Question:

Does anyone know of good source for timex speed distance watch.  It is $225 retail and I’m looking for better deal. thanks in advance david

Response:

I found it somewhere for $129.95, but reading your question three times made me forget where. Oh well…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know of good source for timex speed distance watch.  It is $225 retail and I’m looking for better deal. thanks in advance david

Response:

www.alsgiftshoppe.com Attempting to keep the knee cartilage intact!

Response:

With SPAM? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – www.alsgiftshoppe.com Attempting to keep the knee cartilage intact!

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Whups, I take that back! I just saw that you actually do carry the watch, and at a very reasonable price! When I first looked I didn’t see any reference to timex sport watches. My bad! Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With SPAM? www.alsgiftshoppe.com Attempting to keep the knee cartilage intact!

Response:

Whups, I take that back! I just saw that you actually do carry the watch, and at a very reasonable price! When I first looked I didn’t see any reference to timex sport watches. My bad!

Your bad _what_?

Response:

| Whups, I take that back! I just saw that you actually do carry the | watch, and at a very reasonable price! When I first looked I didn’t see | any reference to timex sport watches. My bad! | | Your bad _what_? | | Oh you English always giving Americans grief about our slang and our mis-use of the language. As if you lot never speak or write in a manner that wouldn’t be fitting before the Queen! stacy hills reston, va

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | Whups, I take that back! I just saw that you actually do carry the | watch, and at a very reasonable price! When I first looked I didn’t see | any reference to timex sport watches. My bad! | | Your bad _what_? | Oh you English always giving Americans grief about our slang and our mis-use of the language. As if you lot never speak or write in a manner that wouldn’t be fitting before the Queen!

Sorry, Goddess babe! Mark M PS  I was born Danish….

Response:

Hi, I have them for sale at $195 for the 100 lap model a pretty decent savings.  go to http://www.timexstore.com and check them out. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know of good source for timex speed distance watch.  It is $225 retail and I’m looking for better deal. thanks in advance david

Response:

Mark M wrote…

| | PS  I was born Danish…. | How interesting…a mad, Hamlet triathlete! My mother’s maiden name is Jorgensen. stacy hills reston, va

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Question:

I could do a 10k in 3 minutes ! Really ! Oops, I just forgot to say I cheat a little: it is while jumping from an airplane, before to open the parachute. ) Yves. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -If someone wonders how I did run that fast. Well, I cheated a little.

Response:

Oh.  I though it was a reference to the numerous 300 pound linemen who can run 40 yard dashes well under 5 seconds (at least as reported by their college coaches to NFL scouts). —   -Ray Charbonneau The MITRE Corporation – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Miles was referring to one chap who claimed that his college football mates used to run 4 minute miles regularly as warm ups for practice. We never convinced him otherwise.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. Zworque. My bullshit detector just went off :   920 m in 103 sec equates to a 89.6 sec 800 m.  That is a 1:29.6 which would have better Seb Coe’s 1981 WR of 1:41.72 by over 12 sec—hell you could run 920m almost as fast as Coe could run 800m. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches

Not so fast – maybe he ran the first 420 m in 100 seconds and then jumped off a 500 m cliff.

Response:

I don’t know who you hang out with, but in my circle we don’t need to PROVE anything!  If someone has a great time on a training run ALONE and tells the group at the next group run, we believe him or her and don’t question their honesty.  We praise their result as if we had witnessed the performance. After all, what has someone got to gain by lying about their performance? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If it makes you happy: I must have been exagerating too much. I now understand that if I had run that time, I would have been some kind of superman. And BTW if I were *the* Superman, I would have been not too bright, exposing myself this way In the next paragraph I will bow to your awesome knowledge and unsurpassed wisdom: : In other words if you and many others say it is impossible, then it : MUST be impossible. I must have been mistaken, my eyes must have : been blurred and my mind must have mingled up things. It must have, : must have, surely must have, if you say so, it must be the absolute and : irrefutable T.R.U.T.H. I repeat–to avoid any doubts in your minds: I must have exagerating too much. What should I do more to convince you people of my sincerity in this matter, cut off my legs so I will never be able to prove I was right? If that makes you happy I will do that at once …NOT;-) Hope you have more fun running than reading this post. I for one have. Zworque. BTW #1 Results in training may count,  but can’t be proven to outstanders, unless there is an impartial official present. And as you may understand from the text above, *knowing* you got a certain time result doesn’t count. Only if you can *prove* it  to others, a time result becomes something you can mention to others, without the risc of being laughed about or being mocked. If you can’t prove it, it doesn’t count, however sure you are of yourself you are telling the truth. BTW #2 And to answer the person who started this thread. Yes, you can halve your expected 10K time of 2 hours, if you set your mind to it. Just keep on running, run long slow runs and short fast runs, with an emphasis on long slow runs. And don’t forget to do something about those injuries "What," would you ask me? Well we won’t be beginning another war, will we You take it back because you can’t prove it?  Seems you really think you accomplished this impossible feat and someday will prove it.  Get real…admit you were exagerating a little too much! BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!! 6) Abducted by aliens, who implanted false memories To avoid a further build up of disbelieve, let’s say I was somewhat wrong. The distance was OK (I re-measured the distance last Sunday with a bike computer). But I can’t prove the time result was OK. And anyhow, time results in training don’t count, do they? So until I can prove otherwise I take back those words about 920 metres in 1 minute and 43 seconds. Are you happy now? Zworque.

Response:

Gee Zworque, a few posts ago you were beginning to gain back some of your depleted credibility, but after reading this one, I’m starting to think that you really are a legend in your own mind!  Beware of cryptonite, superman. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If someone wonders how I did run that fast. Well, I cheated a little. First the track was straight, so no slowing down by the curves of a race track. Second (most important) I had a strong wind blowing in my back. I never said it was a world record (or better than a world record), some of you  did. Alternatively I could have run from a hill side, if we had such things in my flat country. That would have increased my speed also. Did I fool you? No, not really. I never wrote how this ‘PR’ was established. You all thought it must have been on a race track or something like that. Without all those advantages, my speed would have been considerably lower. Again, at that time I wasn’t interested in athletics, only in a good physical shape. And if I could run that fast, even if in hindsight my time result wasn’t truely a PR in the eyes of an athletics person, I surely was in good shape. And something of that must have remained in my body, otherwise I can’t explain my progress in the last 3 months. People who have done little about shaping their body in their youth will probably progress not as fast as I’m currently progressing. So in my view training fixed schedules (or even group training) is bogus, or at best a sign of weekness from the part of the coach. Everyone should train in her/his own progressing rate and should never depend solely on another person’s training experience. What I ment was that what works well for one person isn’t automatically the best thing for another person. Is this clear now? Signing off. Zworque.

Response:

And results DO count in training! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!! 6) Abducted by aliens, who implanted false memories To avoid a further build up of disbelieve, let’s say I was somewhat wrong. The distance was OK (I re-measured the distance last Sunday with a bike computer). But I can’t prove the time result was OK. And anyhow, time results in training don’t count, do they? So until I can prove otherwise I take back those words about 920 metres in 1 minute and 43 seconds. Are you happy now? Zworque.

Response:

If someone wonders how I did run that fast. Well, I cheated a little. First the track was straight, so no slowing down by the curves of a race track. Second (most important) I had a strong wind blowing in my back. I never said it was a world record (or better than a world record), some of you  did. Alternatively I could have run from a hill side, if we had such things in my flat country. That would have increased my speed also. Did I fool you? No, not really. I never wrote how this ‘PR’ was established. You all thought it must have been on a race track or something like that. Without all those advantages, my speed would have been considerably lower. Again, at that time I wasn’t interested in athletics, only in a good physical shape. And if I could run that fast, even if in hindsight my time result wasn’t truely a PR in the eyes of an athletics person, I surely was in good shape. And something of that must have remained in my body, otherwise I can’t explain my progress in the last 3 months. People who have done little about shaping their body in their youth will probably progress not as fast as I’m currently progressing. So in my view training fixed schedules (or even group training) is bogus, or at best a sign of weekness from the part of the coach. Everyone should train in her/his own progressing rate and should never depend solely on another person’s training experience. What I ment was that what works well for one person isn’t automatically the best thing for another person. Is this clear now? Signing off. Zworque.

Response:

If it makes you happy: I must have been exagerating too much.

Zworque: Thanks for taking this in an upbeat manner. If you haven’t guessed by now, you have suffered the backlash from previous posters. Occasionally someone will come on and post some outlandish claim and then try to defend it as legitimate. Miles was referring to one chap who claimed that his college football mates used to run 4 minute miles regularly as warm ups for practice. We never convinced him otherwise. I got nailed recently when I miscalculated a bike average and made a stupid claim about Ironman bike times. It happens. Mike "To the best and worst of us" Tennent "TriBop" ‘98 Ironman Canada, 16:17:03

Response:

I repeat–to avoid any doubts in your minds: I must have exagerating too much. What should I do more to convince you people of my sincerity in this matter, cut off my legs so I will never be able to prove I was right? If that makes you happy I will do that at once …NOT;-) Hope you have more fun running than reading this post. I for one have.

Whether it was exaggeration, embellishment, or a simple bad key stroke, you took it well. Boy am I sluggish  from my last night’s track workout – 20×440m at 44 to 46 seconds. I usually do them at 40-42.  What me, pull your leg? — Caveat Lector!

Response:

If it makes you happy: I must have been exagerating too much. I now understand that if I had run that time, I would have been some kind of superman. And BTW if I were *the* Superman, I would have been not too bright, exposing myself this way In the next paragraph I will bow to your awesome knowledge and unsurpassed wisdom: : In other words if you and many others say it is impossible, then it : MUST be impossible. I must have been mistaken, my eyes must have : been blurred and my mind must have mingled up things. It must have, : must have, surely must have, if you say so, it must be the absolute and : irrefutable T.R.U.T.H. I repeat–to avoid any doubts in your minds: I must have exagerating too much. What should I do more to convince you people of my sincerity in this matter, cut off my legs so I will never be able to prove I was right? If that makes you happy I will do that at once …NOT;-) Hope you have more fun running than reading this post. I for one have. Zworque. BTW #1 Results in training may count,  but can’t be proven to outstanders, unless there is an impartial official present. And as you may understand from the text above, *knowing* you got a certain time result doesn’t count. Only if you can *prove* it  to others, a time result becomes something you can mention to others, without the risc of being laughed about or being mocked. If you can’t prove it, it doesn’t count, however sure you are of yourself you are telling the truth. BTW #2 And to answer the person who started this thread. Yes, you can halve your expected 10K time of 2 hours, if you set your mind to it. Just keep on running, run long slow runs and short fast runs, with an emphasis on long slow runs. And don’t forget to do something about those injuries "What," would you ask me? Well we won’t be beginning another war, will we – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -You take it back because you can’t prove it?  Seems you really think you accomplished this impossible feat and someday will prove it.  Get real…admit you were exagerating a little too much! BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!! 6) Abducted by aliens, who implanted false memories To avoid a further build up of disbelieve, let’s say I was somewhat wrong. The distance was OK (I re-measured the distance last Sunday with a bike computer). But I can’t prove the time result was OK. And anyhow, time results in training don’t count, do they? So until I can prove otherwise I take back those words about 920 metres in 1 minute and 43 seconds. Are you happy now? Zworque.

Response:

BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR.

To be honest, I don’t believe you. This normalizes to a 1:29 800 meters. The world record for 800 meters is 1:41.11. -Ekr           eTrain – free triathlon training software               http://www.rtfm.com/tri/etrain/html

Response:

BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR.

uh, yeah, right, and i just ran a marathon in 1:58:00. — /*  Mike D. Kail                    |  voice:  (619) 410-3773  */ /*  Unix System Architect           |  fax:    (619) 410-3701  */

Response:

BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. Zworque.

My bullshit detector just went off :   920 m in 103 sec equates to a 89.6 sec 800 m.  That is a 1:29.6 which would have better Seb Coe’s 1981 WR of 1:41.72 by over 12 sec—hell you could run 920m almost as fast as Coe could run 800m. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches

Response:

You take it back because you can’t prove it?  Seems you really think you accomplished this impossible feat and someday will prove it.  Get real…admit you were exagerating a little too much! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!! 6) Abducted by aliens, who implanted false memories To avoid a further build up of disbelieve, let’s say I was somewhat wrong. The distance was OK (I re-measured the distance last Sunday with a bike computer). But I can’t prove the time result was OK. And anyhow, time results in training don’t count, do they? So until I can prove otherwise I take back those words about 920 metres in 1 minute and 43 seconds. Are you happy now? Zworque.

Response:

BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches

Or:   5) Trained with a college football team!!!   Miles – with apologies for dragging out that old chestnut —  "Focus. Relaxed Form. Stay smooth. Flow. Breathe."   – gapo ‘98 Cut the .over.the.rainbow if you prefer to reply by email

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!!

6) Abducted by aliens, who implanted false memories To avoid a further build up of disbelieve, let’s say I was somewhat wrong. The distance was OK (I re-measured the distance last Sunday with a bike computer). But I can’t prove the time result was OK. And anyhow, time results in training don’t count, do they? So until I can prove otherwise I take back those words about 920 metres in 1 minute and 43 seconds. Are you happy now? Zworque.

Response:

Could you repeat that in English please! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on     time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!!   6) A 13 year old boxer (IIRC)  The disconcerting thing is that _this_ time the numbers chosen were obviously ludicrous.  Where would the original questioner be if this fellow hadn’t obviously been wrong?  Thinking that some fantastic rate of improvement was not only possible, but maybe there was something wrong with them if they didn’t improve as fast?  Tempted to overdo to the point of injury in order to match the (fictitous) improvements noted by this fellow? — Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New

Sciences

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. You are either: 1) mistaken about your time 2) had it timed very poorly (maybe the person forgot to start the watch on     time) 3) lying 4) foolish to have thrown away riches Or:  5) Trained with a college football team!!!

   6) A 13 year old boxer (IIRC)   The disconcerting thing is that _this_ time the numbers chosen were obviously ludicrous.  Where would the original questioner be if this fellow hadn’t obviously been wrong?  Thinking that some fantastic rate of improvement was not only possible, but maybe there was something wrong with them if they didn’t improve as fast?  Tempted to overdo to the point of injury in order to match the (fictitous) improvements noted by this fellow?   — Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences

Response:

I am 32 years old. I started running a few years ago, paused when I hurt my knee, recovered, paused during the summer heat, and am now running again. I have decided to enter a 10K race which will be held here in May. However, I think I am very slow: my 5K time is between 45 and 50 minutes (on track machine, with heart rate kept in the zone). That would make my 10K time almost two hours. I feel this can be improved upond drasticaly, and I think I have enough time to do it. Can anybody advise me on what kind of workouts I need to do to double my abysmal speed over the distance of 10K? — "My name is Not Important. Not to friends.     But you can call me mr. Important"  - Not J. Important

Response:

 Getting the 10k down to 45-50 minutes may not be realistic by May. I was in my second year back running before I even completed 10k, no mention of time.  (Granted I was conservative about adding distance. This year, my third, my longest was 20k.  The first year long was 5k. Steady increases _do_ build up.  And they help avoid injury.)  May is 6 months off, so I’d guess (since you’re not starting from zero) that you certainly have time to train to finish the 10k in comfort.  The time, I wouldn’t hazard a guess yet.

I would like to add this: "How different people can be!" Now for some boast on my part: Five months ago I couldn’t walk any further than 3K. Three months ago I couldn’t run any further than 500 m. Today I ran a very slow (and easy) 23.5K in 2.6 hours. I wasn’t even tired. Next week I hope to run a LSD of 30K+ in 3.5 hours at 50% of my max heart rate. And I hope to break the 20 minutes barrier for the 5K very soon. I’m a 38 year old male. My walking speed is about 8 Kph (5 mph), during my last 10K walk (no more than 40% of my max HR). BTW To be honest I should add that when I was much younger, I ran 920 metres in 1:43 (hand clocked). That is roughly 32 Kph, or 20 mph. But I wasn’t interested in athletics then, so I didn’t see any importance in such a PR. Zworque.

Response:

I have decided to enter a 10K race which will be held here in May. However, I think I am very slow: my 5K time is between 45 and 50 minutes (on track machine, with heart rate kept in the zone). That would make my 10K time almost two hours. I feel this can be improved upond drasticaly, and I think I have enough time to do it. Can anybody advise me on what kind of workouts I need to do to double my abysmal speed over the distance of 10K?

  At the moment, your pace is 12-16 minute miles.  This is walking pace, so I’d suggest that you start by walking, rather than running.  The extra impact of the running is not doing you any good, and probably (verify with heart rate check) your heart rate will reach a good training zone by walking.  Go with it, if so.  3-4 days/week of 20-30 minutes walking at pace, repeat until you’re not reaching your heart rate training zone by walking alone, and then start adding in some running.   Getting the 10k down to 45-50 minutes may not be realistic by May. I was in my second year back running before I even completed 10k, no mention of time.  (Granted I was conservative about adding distance. This year, my third, my longest was 20k.  The first year long was 5k. Steady increases _do_ build up.  And they help avoid injury.)  May is 6 months off, so I’d guess (since you’re not starting from zero) that you certainly have time to train to finish the 10k in comfort.  The time, I wouldn’t hazard a guess yet. — Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences

Response:

Question:

Hey folks,     Does anyone know of any good Web sites where I can buy Cytomax and other nutritional products on-line? Thanks Phil

Try here: http://www.athletica.com

Response:

Performance is having a sale starting 7/8/98.  2 large cans of Cytomax for 50$. http://www.performancebike.com Gary McMurtrey Inland Inferno Triathlon Club http://members.aol.com/infernotri/home.htm

Response:

Hey folks,     Does anyone know of any good Web sites where I can buy Cytomax and other nutritional products on-line? Thanks Phil

Response:

Question:

I guess if one cannot trust people to vote only once(after all this is not a presidential or prime ministerial race), can they be trusted not to draft in a draft free race???

As Reagan said, "Trust, but verify." We have Charlie Crawford to do the duty of your cookie in a real race. Rick Denney Take what you want and leave the rest.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Not surprising to me.  That poll has no controls to prevent one person from voting several times.  Anybody who wanted to tilt the scales could just go in there and vote over and over again.  Knowing the attitude of a few people who are anti-draft, I wouldn’t put such a thing past them. I wouldn’t take the "results" of such a poll too seriously "Life’s a brick" "Drafting is not a four-letter word" I have been running a drafting or not poll on the Runner’s Web for several weeks and the results to-date are surprising, at least to me, given the rhetoric on RST. Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM: 43%   No 41%   Yes 12%   For pros only 3%   Does not matter. This poll will close at the end of May so if you wish to express your vote, do so soon. The Runner’s Web Voting Booth can be accessed from our main menu at www.runnersweb.com/running.html. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

Thanks for the follow-ups. The poll has been moved to a site which through the use of cookies prevents multiple voting. Time will tell if this changes the percentages. I guess if one cannot trust people to vote only once(after all this is not a presidential or prime ministerial race), can they be trusted not to draft in a draft free race??? Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

Response:

Not surprising to me.  That poll has no controls to prevent one person from voting several times.  Anybody who wanted to tilt the scales could just go in there and vote over and over again.  Knowing the attitude of a few people who are pro-draft, I wouldn’t put such a thing past them.   I wouldn’t take the "results" of such a poll too seriously.

Indeed. Self-selection is the worst evil that can be perpetrated by poll-takers. It’s a guaranteed rejection in any scientific review. Rick Denney Take what you want and leave the rest.

Response:

Not surprising to me.  That poll has no controls to prevent one person from voting several times.  Anybody who wanted to tilt the scales could just go in there and vote over and over again.  Knowing the attitude of a few people who are anti-draft, I wouldn’t put such a thing past them. I wouldn’t take the "results" of such a poll too seriously "Life’s a brick" "Drafting is not a four-letter word"

Touche, and equally true.  At any rate, we agree that this lack of control renders the "results" of this poll meaningless. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 – 13:04:09 *** http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

Response:

Not surprising to me.  That poll has no controls to prevent one person from voting several times.  Anybody who wanted to tilt the scales could just go in there and vote over and over again.  Knowing the attitude of a few people who are anti-draft, I wouldn’t put such a thing past them. I wouldn’t take the "results" of such a poll too seriously "Life’s a brick" "Drafting is not a four-letter word" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been running a drafting or not poll on the Runner’s Web for several weeks and the results to-date are surprising, at least to me, given the rhetoric on RST. Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM: 43%   No 41%   Yes 12%   For pros only 3%   Does not matter. This poll will close at the end of May so if you wish to express your vote, do so soon. The Runner’s Web Voting Booth can be accessed from our main menu at www.runnersweb.com/running.html. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ken,  Curious to know if you can track the number of times a voter  votes?  Of the 388 responses, how many different submitters  actually voted? -Richd : Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM: :  43%   No :  41%   Yes :  12%   For pros only :  3%   Does not matter. : The Runner’s Web Voting Booth can be accessed from our main menu at : www.runnersweb.com/running.html.

 The 41% yes for drafting seems inordinately high for RST. Hmmm… Chaz

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…  Curious to know if you can track the number of times a voter  votes?  Of the 388 responses, how many different submitters  actually voted?

Nope – no tracking or duplicate prevention. ;=)   Easily done with a cookie, though. Tom

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I have been running a drafting or not poll on the Runner’s Web for several weeks and the results to-date are surprising, at least to me, given the rhetoric on RST. Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM:  43%   No  41%   Yes  12%   For pros only  3%   Does not matter. This poll will close at the end of May so if you wish to express your vote, do so soon. The Runner’s Web Voting Booth can be accessed from our main menu at www.runnersweb.com/running.html. Ken Ken Parker Runner’s Web A running & triathlon resource site. http://www.runnersweb.com/running.html

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 Ken,   Curious to know if you can track the number of times a voter   votes?  Of the 388 responses, how many different submitters   actually voted? -Richd : Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM: :  43%   No :  41%   Yes :  12%   For pros only :  3%   Does not matter. : The Runner’s Web Voting Booth can be accessed from our main menu at : www.runnersweb.com/running.html. —

Response:

I have been running a drafting or not poll on the Runner’s Web for several weeks and the results to-date are surprising, at least to me, given the rhetoric on RST. Out of 388 respondents)  these are the results as of Friday AM:  43%   No  41%   Yes  12%   For pros only  3%   Does not matter.

Not surprising to me.  That poll has no controls to prevent one person from voting several times.  Anybody who wanted to tilt the scales could just go in there and vote over and over again.  Knowing the attitude of a few people who are pro-draft, I wouldn’t put such a thing past them.   I wouldn’t take the "results" of such a poll too seriously. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 – 13:04:09 *** http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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Question:

Greetings teammates, I’ve been happily riding my new softride for about 4 months now.. but after one serious fall, and an overall uncomfortable feeling up front, I’m looking at putting a new fork up front to soften the bumps. Does any body have any recommendations on the fork of choice?  I have been getting alot of people telling me to go with the Kestrel EMS. I’d consider the new rock shox road fork, but apparently they don’t make one that fits 650 tires.  Or maybe the Trek OCLV? Any recommendations… specially from other softride owners is truly appreciated. Regards, Brian Schwartz PS: Anybody interested in buying my Kinesis Aluminum fork (fits with 650 wheels)?? It’s practically brand new.

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I just added the QR Carbonaero fork to my Softride and not only does it look cool, it does soften the ride.  Plus it is very aero, see Triathlete Articlce this month by John Cobb.  IMHO if you bought the Softride for Aero and Comfort, this is the way to go.

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I would not want to increase the stability of a bicycle by getting a softer fork. On the contrary, a stiffer fork will give you more road feel and more confidence. The slightly taller carbon forks (the Kestrel is really the only one that is taller) will increase stability also by decreasing the effective head-tube angle, which makes the trail a little longer. The old Trek OCLV is quite whippy, and I never felt comfortable with mine. I like much better the Serotta F-1 fork which is much stiffer. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Greetings teammates, I’ve been happily riding my new softride for about 4 months now.. but after one serious fall, and an overall uncomfortable feeling up front, I’m looking at putting a new fork up front to soften the bumps. Does any body have any recommendations on the fork of choice?  I have been getting alot of people telling me to go with the Kestrel EMS. I’d consider the new rock shox road fork, but apparently they don’t make one that fits 650 tires.  Or maybe the Trek OCLV? Any recommendations… specially from other softride owners is truly appreciated. Regards, Brian Schwartz PS: Anybody interested in buying my Kinesis Aluminum fork (fits with 650 wheels)?? It’s practically brand new.

Rick Denney Take what you want and leave the rest.

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Question:

I am entered in the Louisiana Triathlon where the water is predicted to be between 62 and 65%.  Its an 800 meter swim and I do not have a wetsuit.  Can someone with experience at this temp tell me what this will be like?  I am a strong swimmer but I am wondering if this temp will be a problem?  Will the cold affect my bike and run? Or will it feel great after the first 50 meters or so? Thanks, "Hoping to place in my age group."

Mike — suck it up man, as a Canadian Triathlete we regularly swim in some pretty absurb temps.  Some hints I have encountered, but cannot testify towards:  tiger balm on key muscles, vaseline (coffee before the swim too?) Bottom line though, if you planning to stick it out awhile in the sport, a wetsuit is cheap and necessary. Good luck.

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I am entered in the Louisiana Triathlon where the water is predicted to be between 62 and 65%.  Its an 800 meter swim and I do not have a wetsuit.  Can someone with experience at this temp tell me what this will be like?  I am a strong swimmer but I am wondering if this temp will be a problem?  Will the cold affect my bike and run? Or will it feel great after the first 50 meters or so? Thanks, "Hoping to place in my age group."

For reference a "cold" swimming pool (legal for USS competition) is 78 deg F.  You could do it without a wetsuit– although the water will feel very cold.  Generally, if you have a strong kick, you are able to survive colder temps since the kick will use a fair amount of energy and hence create body heat. I would recommend finding a wetsuit– perhaps you can borrow or rent one.  If you wind up swimming without one, then I would make sure you get a very good warmup while still staying dry.  Minimize the warmup in the water (this is what a lot of northern open water swimmers do) and kick like crazy for the first 200 m or so. Pat

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I am entered in the Louisiana Triathlon where the water is predicted to be between 62 and 65%.  Its an 800 meter swim and I do not have a wetsuit.  Can someone with experience at this temp tell me what this will be like?  I am a strong swimmer but I am wondering if this temp will be a problem?  Will the cold affect my bike and run? Or will it feel great after the first 50 meters or so? Thanks, "Hoping to place in my age group."

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It’s cold, but you’ll handle it.  There are two main problems. 1) Standing around in the water waiting for the start…minimize this!!! 2) Breathing during the first 100 yards.  You may experience some difficulty inhaling during the first 100 yards or so.  Also, your feet may become slightly numb.  Definately won’t effect your run. I am entered in the Louisiana Triathlon where the water is predicted to be between 62 and 65%.  Its an 800 meter swim and I do not have a wetsuit.  Can someone with experience at this temp tell me what this will be like?  I am a strong swimmer but I am wondering if this temp will be a problem?  Will the cold affect my bike and run? Or will it feel great after the first 50 meters or so? Thanks, "Hoping to place in my age group."

– -rjh

Response:

I am entered in the Louisiana Triathlon where the water is predicted to be between 62 and 65%.  Its an 800 meter swim and I do not have a wetsuit.  Can someone with experience at this temp tell me what this will be like?  I am a strong swimmer but I am wondering if this temp will be a problem?  Will the cold affect my bike and run? Or will it feel great after the first 50 meters or so? Thanks, "Hoping to place in my age group."

What it will feel like? COLD! I did a triathlon in cold water last year and it made me hyperventilate, panic and even gave me chestpain for a little while. Instead of using my so-well-trained freestyle stroke, I just splashed around, was exhausted almost immediatly and my swimming time was awfull. I got a cheap wetsuite at Sam’s wholesale club ( $54 full length, $34 with short sleeves). It isn’t anything fancy, and I will probably be laught at, but to me it’s well worth the money.

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Question:

Does anyone have a description of an interval training workout? I have heard of a good workout to do but I am not clear on the details.   Something like warmup then run 80-90% for (several??) minutes then back down to 60-70% until heart returns to normal.  Continue for 30 minutes or so.  Does this sound like a workout or am I out to lunch? Ken Ken Lancour – Systems Consultant EEE Systems Group Ltd. 1200-865 View Street Victoria, British Columbia, Canada V8V 3E8 EEE HQ:   (250) 385-4333   Education:  (250) 387-6284 EEE Fax:  (250) 385-8371   WWW:      http://www.islandnet.com/~klancour

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Ken, I’m a rookie with my new Polar, but I found a few sources. Visit Inside Triathlon’s web site, an look up "The Schedule". These are usually workout recommendations of Dave Scott, and almost all of them are based on HRM usage. He bases his around your lacate threshhold (LT), or anaerobic threshhold (AT). Terms are used as synonyms. His writing is quite technical, so be prepared to spend some time with them. Joe Friel also writes for Inside Tri, and his writing is much more direct and easier to use. However, AT is still the basis. Try Joe’s workouts first. One workout that I found in The Heart Rate Monitor Book by Sally Edwards is good. Set your monitor’s limits for a 12-beat band centered on your AT; if you don’t know it, use your last 10K HR as a proxy. (If you don’t know that, then I’d get on a treadmill and measure your HR at the 10K pace. I understand that some HRM have trouble with the signal in clubs with TVs etc; my Polar has coded transmission, and has no difficulty.)  Warmup, then accelerate until the lower alarm stops. Gradually accelerate until the upper alarm sounds, then slowly decelerate until the lower alarm sounds again. Continue for a 6-8 minute period; over time, you should be able to do this for 25 min. according to Sally. She calls this the LT Criss Cross. I haven’t adapted it to the bike, but should be easy to do. This workout is intended to elevate your LT. Enjoy! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have a description of an interval training workout? I have heard of a good workout to do but I am not clear on the details.   Something like warmup then run 80-90% for (several??) minutes then back down to 60-70% until heart returns to normal.  Continue for 30 minutes or so. Does this sound like a workout or am I out to lunch? Ken

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Does anyone have a description of an interval training workout? I have heard of a good workout to do but I am not clear on the details.   Something like warmup then run 80-90% for (several??) minutes then back down to 60-70% until heart returns to normal.  Continue for 30 minutes or so.  Does this sound like a workout or am I out to lunch? Ken Ken Lancour – Systems Consultant EEE Systems Group Ltd. 1200-865 View Street Victoria, British Columbia, Canada V8V 3E8 EEE HQ:   (250) 385-4333   Education:  (250) 387-6284 EEE Fax:  (250) 385-8371   WWW:      http://www.islandnet.com/~klancour

 Heart Rate intervals are very challenging. You junk traditional intervals and run purely by heart rate… For example: warmup for 15 minutes at 60% Max HR–watch the HRM units carefully. the run at 85% Max for a variable time…one minute and then walk until the HR recovers to 65%, then go again…reps depend on you and your goal distance. This type of workout is recommended by UltraCoach software and spelled out for you (This is not an ad)

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Question:

     Former professional triathlete and race promoter Patrick Gilbert, 38, of Santa Cruz, CA, died Friday, Jan. 10, of an apparent suicide. He was found dead in the Santa Cruz County Jail just hours before he was expected to be sentenced to more than 17 years in prison for a series of burglaries directly related to his struggles with cocaine and alcohol addiction.      "It’s really a sad, sad case about what drugs to to people," Gilbert’s attorney, Don Kelly, told the Santa Cruz Sentinel in a story that appeared today. "He was on top of the world until a couple of years ago when his world came crashing down."      I’ve known Pat for close to 15 years and can honestly say that he was easily the most natural talent of any athlete I have ever known. He was born to race triathlons, winning the Santa Cruz Sentinel Triathlon three times and dozens of other races. One year he finished second in the Sentinel race against a top pro field on just two weeks of training. It would also be safe to say that he never came close to realizing his athletic potential.      Gilbert also made his mark in Northern California racing as a race promoter. Hundreds, if not thousands, of triathletes participated in his races. He also helped create the highly successful Capitola Junior Lifeguard program in 1984, and coached swimming and water polo at local schools.      In recent years, however, Pat’s personal demons began taking their toll. He stopped racing, then stopped promoting, as he bounced from job to job and between jail and halfway houses. Pat realized he had a problem, but no matter how many times he tried to pull out of his downward spiral, he never succeeded.      "It’s something that I have to take a serious look at if I’m to continue to be a person," Gilbert told the Sentinel in a 1993 interview. "If I’m going to continue to function, I need to operate differently."      Memorial services are pending. — Mercury News 408.920.5273 (w) **** Standard disclaimer: Neither I nor the Mercury News speak for the other ****

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –      Former professional triathlete and race promoter Patrick Gilbert, 38, of Santa Cruz, CA, died Friday, Jan. 10, of an apparent suicide. He was found dead in the Santa Cruz County Jail just hours before he was expected to be sentenced to more than 17 years in prison for a series of burglaries directly related to his struggles with cocaine and alcohol addiction.      "It’s really a sad, sad case about what drugs to to people," Gilbert’s attorney, Don Kelly, told the Santa Cruz Sentinel in a story that appeared today. "He was on top of the world until a couple of years ago when his world came crashing down."      I’ve known Pat for close to 15 years and can honestly say that he was easily the most natural talent of any athlete I have ever known. He was born to race triathlons, winning the Santa Cruz Sentinel Triathlon three times and dozens of other races. One year he finished second in the Sentinel race against a top pro field on just two weeks of training. It would also be safe to say that he never came close to realizing his athletic potential.      Gilbert also made his mark in Northern California racing as a race promoter. Hundreds, if not thousands, of triathletes participated in his races. He also helped create the highly successful Capitola Junior Lifeguard program in 1984, and coached swimming and water polo at local schools.      In recent years, however, Pat’s personal demons began taking their toll. He stopped racing, then stopped promoting, as he bounced from job to job and between jail and halfway houses. Pat realized he had a problem, but no matter how many times he tried to pull out of his downward spiral, he never succeeded.      "It’s something that I have to take a serious look at if I’m to continue to be a person," Gilbert told the Sentinel in a 1993 interview. "If I’m going to continue to function, I need to operate differently."      Memorial services are pending. — Mercury News 408.920.5273 (w) **** Standard disclaimer: Neither I nor the Mercury News speak for the other ****

Although I did not know Pat Gilbert personally, I had only experienced a man with a great sense of humor, and a passion for our sport.  I had heard vague rumors of his problems, and he once said to me a couple of years ago that he wanted to get his act together, and get back to what he loved doing….organizing and racing triathlons.  After he won the Sandman a few years ago, beating me by about 10 yards, he said to me "I’m going to comp. your entry next year, and give you a 10 second handicap"…a perfect example of the sense of humor, respect, and generousity I recieved from Patrick Gilbert. Gregg Trent

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Funeral services for Pat Gilbert, former professional triathlete and race promoter (Northwind Productions) have been set for 2 p.m. Thursday, Jan. 16 at Chapel of the Four Seasons, 1050 Cayuga St. Santa Cruz, CA. Contributions are preferred to the American Red Cross or a favorite charity. http://www.cruzio.com/~woodward …… (500) 447-7910 (home) …… (408) 920-5200 (work)

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Question:

Does anyone know where I can find a listing of road races and triathalons in the New York City area? Please E-Mail me if possible since I do not read this group as often as I should. Thanks -Dave — Call me a liar, you would anyway – The Cure

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V. Bernardo) writes: Does anyone know where I can find a listing of road races and triathalons in the New York City area? Please E-Mail me if possible since I do not read this group as often as I should. Thanks

Call the New York Road Runners Club at  (212) 860-4455 and the New York Triathalon Club at (914) 247-0271.  Hope this helps. Mark "Anything that ain’t a mystery is just guesswork…" — Jerry Jeff Walker

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The New York Road Runners Club now has a webside with our complete 1996 schedule.  Come visit our site at:  http://www.nyrrc.org Tom Kelley

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Question:

How many triathletes feel that this ITU/Tri-Fed push for the Olympics is so important? I’m unsure that it will really help us (the typical triathlete). Maybe more energy and money should go to building up the sport in a more grass-roots way. It seems that Olympic status will only help a few top pros like M. Jones or Spencer Smith,  and a few juniors. What about the rest of us??

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How many triathletes feel that this ITU/Tri-Fed push for the Olympics is so important? I’m unsure that it will really help us (the typical triathlete). Maybe more energy and money should go to building up the sport in a more grass-roots way.

I believe the heightened exposure of triathlon being in the Olympics will generate more interest of its own. Olympic exposure also helps the elites find sponsors. I’ve found too many people equate triathlons with the Ironman in Hawaii. Some more exposure for a shorter, more reasonable distance race will help get people out of the "you people are crazy" attitude. Grass-roots support is also difficult for a sport that emphasizes competence in three different sports. I know of several friends who would try one if they weren’t so afraid of drowning (non-swimmer types). CBC ran (taped and edited) coverage of the World’s in Australia a few years ago. They high-lighted a lot of age-group athletes which I felt was really good. Unfortunately, you wouldn’t have age-groupers in the Olympics. begin{Soapbox} I have been seeing fewer 1/30/8km distance races in favour of more 1.5/40/10km and .75/20/5km races. My own impression is that fewer "average people" can do OD races and the cost and travel bother seems high for a short race like the half OD. IM types may feel different; however, remember that a lot of people(incl myself) take 3+hrs for an OD. end{Soapbox} arthur — Choices don’t scare me. However, a lack of choices does.

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How many triathletes feel that this ITU/Tri-Fed push for the Olympics is so important? I’m unsure that it will really help us (the typical triathlete).

I generally agree with Arthur T’s post "I believe the heightened exposure of triathlon being in the Olympics will generate more interest of its own…" Maybe more energy and money should go to building up the sport in a more grass-roots way.

I think the Olympics will generate new participation in the sport, just like the world cup will do for US soccer. It seems that Olympic status will only help a few top pros like M. Jones or Spencer Smith,  and a few juniors. What about the rest of us??

I have read a few disturbing comments by some of the elite pros lately regarding the Goodwill Games (and these could possibly apply the Olympics).  M.Jones and others have stated that they won’t be going to the upcoming games since they don’t have prize money and allow drafting.  Which of the two is the *REAL* driving factor?  I’m sure every person will have a different reason/perception. I’d be willing to bet that if there was a Hawaii IM type purse and drafting allowed, that those sitting out would surely be there on the line. Tending towards the purist side, I’d like to see triathlon follow the "wheels" (pun intended) of cycling and have elite AMATUERS in the Olympics and let the pros have the ITU tour. — Pat Brug, Ph.D.   Los Alamos National Laboratory "Home of the TriATOMICS" compuserve:  72410, 3372        

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