, pay your $75 or whatever, but we don’t really care about you…just the faster folks up front. I still really like Danskin and other events. For some reason I don’t see the same problems in running, open water swimming, or cycling events. S You really lost me there…what is it exactly that you are upset about? 1) The AGE of the competitors in earlier waves? 2) The GENDER of the competitors in earlier waves? 3) The Race Director somehow NOT CARING about you…because you were in a later wave? 4 The SPEED of the competitors in earlier waves? 5) All of the above? 6) None of the above? 7) OTHER? I dont think there is one universal…most fair method of seeding/starting a triathlon. There are too many variables which can include: Course variables, weather variables, wide ranges in competitor ages and abilities, etc. Why not just realize that on that particular day….for that particular race…you were in THAT wave..whatever it was. Then go out and enjoy your day…work hard…or take it easy…any way you please. As sports go, it seems that triathlons are relatively <fair due to the age grouping and "individual effort" nature of the sport (swift kick to Les McD’s seated, weight-bearing anatomical portion). Based on your brief introduction, and references to the Danskin series later in your post….I am inclined to assume it is the GENDER of the competitors ahead of you that was the nuisance. If it had been the 50-54 women in that wave…would you have felt differently? Please enlighten… Respectfully baffled, gregnelson (who feels like a third class citizen because he not only starts in a later wave…but finishes there as well)
Alright, I had to put my $.02 in on this one, cuz it bugs me too. All of the coed races I have done have started the women’s waves after ALL of the men’s waves. I always thought it would work better if they did men’s 20-24, then women’s 20-24, then men’s 25-29, etc. But maybe I’m a bit partial here, cuz I’m in the women’s 20-24, and I’m a pretty strong swimmer, and I would like to be able to really get out and swim, instead of crawling over all of the guys in front of me. So to me it is a gender issue, but I wouldn’t like it if the put all the women if front either, cuz then it would not be fair to the guys who are stong swimmers. My thoughts, =) Sara Gilliland
Let’s talk gender. Last coed triathlon I was in had the men 50-54 leaving before the women 30-34. Not to denigrate all the buff older guys out there, but this was ridiculous. This was a fairly competitve int’l distance race with large waves of women 30-34 and 35-39. One reason I stopped doing much coed tri stuff is the nuisance value of things like this. My wave is so far in the back that I feel like a second class citizen….OK, pay your $75 or whatever, but we don’t really care about you…just the faster folks up front. I still really like Danskin and other events. For some reason I don’t see the same problems in running, open water swimming, or cycling events. S You really lost me there…what is it exactly that you are upset about? 1) The AGE of the competitors in earlier waves? 2) The GENDER of the competitors in earlier waves?
Some ones got to be in the last wave!!! (lol) B.Oliver
Let’s talk gender. Last coed triathlon I was in had the men 50-54 leaving before the women 30-34. Not to denigrate all the buff older guys out there, but this was ridiculous. This was a fairly competitive int’l distance race with large waves of women 30-34 and 35-39. One reason I stopped doing much coed tri stuff is the nuisance value of things like this. My wave is so far in the back that I feel like a second class citizen…OK, pay your $75 or whatever, but we don’t really care about you….just the faster folks up front. I still really like Danskin and other events. For some reason I don’t see the same problems in running, open water swimming, or cycling events. S – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to register my complaint over the use of alphabetical order in triathlon wave starts. Both envirosports and danskin are using alphabet for wave starts. I can’t help it that my last name starts with "W" I decided not to participate in the Danskin in Seattle yesterday because Danskin starts waves based on age group and then alphabet. I would have started 1 hours and 50 minutes after the starters. Since it was raining and I was supposed to get there between 6:00 and 7:00am to get marked and get a good space, I couldn’t see waiting up to 3 hours and 20 minutes to start. It is bad enough that we had to sit in the back of the room through school, can’t we get some relief as adults. Just needed to vent
I come from a running backround but ran the 800 meters in school. Pacing for a 3 to 6 mile tri leg is so different than the half mile. I am having great problems learing to pace myself for that distance without !) spending myself too early or 2) holding back too much and not running a decent race. Any suggestions on how to learn pacing to improve???
Yes. Get a heartrate monitor.
I come from a running backround but ran the 800 meters in school. Pacing for a 3 to 6 mile tri leg is so different than the half mile. I am having great problems learing to pace myself for that distance without !) spending myself too early or 2) holding back too much and not running a decent race. Any suggestions on how to learn pacing to improve???
I come from a running backround but ran the 800 meters in school. Pacing for a 3 to 6 mile tri leg is so different than the half mile. I am having great problems learing to pace myself for that distance without !) spending myself too early or 2) holding back too much and not running a decent race. Any suggestions on how to learn pacing to improve???
A Heart Rate Monitor. TriBaby — "’Be a terrific innovation if you could get your mind to stretch a little further than the next wise crack." "Y’know, I tried that once, but it didn’t snap back into place." —Katharine Hepburn & Eve Arden in "Stage Door" (1937)
That’s where my swimming buddies are threatening to dump me. Last week I made an undecorous face plant while running in the dark a.m. I picked myself up, let the zero weather take care of any beneficial icing of my chin, and thought no more about it. Last night at the gym I did a little stretching before lifting, and, like any run-of-the-mill over-achiever, I sprained my back while sitting and reaching for my very far away toes. Oh well, what’s a little sprain – been there, done that, learned no lesson. Then I lay down and pulled my knee to chest, but there seemed to be a little lump near the bottom of my rib cage. I pushed my sweat shirt aside; no, that wasn’t it, so I just pushed the lump away. Yep, that was my rib, apparently cracked during the fall and I didn’t feel a thing until I starting poking it. Like any devoted triathlete, I thought an hour on the windtrainer would make me feel better. When that didn’t work, I tried a five mile run, and finally got in the pool to do 15×100 and a stack of 25’s IM with friends who tried to get a straight jacket on me. Now I’m going to hide in the library where I should be safe from myself. Ruth Kazez
At last, an admitted fellow face-planter! I happen to hold the modern record for fall during running, with my most famous involving a trip over the carpet that is used to keep football players’ cleats off the track when they walk onto the field. But seriously, the worst fall involved the creation of a lump similar to the one you described. Going downhill into a turn on a dark autumn night, I slipped on some leaves and wham! — the fall pushed my HRM transmitter into my chest in a big way. When I finally decided to visit the doc (about 3-4 days later), I was in for the scolding of my adult life. Apparently these kinds of things can cause enlarging of the heart and all kinds of cardio-related vulnerabilities. So, let me emplore you to go get a chest x-ray. I’ll feel better if you do. And to give you something to shoot for: You haven’t lived until you’ve wiped out on a mountain trail in front of several cyclists — I think they’re still talking about that one… Take it easy out there- Mike
The decision to hold the sjit on the 2nd was made because nationals are the last weekend in june. in 97, they planning on moving it back to the late june date. the race can be used as a final tune up for nationals or the last chance to qualify for nationals. jon christensen
The decision to hold the sjit on the 2nd was made because nationals are the last weekend in june. in 97, they planning on moving it back to the late june date. the race can be used as a final tune up for nationals or the last chance to qualify for nationals. jon christensen
Does this mean it’s a USA Tri sanctioned event this year? It wasn’t last year, was it? Tri-Baby _ – o ’ – __o – </_ ` ‘ – < – __/ /o_ – (()) (()) - /
: The decision to hold the sjit on the 2nd was made because nationals are the : last weekend in june. in 97, they planning on moving it back to the late : june date. : the race can be used as a final tune up for nationals or the last chance to : qualify for nationals. : jon christensen The folks at J&A called me as a result of my letter. Yes, the move was to avoid conflict with nationals. Although they did not say that they were going to move it back to end of June in ‘97, your statement to that effect is good news. Joe Sventek
Joe Sventek writes: Attached is a copy of letter that I sent to J&A Productions concerning the date for this year’s San Jose International Triathlon. If you feel like-minded, you might want to contact them as well.
Joe, Thanks for the information on SJIT, I may write a similar letter, but I’m sure they won’t changed the date. I have tried to have J&A to move the South Bay Triathlon to another date since it is now run on the same day as Bay to Breakers, the first year it was a Saturday. Steve
This is too bad about the date change. They probably did it because the NAtional Champs are at the end of June in Orange County. I would be surprised if they kept the early date next year. I guess now I will have to travel down south to race at the end of June… myke It was with great dismay that I learned of a 2 June 1996 date for the San Jose International Triathlon from the February issue of The Schedule. For the last several years, this has been an end-of-June fixture on the Bay Area Triathlon calendar. … Joseph Sventek
– Tellmesomethingidontknowtellmesomethingicanusepushthebuttonconnectthegoddam ndots
Attached is a copy of letter that I sent to J&A Productions concerning the date for this year’s San Jose International Triathlon. If you feel like-minded, you might want to contact them as well. Joe Sventek J&A Productions 1032 Hacienda Avenue Campbell, CA 95008 It was with great dismay that I learned of a 2 June 1996 date for the San Jose International Triathlon from the February issue of The Schedule. For the last several years, this has been an end-of-June fixture on the Bay Area Triathlon calendar. For a triathlete wishing to race every 2-3 weeks, the end-of-June date for SJIT has fit in nicely with the other fixtures in the Bay Area: * Wildflower in early May * your own South Bay Tri in late May * Vineman Int’l in early June * SJIT in late June * Donner Tri in mid July * 1/2 Vineman at end of July * Great North Tri in mid August Escape from Alcatraz has floated around; Terry Davis’s Tri at Pacific Grove now looks to be a fixture for mid September, and the Sentinel Tri finishes things off at the beginning of October. Unfortunately, we now have SJIT on 2 June, and Escape from Alcatraz and Vineman International on 9 June. Since few age groupers wish to race two weekends in a row, you will likely see fewer participants than you would if SJIT were scheduled at the end of June. I realize that you have no control over Envirosports or the Vineman organization, and that the schedule is fixed for this year. I do hope that in 1997 you will move SJIT back to its traditional slot at the end of June. Sincerely yours Joseph Sventek
my husband, who is a fairly strong and consistant runner for 17 yr, now is complaining of point specific pain in the rt buttock. A couple of weeks ago he felt a groin, inner thigh pull, and backed off running,and substituted biking (hard of course). We are having trouble telling whether this is sciataca (no radiation) or just a bruise gluteal muscle. Do other bikers/runners have this problem and how long should he stay off of exercise, or what other type of workout can he do. Should he just go back to running (over 40 miles a wk), and stop the bike? MOS
My husband has cronic pain in his right glute muscle. It gets so bad, it radiates up the right side of his back. I say cronic because he has had this pain for 5-8 years. He has had every test known to man and I mean it when I say man because there are places they have put scopes that women don’t have. After all of this, he now goes to a chiropractor and a has regular sports massage. This helps but does not take it away. It is years of scar tissue that is so bunged up, it will take some time to loosen. Stretching was something he never did much of and he has found it does a lot to release and relieve the pain. My husband has run for over 20 years and most of it was long distance. If you take your elbow and find the spot and add pressure yowill actually start breaking up some of the tissue that almost becomes glued together. He has tried stopping running. He has tried swimming, cycling, etc and nopthing really helps. He has also learned he can’t do anymore damage so he still runs a few times during the week and a 2 hour run on Saturdays. He says he has lost leg speed because he finds it hurts to run intervals and a lot of hills but the distance actually keeps him loose. I guess the answer to your question is YES others do have this type of problem. I cannot over emphasize a good stretching program. It is imperative.
my husband, who is a fairly strong and consistant runner for 17 yr, now is complaining of point specific pain in the rt buttock. A couple of weeks ago he felt a groin, inner thigh pull, and backed off running,and substituted biking (hard of course). We are having trouble telling whether this is sciataca (no radiation) or just a bruise gluteal muscle. Do other bikers/runners have this problem and how long should he stay off of exercise, or what other type of workout can he do. Should he just go back to running (over 40 miles a wk), and stop the bike? MOS
my husband, who is a fairly strong and consistant runner for 17 yr, now is complaining of point specific pain in the rt buttock. A couple of weeks ago he felt a groin, inner thigh pull, and backed off running,and substituted biking (hard of course). We are having trouble telling whether this is sciataca (no radiation) or just a bruise gluteal muscle. Do other
<clip Earlier this year I pulled a groin muscle. Because I was training for Boston, I continued to run until I was forced to switch to cycling (hard of course), because the groin became too bothersome. I too developed a pain in the butt. Because I didn’t rest and ran the marathon anyway, it took 5 months to fully heal. When the problems with the groin ceased, the pain in the butt went away. I believe that the butt pain was either referential, or the opposing muscles were being stressed because of the weakness in the groin. I was checked for a stress fracture in the pelvis (negative) and received phiso therapy (no help). Rest, then strength exercises and stretching, and message finally solved the problem.
my husband, who is a fairly strong and consistant runner for 17 yr, now is complaining of point specific pain in the rt buttock. A couple of weeks ago he felt a groin, inner thigh pull, and backed off running,and substituted biking (hard of course). We are having trouble telling whether this is sciataca (no radiation) or just a bruise gluteal muscle. Do other bikers/runners have this problem and how long should he stay off of exercise, or what other type of workout can he do. Should he just go back to running (over 40 miles a wk), and stop the bike? MOS
That’s a tough one w/o knowing specifics and prior history. I’d suggest cross-posting this over to rec.sports.triathlon. There are a couple of MD’s who hang out there who might give a response. Mike Tennent
I own a number of wet suits for a variety of sports including diving, water skiing, surfing and, yes, one especially for triathlons. By far, the highest quality suit (in my opinion) is my QR Quick John. It is the best fitting, most comfortable one I own. In my opinion, it was well worth the money. jsb
I cannot say with greater vehemence that the one equipment purchase that is truly needed to make your entry into triathlon a happy one is the buy a really fine wetsuit. I started the sport on a whim in September 1992. I picked the San Diego Bud Light Olympic distance event. My preparation included lots of running, buying a used Bianchi bicycle for $331, and swimming a half mile and then a mile head up, no goggles, in a Sports Connection pool in Los Angeles. When I went down to San Diego, I planned to swim with no wetsuit and see how it went, but found the water temperature to be 65 degrees. Despite my desire to save money for a sport I didn’t know I would do more thasn once, I got a little scared of the cold and plunked down $200 for a Quintana Roo Longjohn. Thank God I did. I probably would have drowned, or worse, quit, without it. The suit fit beautifully, kept me warm and best of all, helped this poor swimmer to float in a much better attitude. It kept my legs from dragging until I finally took lessons and got a stroke and still helped me when I got my 1500M time down from 45 minutes to 27 minutes. One note: Today I would get a full suit if I could afford it. Twice in the Mikle and Robb’s half-ironman in Ventura and in the Wildflower half ironman the water temperature was 62 degrees and I still experienced hypothermia with the long john. The QR is so well designed I think it would not restrict the stroke and would keep me warm when I really need it and the loss of time in transition would be more than made up for by better hydrodynamics. I would say that if uyou swam in Hawaii with its salty and warm water you would never need a wetsuit. But for me, anything below 72 degrees, however warmn it seems at first, wears on you. Wetsuits let you keep your energy for the bike and run. Shivering through ther swim can severely affect the rest of your day. PS; Quintana Roo stand behind their suits and repairs were made twice in just a few days. Better than the original. They fit great and to repeat it;s the best money you can spend in triathlon equipment. Timothy Carlson
There are a few really good manufacturers of wetsuits specifically for triathlons. Look in Trathlete magazine or Inside Triathlon for their ads, or better yet, see one of the special issues where they review all the wetsuits. That way, you can do comparison shopping without really trying them on. I’ve been wearing a Quintana Roo Quickjohn (shortie) for three years and I love it! All my buddies who own QR’s like em, too. Other brands that win rave reviews from New York area triathletes I know are Wavelength and O’Neill. Good luck! Lisa Valentine Great Neck, NY
I’ve been training for my 1st Triathlon which will be the Memphis in May. I need advice on what kind of wetsuit to purchase. Are there usually strict requirements on what is allowed? What manufacturers offer the best combination of design and price? Any information will be greatly appreciated. I’m in the "sucking up all the knowledge about a sport I know little about but would like to know more" phase.
the following is a wetsuit review I wrote approx a year ago. I have updated it to "suit" the times: Lately there has been much discussion on which wetsuit to buy. I’ve owned 2 Quintano Roo suits (longjohn) and 1 performance (quickjohn). This past weekend I’ve also had to opportunity to look over an Ironman suit, and have tried on a Body Glove Tri suit. So for what it’s worth, here is my opinion: Quintano Roo: This is an EXCEPTIONALLY well made suit. A lot of thought went into its design and performance. I’ve found it to be very comfortable and have never had a problem with rub-spots. I was quite distressed when my first one was stolen. For those Americans who are "made in America" aware, This suit is made, I believe, in San Diego. Some of my tri-mates have had problems with neck rub-spots, but QR has fixed that with their new neck. QR also has an EXCELLENT reputation for standing behind its wetsuits. The QR wetsuit line is in the mid to upper price range for its class and comes in variety of sizes and styles. Available in select stores See their web page at http//www.webcom.com/~rooworld/index.html Performance: This is not a bad suit for the money. It closely mimics a QR suit in its style, but not in it quality. It seems to perform well, but I’ve had a problem with rub-spots. The seams and trim are not as well put together as other suits, which probably accounts for the rub-spots. This suit is made in Taiwan, and comes in only 2 styes with limited sizes. From my own experience and other posts I’ve read, Performance seems to be pulling it from the store shelves and is making it available only through mail order. (corrections to this assumption are welcome) These suits are moderately priced. Body Glove: The quality of this suit is moderate but the price is not. It price range is similar to a QR, but is not near as comfortable or flexible as a QR or Performance suit. I have found this suit very difficult to find (and I live right down the street from their store and outlet), and the size and style range was limited. The material is not "smooth" like other tri suits. Considering its "inflexability" and surface texture, I question it ability to performace compared to other tri suits. To the best of my knowledge, this suit is manufactured in the U.S. Ironman: Not to start a flame war, but this is not only the most expensive, but it was VERY poorly manufactured. The outside seams had spots where the glue separated, and the inside seems looked like they were about to unravel. I looked no further at this suit. Its claim to fame is its performance. But how many performances you’d get out to this suit is questionable. I have no idea where it is made. Best Choices IMHO: If you have the money, get the QR. If you are really tight for bucks and can’t save enough for the QR, then the Performance is the next best choice. I bought the Performance because I needed a quickjohn for the recently toasty 72 degree Southern California waters, but didn’t have the cash for a QR. (I’d just replaced my first QR longjohn that had been stolen) Performance had a bunch in a box that they were sending away to a tent sale, so they made me a really sweet deal. I’d have bought the QR if I had the money. I hope this helps shed some light on choosing a wetsuit. Regards, jo Redondo Beach, CA
Performance: This is not a bad suit for the money.
Just a note: last year Performance had a terrible manufacturing problem with their wetsuits. A friend of mine bought one at the beginning of the season and had to return it after only 4 races because all the seams were unraveling. Performance said they knew it was a problem and gave her no trouble in completely refunding her money. Just make sure if decide to get a Performance, that you ask them if the manufacturing flaw from 1994 has been corrected. Cathy Corning
I’ve been training for my 1st Triathlon which will be the Memphis in May. I need advice on what kind of wetsuit to purchase. Are there usually strict requirements on what is allowed? What manufacturers offer the best combination of design and price? Any information will be greatly appreciated. I’m in the "sucking up all the knowledge about a sport I know little about but would like to know more" phase. Thanks
: I’ve been training for my 1st Triathlon which will be the Memphis in May. : I need advice on what kind of wetsuit to purchase. Are there usually : strict requirements on what is allowed? : What manufacturers offer the best combination of design and price? : Any information will be greatly appreciated. I’m in the "sucking up all : the knowledge about a sport I know little about but would like to know : more" phase. I don’t know of many rules regarding wetsuits in races. Until this year I was trying to race in an old windsurfing suit of my brothers. I’ve seen people in scuba wetsuits with the lumpy surface and all sorts in between. There are plenty of good suits out there. Maybe try renting frm somewhere until you determine that you really want to continue in the sport. One warning…Triathlon is more addictive than heroin! What did I change to this year? Arguably the best on the market! A Quintana Roo Fullsuit. My theory….Why buy a medeocre suit when in a year or two you’ll be lusting after the best. Unlike bikes with their sky high prices a great wetsuit can be gotten for only a few hundred bucks. Happy shopping. TriDork Marcus Perry
Unless absolutely financially necessary, avoid trying water skiing or scuba suits. The water skiing kind do not fit tightly enough and the increased drag is considerable. You will see many very positive comments about QR wet suits. I am in the minority with a ProMotion. It has seerved me well for two years. I have no intention of changing. Swimming is my strongest event, , and to be honest, I don’t llike what wet suits do to my body position: they seem to lift my hips a little too much, but that is a personal preference. Also, evaluate the water temps. A shorty style may be all you need. Steve When the going gets tough, the sprinters go home.