Question:

I did the first IM USA and no one needed a neoprene cap, although as I remember the race was later in the year. Check the race website for info on water temps. good luck

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The water there can be pretty cold that early in the season. I did a triathlon in Lake George many years ago at that time of year and the water was a "balmy" 62F. A tad chilly; depends on how sensitive you are to that temperature. My advice would be to buy the cap and be on the safe side. If you have a lake in your area, test it out a little. More importantly, bring it to Lake Placid How much warmer does the cap feel compared to a latex one?  I keep forgetting mine, so my swims in San Francisco Bay are bare in the 57 range.  Seems fine, some days the feet complained more.  I’d really like to be wearing socks.  I think I’d find the neoprene cap confining. — Rec.scuba strokes pics page: www.jor.com/strokes Aquashot page: www.jor.com/dive/aquashot

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The water there can be pretty cold that early in the season. I did a triathlon in Lake George many years ago at that time of year and the water was a "balmy" 62F. A tad chilly;<snip

Also the weather can be very cold, did a 1/2 iron therabouts a few years back and the water was ok but it was about 40 outside and drizzling (it was June I believe), I had full fingered gloves, someone offered me $100 for them at the beginning of the bike.  Getting out of that water into the cold air was pure torture.  Be prepared for anything up there. Tim buaidh no bas

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I would expect the water to be low to mid 60’s.  A long john works for me. Wayne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am going to do the Triathlon in Lake Placid on June the 2nd and I wonder if any one know how cold the water is there. I am buying a full wetsuit for this triathlon but I don’t know If I should buy a neoprene cap or not.. Any advice for a newbie in cold waters?? thanks

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I am going to do the Triathlon in Lake Placid on June the 2nd and I wonder if any one know how cold the water is there

I was in Lake Placid this past weekend and, unlike last year at this time, people were actually swimming.  I didn’t test the water myself but the estimates put the water temp in the low 50s.  They’re expecting rain for the next four days which could lower the temperature a bit.  I read somewhere that the race will become a duathlon if the water temperature is below 55. As someone else stated, the weather is highly variable in LP so be ready for anything.  It was 70+ and sunny this weekend but barely 40 and rainy last year at this time. Any advice for a newbie in cold waters?

Get into the water as early as possible and get used to it for 10 minutes before the start of the race if possible. Cheers, Doug "hate the cold water" Fuller

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The water there can be pretty cold that early in the season. I did a triathlon in Lake George many years ago at that time of year and the water was a "balmy" 62F. A tad chilly; depends on how sensitive you are to that temperature. My advice would be to buy the cap and be on the safe side. If you have a lake in your area, test it out a little. More importantly, bring it to Lake Placid

How much warmer does the cap feel compared to a latex one?  I keep forgetting mine, so my swims in San Francisco Bay are bare in the 57 range.  Seems fine, some days the feet complained more.  I’d really like to be wearing socks.  I think I’d find the neoprene cap confining.   — Rec.scuba strokes pics page: www.jor.com/strokes Aquashot page: www.jor.com/dive/aquashot

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I am going to do the Triathlon in Lake Placid on June the 2nd and I wonder if any one know how cold the water is there. I am buying a full wetsuit for this triathlon but I don’t know If I should buy a neoprene cap or not.. Any advice for a newbie in cold waters?? thanks

The water there can be pretty cold that early in the season. I did a triathlon in Lake George many years ago at that time of year and the water was a "balmy" 62F. A tad chilly; depends on how sensitive you are to that temperature. My advice would be to buy the cap and be on the safe side. If you have a lake in your area, test it out a little. More importantly, bring it to Lake Placid with you. You should be able to swim a little bit the day before the race. Swim with and without the cap; you will get a good feeling what equipment you will need for race day. Hope this helps.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMC’99: 10:45:03          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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I am going to do the Triathlon in Lake Placid on June the 2nd and I wonder if any one know how cold the water is there. I am buying a full wetsuit for this triathlon but I don’t know If I should buy a neoprene cap or not.. Any advice for a newbie in cold waters?? thanks

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Question:

What is the deal with carbon forks??   Is it a weight issue? An areo thing?  Just wondering since the fork is only about 1/4 of the total weight and carries only a fraction of the cyclist’s weight..  Is that it?  Since there isn’t a lot of weight being supported by the fork the manufactures can shave total bike weight by making the fork out of a light weight, somewhat durable material?  Just curious. Ian

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Carbon forks do tend to be a bit lighter than a comparable all aluminum or steel fork, though a good ‘ol Kinesis Road-D will always be lighter than a Carbonaero. They also tend to pretty stiff in torsion which amkes them corner very well.  Not so much of a concern for a triathlete, but pretty nice if you’re a criterium racer. In addition, carbon has excellent damping characteristics to help smooth out the ride. Regarding aerodynamics, I don’t think carbon fiber forks were developed with this in mind.  But the lack of tubing constraints means that you can make some pretty slick forks out of composites.  While I believe that the fastest widely available forks to date are the steel Schwin Varsity and the aluminum Hooker, I feel that eventually a carbon fork will be available that beats them both.  Maybe something similar to the Lotus "one-leg" from a few years back… Hope this helps What is the deal with carbon forks??   Is it a weight issue? An areo thing?  Just wondering since the fork is only about 1/4 of the total weight and carries only a fraction of the cyclist’s weight..  Is that it?  Since there isn’t a lot of weight being supported by the fork the manufactures can shave total bike weight by making the fork out of a light weight, somewhat durable material?  Just curious. Ian

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Carbon forks do tend to be a bit lighter than a comparable all aluminum or steel fork, though a good ‘ol Kinesis Road-D will always be lighter than a Carbonaero. They also tend to pretty stiff in torsion which amkes them corner very well.  Not so much of a concern for a triathlete, but pretty nice if you’re a criterium racer. In addition, carbon has excellent damping characteristics to help smooth out the ride. Regarding aerodynamics, I don’t think carbon fiber forks were developed with this in mind.  But the lack of tubing constraints means that you can make some pretty slick forks out of composites.  While I believe that the fastest widely available forks to date are the steel Schwin Varsity and the aluminum Hooker, I feel that eventually a carbon fork will be available that beats them both.  Maybe something similar to the Lotus "one-leg" from a few years back… Hope this helps

I’ve heard the same about the Schwinn Varsity forks.  Hooker forks, though, are cro-moly.  They are chromed in appearance though, which may be why people believe they are aluminum. IIRC, Lotus found that their regular fork was just as *fast* as the monoblade, but a lot lighter.  Don’t know about handling differences, if any. Dave

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Question:

It’s still on – race confirmation cards came out in Monday’s mail.

Also, the Set-up Inc phone recording (9/27/99) notes that the lake has been tested for health reasons and got a clean review. I hope that doesn’t change with the storms that are going through today and Thursday… See you there!!! David / FEY2K – IMCAL reply to wuth – family – atlanta (remove spaces) at att dot net

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Does anyone know if this race is still on?  Since hearing about all the storms in NC I was wondering…. thanks Steve Before you buy.

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It’s still on. The area in which the race is held is hilly enough that all this rain runs off, much to the detriment of folks down east, who eventually receive ours. I rode the bike course last Sunday, and it’s fine. We’ve had a few more inches of rain in the past 48 hours, but it shouldn’t cause problems (here). Jordan Lake is likely to be more full (and muddy) than normal for this time of year, but, other than that, the rain should mostly be beneficial (here)–as long as it stops! By the way, who’s coming? I’ve exchanged mail with David Wuth, and Mike Tennent has mentioned that some friends of his will be coming. Assuming that it’s not too chilly for singlets, I’ll be the 50ish guy (6′2". 170 lb.) in the rec.sport.triathlon singlet. David (Fe2O3man, IMC 2000) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know if this race is still on?  Since hearing about all the storms in NC I was wondering…. thanks Steve Before you buy.

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It’s still on – race confirmation cards came out in Monday’s mail. — Bernie Hall                                            o                         __o          </_                         <        __ /       /o__      (0)  (0)           /

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David, I’ll be there.  It’s going to be a little chilly hopping on the bike Sunday morning.  They’re predicting a low of around 50.  The course is pretty shady in the a.m., too.  I’m not looking forward to that. I’ll be biking on a black Roadwing, and running in a black Speedo and my infamous white Wal-Mart hat. Are any really fast guys coming?  Hagen is gone of course, but there’s always Yon, Forstner, Curwen, etc. to keep things honest.  Heck, Kotland may even show up. Before you buy.

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Question:

I’m hoping to enter a triathlon this year (my first).  I have been intrigued by triathlons since ABC began airing the Ironman who know’s how many years ago.   I have heard a great deal of a little triathlon in Welland Ontario Canada that is supposed to be good for beginners (and is 20 minutes from my home).  Does anyone here know if the event is still run and how to get a hold of the comittee?  And if it is no longer ran does anyone know of a triathlon in the not too distant area?   Thanks alot   Larry —         Larry Ross Storm Founding member Masters of the 55 yard line                                                           Member: National Hockey League Fan Association Habitat for Humanity Niagara Web Site http://www.vaxxine.com/habitat/                    If Angelo Mosca ISN’T GOD!  He sure is close!

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Larry: Check out www.trisportcanada.com They run a number of races in southern Ontario including one in Niagara on the Lake. If you don’t mind a little travel, they also have a great event in Milton and the Guelph race is terrific with its multiple distances, huge crowds of participants and nice country roads to ride. The Welland race was a memorial fundraiser event & I can’t recall the title, but I’ll bet the Welland Chamber of Commerce can tell you if it’s still running. Hope you find & enjoy a terrific event! Aha! Found it! It used to be called The Mike Burwell Memorial Triathlon. The only info. I have dates back to 1997 when it was also a Trisport event, but it’s not on their sched. this year. You might want to also try calling Trisport in Grimsby to see if they might know. Sorry, I’ve been away from S. Ontario for a year now, so am not the most up to date!<G Paul – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m hoping to enter a triathlon this year (my first).  I have been intrigued by triathlons since ABC began airing the Ironman who know’s how many years ago.  I have heard a great deal of a little triathlon in Welland Ontario Canada that is supposed to be good for beginners (and is 20 minutes from my home).  Does anyone here know if the event is still run and how to get a hold of the comittee?  And if it is no longer ran does anyone know of a triathlon in the not too distant area?  Thanks alot  Larry —        Larry Ross Storm Founding member Masters of the 55 yard line                                                          Member: National Hockey League Fan Association Habitat for Humanity Niagara Web Site http://www.vaxxine.com/habitat/                   If Angelo Mosca ISN’T GOD!  He sure is close!

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Question:

About two months ago I posted a long message concerning a bike accident that I was in in September that destroyed my bike. I have only recently been able to start running again. Although .I feel fine when I run, the day afterwards I have cramps and severe soarness in my lower legs. The pain seems to start right around the back of my knee down to my foot.The pain seems to last for about a day and a half after a normal running workout that shouldn’t give me any problems. I have never had this problem before even when I first started triathlon.At first I thought I just needed new shoes, nope (I got new shoes and the pain is stll there). Then I thought that I just needed to stretch. Nope (I strech liberally before and after my workouts). Is this pain due to my recovery from my bike accident? Is there anyhting that I can do to get rid of it?  Any info is welcomed. Thanks  -David Clifford- San Jose, CA

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Dave, it is unlikely that your pain lasts for 3 months. I had similar problems: -1- are you overtrained? -2- decrease your training hours / why not two weeks off? -3- do you really practice streching consequently? if -1- to -3- is NO then: -4- do "under water running" – wearing a life-jacket good luck, Peter, Linz/Austria Dclifford1 schrieb in Nachricht – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -About two months ago I posted a long message concerning a bike accident that I was in in September that destroyed my bike. I have only recently been able to start running again. Although .I feel fine when I run, the day afterwards I have cramps and severe soarness in my lower legs. The pain seems to start right around the back of my knee down to my foot.The pain seems to last for about a day and a half after a normal running workout that shouldn’t give me any problems. I have never had this problem before even when I first started triathlon.At first I thought I just needed new shoes, nope (I got new shoes and the pain is stll there). Then I thought that I just needed to stretch. Nope (I strech liberally before and after my workouts). Is this pain due to my recovery from my bike accident? Is there anyhting that I can do to get rid of it? Any info is welcomed. Thanks -David Clifford- San Jose, CA

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Question:

Personally, I picked the only ironman I’ve done-  Great Floridian, as a test to see if I could really complete an ironman.  I met many other first time triathletes, many middle or back of the packers who would never be able to ‘qualify’!  One guy I met was not only doing his first ironman, but his second ever triathlon!  We are the people who enjoy racing for the challange of proving to ourselves that we can ‘do it’!!  I see no merit in excluding these people from setting these goals by forcing them to qualify (since the odds are they won’t be able to qualify!).  Yes, there is a lottery option, but this is unreliable. I guess I miss the point as to why there should be a qualifying race to get into a non-IMH anyway?!?!?! If we instituted half-ironman qualifiers for IM races, some of which are IMH qualifiers, it would limit participation of the average joe-  If the problem is a rush for spots in IM qualifiers, that’s another issue? Larry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I really like the idea of having qualifying races for the various non-IMH ironman races in US and Canada. I still can’t warm up to this idea.  I guess because I’m a slug.  If I had to qualify to do an Ironman, I’d never get to do one.  In fact, I was moved to sign up for my first Ironman Canada by rumors that they were going to implement a qualifying process for the race—I figured if I didn’t jump and do it right away while it was still an "open" event, I’d lose my chance of ever doing it. I would only buy off on it if there was still a portion of lottery spots for each event. Yeah, I guess that helps. I think that by having qualifying races for the Ironman races, it eliminates the ridiculous current situation of the internet contest or post office contest method of gaining entry to a race. I agree, the reg-rush is pretty ridiculous.  But at the same time, I think we should be cautious about assuming that the current IM racing craze will continue indefinitely.  What I mean is, if a knee-jerk reaction to the current frenzy results in such a tough qualifying process as you propose, and then Ironman mania suddenly dies down, we’ll find we’ve shot ourselves in the foot by making it so tough to get into an Ironman.  Does that make sense? I’m cautious about this for a couple of reasons.  One is the sudden proliferation of Ironman distance races in the US.  I’m not 100% certain that the sport can support that many IM’s just yet.  The other reason is that I know of at least one IM-distance race that *is* an IMQ that does not have overwhelming registration every year:  Vineman.  I don’t know why, but the full Vineman never has more than about 350 participants each year.  That’s a far cry from the 1,000 or more doing GFT. This is interesting because Vineman is certainly in a beautiful location, and is a reasonably well-run event.  I’m not sure why GFT gets so many more participants.  I don’t *think* that the Vineman registration is limited, but I could be wrong. All of this simply means that I view the current IM rush with a little skepticism and caution.  I think the sport needs to wait and see if this trend has "legs" before reacting too quickly. Again, this boils down to Ironman/triathlon "growing pains."  We used to be such a fringe sport that we never could have imagined such demand for Ironman racing.  I don’t think anyone ever expected we’d be in the position of having to *limit* Ironman entries somehow—who would have ever guessed that so many people would take leave of their senses and actually *want* to put themselves through the hell of an IM?  :) Just think how much triathlon would grow if there were several half IM races designated as qualifiers for IMC, IM Lake Placid, and Great Floridian. The problem is, I don’t know that the sport can yet SUPPORT that many 1/2 IM distance races.  It’s all very utopian to envision all these 1/2 IMs, but the reality is that putting on half-IMs is a LOT of work, very expensive, it’s hard to find good venues, and there just aren’t that many race directors out there with the know-how and experience to pull it off right.  There may be a lot of racers eager to do IM, but that doesn’t mean there are a lot of race directors eager to put on half-IMs. Another thing to consider:  If people have to go to qualifiers in order to race in the national IMs, a lot of them could be discouraged by the $$$ involved.  It already can cost quite a pretty penny to prep for and travel to the IM itself.  For many folks, the prospect of having to travel to a qualifier first, wherever it may be, could be the straw that breaks the back of the camel carrying their IM dream. I’m just trying to consider all the angles here.  And have now shot off my keyboard far too much.  But there’s another $.02 for my account! — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie

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It’s the event of the year.  The Championships.  You just don’t get a free ride.  This is for the best triathletes in their age groups, and for pros. Take advantage of the lottery. Marc the rookie

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I have to agree with you. IMH is the IM championship, and should be reserved to the best athletes in the sport. The sport is that of doing an IM. NOT running an olympic distance triathlon. Qualyfing on shorter distances is a disservice to those real endurance athletes who can maintain a fast pace for ever, as opposed to those who are very fast, but can only sustain it for 2 hours. For the qualifier that are booking very fast, is would be fair to have a qualifier for those too. The qualifier should be 1/2 IM distance (3 IM a year, anyone ?). They should also have a lottery system, but as Mike said they do in Australia, opened to the qualifiers competitors who did not make it. i.e. you do not validate your lottery win, you _earn_ your chance at lottery. This will sound a little hasrh to a lot of you who have their eyes on IMH, but remember, it is the world championship of IM races. The system I propose, I think, is fair. Done that way, it would also raise the prestige level of IMH qualifiers. One would be happy to make it to IMC, and not unhappy to have done IMC, and not qualified for IMH. my $0.02 Alain – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In my opinion the problem lies with the post-office competition that exists for entry into races such as the new USA IM race(s) and IM-Canada. In other places around the world, you qualify to get into your national IM race, by excelling in a series of 1/2-IM races.  In Australia a small number of spots are held open for international entries, and about 50 are reserved for a lottery system — the remainder have to be earned by racing the qualifiers — see Nick Munting’s sites for details. The lottery is done after the qualifiers and is open to all qualifier competitors who failed to make it (you may have been unlucky enough to score a flat tyre — here’s a chance to get lucky). Once you make it into your national (or any international I guess) race, you can then go all the way to the worlds at Hawaii by proving your ability over this distance and doing exceptionally well. In Oz, we have 100 Hawaii slots for 1100+ competitors. Perhaps the USA should re-focus it’s energies on their national IM races and create an equitable qualifying system for that/those race(s) — and let the Hawaii race takes it place as the IM world championships. In Australia most competitors (me included) understand that they will probably never make it to Hawaii — but racing IMA does not lose one iota of it’s IM aura and prestige because of this. — MB. This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies. Many people claim that all of the IM qualifying races should be full IM distance. I keep hearing the argument, "after all, you don’t qualify for marathon by running a 10K". I think this comparison is completely invalid because of the training volumes we are comparing. To train for a marathon, your max long distance day is perhaps 2.5 to 3 hours, repeated maybe three times during the course of your buildup. Your max weekly running time is maybe 10 hours per week, which is maybe for three weeks of your training cycle. The other weeks your running time is probably closer to 6-8 hours weekly. To train for an Ironman, your max long distance day is at least six hours on the bike followed by maybe a one hour run. Training time is closer to 20 hours per week, and for many weeks it is at least 15 hours per week. The time demands for marathon training are significantly less than the time demands for Ironman training. It’s tough enough to pull off all the training hours for Ironman once in a season, let alone twice. My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones. Though physically it is certainly possible to do more than one IM per year, the limitation is more on the side of time than it is on the side of physical capabilities. I don’t mind if all IM qualifiers are half IM distance. But if all the IM qualifiers become full IM, then I think the competitor field size will shrink because (generalization here) I don’t think most people can balance the time demands of two full IM training cycles into one year. Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season. I’m curious what other people think. Cathy

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This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies.

How *do* we keep those from chaffing? <g My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones.

My first response is to make the IMQ a full distance event since I already have mine and now we can close the gates.  But on retrospect I agree that 2 full distance events in one year would be asking too much from the ordinary mortals like myself.  Sure the gifted and pros can do 2 full distance events in one year. But if people with lives outside the tri world want to participate I agree that they could do one full distance within one year *or* a half in the same year to confirm their lottery spot. That’s the lottery winners I’m refering to, not the speed demons.   The people who trained hard, chose their parents wisely and ate the right food will still need to toe the line in the same year. So in my opinion the IMQers would have to qualify in the same year in the distance of their choice as it stands now, but the lottery winners could stay with either the 1/2 Ironman (not olympic distances) in the same year or a full IMQ the year before to meet the lottery requirements. Happy Holidays (5 lbs overweight and counting) — Chris Davis "Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one’s courage." Anais Nin http://www.hulaman.com

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but the lottery winners could stay with either the 1/2 Ironman (not olympic distances) in the same year or a full IMQ the year before

To make things fair, I think the lottery entrants should also have to do a full in order to validate their slot.  Perhaps the best thing to do would be to draw lottery slots at each ironman race via a random drawing.  Remember the random drawings at all IQ races a few years back? Dave Bechard

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I wonder how many full Ironman races Mark Allen and Dave Scott did each year. Best, Mark Mannebach (Oh, there was that little workout in Nice I guess….)

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Mark, no comparison. My original post is about age groupers, trying to balance work, family, training, etc., not full time pros who do nothing else but train and race. My point is about balancing the time, not the physical capability of the body to do more than one Ironman in one year. Cathy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I wonder how many full Ironman races Mark Allen and Dave Scott did each year. Best, Mark Mannebach (Oh, there was that little workout in Nice I guess….)

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In my opinion the problem lies with the post-office competition that exists for entry into races such as the new USA IM race(s) and IM-Canada.

Mike, That certainly seems to be the case with both IMC and also the new IMUSA. IMC is becoming a real scramble to get in. Every year the time for the race to "fill-up" is becoming shorter and shorter.This year it was eight days. I was told that in the last few days you had better of chose your courier wisely. The stage is now set, with  the (year)2000 entries not being officially released until the day after the 1999 race and for the 2000 event to fill up almost right away. The only people who will have a decent shot at the 1700 "mail in" entries will be the people who are physically in Penticton. I have heard of people who are travelling to Penticton this year to watch the race but also chiefly for the purpose of bagging a spot for 2000. As for IMUSA, with a prodigious amount of internet hyping this brand new never- been-run-before event filled up(1700 spots) in 2 months. With TriSports Promotions running the show the event is almost assured of being a huge success, I suspect that it will start down this road of acelerated fill-up times as well. What does all of this mean? It’s great for the event organizers – among a host of other advantages, the money is in the bank early. For the local communities hotels are booked months in advance. As a barometer for the sport, it shows that the sport at this level is healthy and growing. There are negatives: People who want to do the race and can’t get in on the mail-in are  possibly closed right out.However, there are a few qualifying spots for these races, but you have to almost be the best in your age group to get a spot. The hotels become completely booked up and filled making it difficult to find accomodation late in the game. My feeling is that they should have more(not all, perhaps 1/3 of the race fields) spots for qualifiers(1/2 Ironman distance races only) for races such as IMC and now IMUSA, in the year of the race. This way the entry process could be slightly more controlled.After all who wants to think about doing another Ironman the day after you just did one? It’s the last thing on my mind. Steve Fleck

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Hey Cathy, Really good post and I totally agree with you. Having qualified for IMH in 95, 97 and 98 I can honestly say that the hardest part of IMH is qualifiying – regardless of the qualifyer distance. The competition in an IMQ is greater in numbers and far more intense than IMH. For many, once in IMH the pressure is off and one needs only to train to a level thaty allows them to meet their personal expectations. In addition, for many like myself  IMH is their first IM and the goal is just to finish pacing themselves accordingly. Others really want to enjoy the "IMH experience" and also pace themselves accordingly. I also agree that the time element training for more than one IM per year is pretty demanding. I have almost unlimited training time and have considered doing more than one per year but when reality hits I realize that as much as I love the sport I cannot bring myself back up mentally to put in the trainings hours for another effort. For me, I ned time to smell the roses. Indeed, here it is December and I’m still recovering from this years effort. Should the IM distance become the standard IMHQ’s, one approach would be to qualify the previsous year for the next years IMH. Just a thought. Have a great holiday season and train safe. Cheers, Bernie Sher – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies. Many people claim that all of the IM qualifying races should be full IM distance. I keep hearing the argument, "after all, you don’t qualify for marathon by running a 10K". I think this comparison is completely invalid because of the training volumes we are comparing. To train for a marathon, your max long distance day is perhaps 2.5 to 3 hours, repeated maybe three times during the course of your buildup. Your max weekly running time is maybe 10 hours per week, which is maybe for three weeks of your training cycle. The other weeks your running time is probably closer to 6-8 hours weekly. To train for an Ironman, your max long distance day is at least six hours on the bike followed by maybe a one hour run. Training time is closer to 20 hours per week, and for many weeks it is at least 15 hours per week. The time demands for marathon training are significantly less than the time demands for Ironman training. It’s tough enough to pull off all the training hours for Ironman once in a season, let alone twice. My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones. Though physically it is certainly possible to do more than one IM per year, the limitation is more on the side of time than it is on the side of physical capabilities. I don’t mind if all IM qualifiers are half IM distance. But if all the IM qualifiers become full IM, then I think the competitor field size will shrink because (generalization here) I don’t think most people can balance the time demands of two full IM training cycles into one year. Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season. I’m curious what other people think. Cathy

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Down here in Australia we only have one qualifying race for IMH and so at the moment I can’t even qualify to race the qualifying race for IMH. In fact based on this years success of the qualifying races for IMA I suspect that it may be necessary to qualify for the qualifying races to the qualifying race for IMH. I think I’ll take up knitting instead AJ (Iron Wimp)

I agree!!  My ambition is strictly limited to qualifying for IMA – and I’m extremely borderline for that… IMH just isn’t even in the equation. Shepparton, the final race in the qualifying series for IMA is on next weekend.  My only hope is that all the fast triathletes have qualified already at other races, leaving us borderline cases to fight for the final 100 slots!

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Alan Erquitt  says… Loaded dice aren’t enough, I couldn’t qualify with a loaded gun At least the lottery went international! Down here in Australia we only have one qualifying race for IMH and so at the moment I can’t even qualify to race the qualifying race for IMH. In fact based on this years success of the qualifying races for IMA I suspect that it may be necessary to qualify for the qualifying races to the qualifying race for IMH. I think I’ll take up knitting instead

Ah, but don’t start clicking those needles yet, AJ!  Remember, there are now 75 INTERNATIONAL Lottery slots to be had!  Go to the Ironman website, download that application, fill it out, send it in (with your $35 American) and see what happens.  You may find that you’re not the afghan type at all. — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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Loaded dice aren’t enough, I couldn’t qualify with a loaded gun At least the lottery went international! Maybe we will get to the point where there are so many official M-dot races that not all will have qualifying places?? Alan (fuzzy dice) Erquitt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There are 12 US domestic IMH qualifiers? And the lottery? Talk about loading the dice

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I think Cathy Corning’s comment about people doing 2 IM events within 6-8 weeks of each other is fairly accurate, esp. those trying to get into IMH (based only on my observations at various IMC events and general discussions on the ‘net).

Depends where you qualify.  The reward for Aussies and New Zealanders winning IMH slots at IMOz or IMNZ is several months of training through the winter – a demanding ask, particularly if you live in an area where winters are cold and wet Could someone just clarify for me, is it possible to get an IMH slot via an Olympic distance race?  The posts seem to indicate this. Liz

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Don’t know if it would change who qualifies, but the swim is proportionally longer relative to the run in a Olympic distance tri. I’d vote for a 2.4 / 56 / 10K as a qualifier, because at least then I could dream…

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Alan Erquitt  says… Loaded dice aren’t enough, I couldn’t qualify with a loaded gun At least the lottery went international!

Down here in Australia we only have one qualifying race for IMH and so at the moment I can’t even qualify to race the qualifying race for IMH. In fact based on this years success of the qualifying races for IMA I suspect that it may be necessary to qualify for the qualifying races to the qualifying race for IMH. I think I’ll take up knitting instead AJ (Iron Wimp) — If swimming is so good for the figure, explain whales Simon Haigh Illawarra Triathlon Club – Australia http://members.xoom.com/ajsimon/index.htm

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Ok, I have read all of the posts so far on the qualifying for IMH, so let me try to add my perspective to it. First of let me state that although I have been to IMH three times, I have never had the kind of luck there that I have had at the shorter distances. That is more my fault in training than anything else though. I have always tried to transfer short course training into an IM race and it doesn’t work that way. Each of the years that I desired to go to IMH I was able to qualify. Sorry, I just happen to be good at distances from a sprint up to a half. As far as qualifying at an Olympic distance race goes, it has already been documented by Charlie Crawford that the people that qualify at these races seem to do pretty well at IMH. I think the reason for this, is that the few Olympic distance races (Memphis in May and Mrs. T’s) are extemely competitive races. To win your age group at one of these two races, you have to be the cream of the crop, and surely deserved of an IMH slot. Keep in mind that IMH is an individual World Championship for the distance and that by choosing competitors from qualifiers from various distance races gives an effect of having a rounded field. Notice I said "effect" though. Whether in fact it really does or not is open for debate as surely anyone that qualifies for IMH at Memphis in May could surely qualify at a longer event. It comes down to logistics among other things. It might be more feasible someone to go to Memphis to qualify rather than going to IMC, even though they could qualify at either event probably. Look at the difference. If I wanted to go this year, I could try to qualify at Memphis where my total expenses would be about $200. But what if I had to do an official IM event in order to qualify. $200 wouldn’t even pay the entry fee. There was a thread earlier this year that said the average triathlete was an upper middle class person with lots of disposable income to spare. I debated that then and still do. I know for me, it would be very difficult to swing two trips in one year that were costing in the neighborhood of $2000 each, plus all of the regular racing that I do during the year on top of that. I know for me, I am thinking of going to Hawaii this year, and I will try to find the easiest and cheapest way to qualify, which probably means that I will be lining up in Memphis this spring. Mike Plumb

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There are 12 US domestic IMH qualifiers? And the lottery? Talk about loading the dice Phil (Not a US Citizen) Squire SNIP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The WTC web page on qualifying states the following: "Athletes gain entry into the Ironman Triathlon World Championship by earning a qualifying slot at one of the 12 U.S. domestic qualifying events, or at one of the 9 international qualifying races held throughout the year. Qualifier races vary in length, ranging from Olympic distance (.93-mile swim, 24.8-mile bike, 6.2-mile run) to full Ironman distance (2.4-mile swim, 112-mile bike, 26.2-mile run). " To me, that sounds like Olympic distance qualifiers do NOT have to validate their slots.  Anyone from WTC care to clarify? David / FEY2K reply to wuth – family – atlanta (remove spaces) at att dot net

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If you qualify at an Olympic distance race, you are in.  You don’t need to do a half-IM.   As for multiple IMs in one year…  No one ever called me overly bright as far as triathlons…  I am doing IM NZ in March, IMC in August, and hopefully IMH. I agree that qualifying for IMH should be done in at least a half-IM, but that is because I am such a poor swimmer, that I have no chance of qualifying at the shorter distances.  However, I really doubt that the people who qualify at Olympic distance races would have any trouble qualifying at the half-IM distance, which kind of renders this a moot point. John Welch

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I agree that qualifying for IMH should be done in at least a half-IM, but that is because I am such a poor swimmer, that I have no chance of qualifying at the shorter distances.  However, I really doubt that the people who qualify at Olympic distance races would have any trouble qualifying at the half-IM distance, which kind of renders this a moot point.

Is it possible that someone who couldn’t possibly clock the run times required to qualify at a Oly race could have a better chance at a 1/2? Not a challenge, I’m just inexperienced and intrigued by the qualifying process. — Clay T

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My opionion: the qualifiers should be a mix of 1/2 and full IM races. This would be consistent with the IMH lottery qualification of having to complete a 1/2 or full IM distance to be able to participate in IMH. I agree with this (mix of 1/2 and Full qualifiers).  One clarification, however:  I believe that, currently, those who win their slots at the Olympic distance qualifiers are indeed required to complete on of the longer distance qualifiers in order to validate their slots, just as the Lottery winners must do. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong.

The WTC web page on qualifying states the following: "Athletes gain entry into the Ironman Triathlon World Championship by earning a qualifying slot at one of the 12 U.S. domestic qualifying events, or at one of the 9 international qualifying races held throughout the year. Qualifier races vary in length, ranging from Olympic distance (.93-mile swim, 24.8-mile bike, 6.2-mile run) to full Ironman distance (2.4-mile swim, 112-mile bike, 26.2-mile run). " To me, that sounds like Olympic distance qualifiers do NOT have to validate their slots.  Anyone from WTC care to clarify? David / FEY2K reply to wuth – family – atlanta (remove spaces) at att dot net

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If all IM qualifiers were IM distance events, there would be no shortage of people trying to get into IMH. Look at races like IMC, the new IM-USA, and such. Filled. While I KNOW The Great Floridian is a great race, and I plan to do it within the next 2-3 years, it lacks those qualifying slots. Short qualifiers for long events do seem silly. I like the idea of 1/2 IM and longer qualifiers. I think Cathy Corning’s comment about people doing 2 IM events within 6-8 weeks of each other is fairly accurate, esp. those trying to get into IMH (based only on my observations at various IMC events and general discussions on the ‘net). -Rolf — I am Iron Mac…       …a student of Ironman, ever learning…                                       …about having faith.         IMC’94/14:07    IMC’95/11:59    IMC’97/12:12    IMC’98/14:02

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My opionion: the qualifiers should be a mix of 1/2 and full IM races. This would be consistent with the IMH lottery qualification of having to complete a 1/2 or full IM distance to be able to participate in IMH.

I agree with this (mix of 1/2 and Full qualifiers).  One clarification, however:  I believe that, currently, those who win their slots at the Olympic distance qualifiers are indeed required to complete on of the longer distance qualifiers in order to validate their slots, just as the Lottery winners must do. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong. I believe that long distance triathlon is now so popular that the need to supplement the list of q. races with shorter ones is no longer valid. Didn’t the philosophy behind having shorter races as qualifiers have to do with encouraging folks who focussed on the shorter distances to try the long stuff? As it is now, so many people are going for the 1/2 and full distances these days anyway that the shorter qualifiers do seem kind of silly. Just my $.02. However they end up going with the qualifiers, all I can say is that I’m extremely grateful that I had my chance to participate in Kona.  I hope everybody who wants to do the race gets that same chance some day. Good luck, everyone!! — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies.

It’s the off season in the Northern Hemisphere. Isn’t asbestos part of the required off season clothing? Also, let me assume that this discussion is related to age groupers, not pros. Many people claim that all of the IM qualifying races should be full IM distance. I keep hearing the argument, "after all, you don’t qualify for marathon by running a 10K". I think this comparison is completely invalid because of the training volumes we are comparing. [snip] My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones. Though physically it is certainly possible to do more than one IM per year, the limitation is more on the side of time than it is on the side of physical capabilities.

Perhaps, but IMH is supposed to be a chapionship race (except for the lottery, of course). I would expect that those training at levels to compete would have already taken the same factors into consideration. I don’t mind if all IM qualifiers are half IM distance.

I think a mix of half and full IM races would be appropriate. And, I think the same should be true for international qualifiers. But if all the IM qualifiers become full IM, then I think the competitor field size will shrink because (generalization here) I don’t think most people can balance the time demands of two full IM training cycles into one year.

How is this a bad thing? We’re talking about a championship race, not IM distance races held throughout the season. Besides, that could result in more lottery spots, right? I’m curious what other people think.

My opionion: the qualifiers should be a mix of 1/2 and full IM races. This would be consistent with the IMH lottery qualification of having to complete a 1/2 or full IM distance to be able to participate in IMH. David / FEY2K reply to wuth – family – atlanta (remove spaces) at att dot net

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(Cathy Corning) writes: Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season.

How do you know this? Geoff

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(Cathy Corning) writes: Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season. How do you know this? Geoff

Why did you ask this? Ray

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I agree.  If you have time to do 2 Ironman races in one season and you work full time, then what is the rest of your life like?  I would never do 2 IM distances in one year because I think that it would kill me, ruin my home life, destroy my business, and cause the local homeowners organization to stage a torch light  parade in my honor. I don’t even think I want to do 2 IM distance races in 2 consecutive seasons.  I’m in this sport for the long haul and I’m afraid too many of these things too close together will toast me. Ray Plotecia Male Amateur, 50-54 Ruxton, MD – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies. Many people claim that all of the IM qualifying races should be full IM distance. I keep hearing the argument, "after all, you don’t qualify for marathon by running a 10K". I think this comparison is completely invalid because of the training volumes we are comparing. To train for a marathon, your max long distance day is perhaps 2.5 to 3 hours, repeated maybe three times during the course of your buildup. Your max weekly running time is maybe 10 hours per week, which is maybe for three weeks of your training cycle. The other weeks your running time is probably closer to 6-8 hours weekly. To train for an Ironman, your max long distance day is at least six hours on the bike followed by maybe a one hour run. Training time is closer to 20 hours per week, and for many weeks it is at least 15 hours per week. The time demands for marathon training are significantly less than the time demands for Ironman training. It’s tough enough to pull off all the training hours for Ironman once in a season, let alone twice. My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones. Though physically it is certainly possible to do more than one IM per year, the limitation is more on the side of time than it is on the side of physical capabilities. I don’t mind if all IM qualifiers are half IM distance. But if all the IM qualifiers become full IM, then I think the competitor field size will shrink because (generalization here) I don’t think most people can balance the time demands of two full IM training cycles into one year. Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season. I’m curious what other people think. Cathy

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This post is intended to generate some debate. Put on your asbestos undies. Many people claim that all of the IM qualifying races should be full IM distance. I keep hearing the argument, "after all, you don’t qualify for marathon by running a 10K". I think this comparison is completely invalid because of the training volumes we are comparing. To train for a marathon, your max long distance day is perhaps 2.5 to 3 hours, repeated maybe three times during the course of your buildup. Your max weekly running time is maybe 10 hours per week, which is maybe for three weeks of your training cycle. The other weeks your running time is probably closer to 6-8 hours weekly. To train for an Ironman, your max long distance day is at least six hours on the bike followed by maybe a one hour run. Training time is closer to 20 hours per week, and for many weeks it is at least 15 hours per week. The time demands for marathon training are significantly less than the time demands for Ironman training. It’s tough enough to pull off all the training hours for Ironman once in a season, let alone twice. My argument is that training for an Ironman is incredibly demanding because of trying to squeeze all this training around a full time job, commuting, home owner responsibilities, and not to mention loved ones. Though physically it is certainly possible to do more than one IM per year, the limitation is more on the side of time than it is on the side of physical capabilities. I don’t mind if all IM qualifiers are half IM distance. But if all the IM qualifiers become full IM, then I think the competitor field size will shrink because (generalization here) I don’t think most people can balance the time demands of two full IM training cycles into one year. Most of the age groupers who do two IM in one year, are doing the second one just 6-8 weeks after the first one, so the second training cycle is fairly low volume, as opposed to two full IM training cycles spread out at the beginning and end of the season. I’m curious what other people think. Cathy

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Question:

I’d like to do the tattoo thing also, but I cannot help being a little nervous about it. I guess you can book me in also, but there might be a chance of me "chickening out" when the time comes.

        Then we will just have to club you over the head and drag you. After your sub 8 hour IM, I don’t think you will be in any position to resist. Set my mind at ease a little…please tell me you guys are drawing blood AFTER the race?

        Yes, when we are to tired to resist. David "I want another tattoo" Barclay IMC 1997: 11:55:59 Triathlon: "Swim, Bike, Crawl"

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Hey, maybe I qualify for "partial Canuck"? My father’s grandparents were from Montreal, then moved to South Dakota. How else could you explain his name –Pierre Dickinson! Laura (IMC ‘97, ‘98 and a Canadian at heart – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – :     Yup. Me to. Ok fence-sitters, jump on the bandwagon.  :)  So far, the IMC tattoo contingent is up to 4.  :)  I think we need a webpage for this one…  ;-) Jason, who will be joining David, Laura, and Mike for tattoos in penticton in 83 days — I am not quite sure what is going on here, but this may be a first – Americans getting a Maple Leaf tattoed on their bodies. (David B, excluded of course because he’s already a Canuck) Steve Fleck

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | | :    Yup. Me to. | | Ok fence-sitters, jump on the bandwagon.  :)  So far, the IMC tattoo | contingent is up to 4.  :)  I think we need a webpage for this one…  ;-) | | Jason, who will be joining David, Laura, and Mike for tattoos in | penticton in 83 days | Count me in too.  An IMC  tattoo has been part of my plan all along …. Fred German

 I’m planning on getting one, as well as a couple of my teammates (FAST tri club from Michigan)! — Tri Your Hardest!   /O     ___o      o  ~~~~   _ <,_    <|        (*)/ (*)      / Darrin Bartlett

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:       Yup. Me to. Ok fence-sitters, jump on the bandwagon.  :)  So far, the IMC tattoo contingent is up to 4.  :)  I think we need a webpage for this one…  ;-) Jason, who will be joining David, Laura, and Mike for tattoos in penticton in 83 days — Jason Mayfield, Arlington VA Persist, Persevere, Deny, Pursue, Pain, Survive, Ignore, Endure, Strive, Laugh, Cry, Live, Prevail, Scream, Sweat, Bleed, Sustain, Learn, Ascend, Give, Get, GO!  82 Days Until Ironman Canada ‘98

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Having had some … ummm . . . little experience with the Tattoo Shop in Penticton (on Main) I advise to book early it was VERY busy the Monday after IMC ‘97. The have a lovely Maple with the M-Dot inside. I opted for the M-Dot alone (10  minutes in the chair max.). Good Training, Good Racing, Joe Joseph C. Foster The Stanley Works "The idea is to create your own future, and not have it shaped by circumstance." – Peter Thomas

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:  Yup. Me to. Ok fence-sitters, jump on the bandwagon.  :)  So far, the IMC tattoo contingent is up to 4.  :)  I think we need a webpage for this one…  ;-) Jason, who will be joining David, Laura, and Mike for tattoos in penticton in 83 days —

I am not quite sure what is going on here, but this may be a first – Americans getting a Maple Leaf tattoed on their bodies. (David B, excluded of course because he’s already a Canuck) Steve Fleck

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| | :         Yup. Me to. | | Ok fence-sitters, jump on the bandwagon.  :)  So far, the IMC tattoo | contingent is up to 4.  :)  I think we need a webpage for this one…  ;-) | | Jason, who will be joining David, Laura, and Mike for tattoos in | penticton in 83 days | Count me in too.  An IMC  tattoo has been part of my plan all along …. Fred German

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I’d like to do the tattoo thing also, but I cannot help being a little nervous about it. I guess you can book me in also, but there might be a chance of me "chickening out" when the time comes. Set my mind at ease a little…please tell me you guys are drawing blood AFTER the race?                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   ‘98 IMC, GCT, BSLT IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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I’ll call the tattoo place in Penticton and make a group reservation for Monday afternoon.  :)  I just need a list of names….

        Yup. Me to. David Barclay IMC 1997: 11:55:59 Triathlon: "Swim, Bike, Crawl"

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: Hey, I want to be there too! I’ve been toying with the notion of a discrete IM : Maple leaf all summer. Now, with this stress fracture in my right foot healing : up, I’m going to feel that I’ve really earned it! Ok, you guys asked for it.  Time to put up.  :) I’ll call the tattoo place in Penticton and make a group reservation for Monday afternoon.  :)  I just need a list of names….

Count me in! I’ve been planning on it all year. Mike "TriBop" Tennent http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/ WebRunner Running My Model Railroad ‘98 Ironman Canada IronVirgins Site

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: Hey, I want to be there too! I’ve been toying with the notion of a discrete IM : Maple leaf all summer. Now, with this stress fracture in my right foot healing : up, I’m going to feel that I’ve really earned it! Ok, you guys asked for it.  Time to put up.  :) I’ll call the tattoo place in Penticton and make a group reservation for Monday afternoon.  :)  I just need a list of names…. Jason, if this doesn’t motivate me to keep training what will? |83 Days Until Ironman          |          __o        |     _/_     | |Canada 1998                    |        _`<,_   o   |  _/\  //_  | |Jason Mayfield                 | ___o_         _   |   __  __<   | |Arlington, VA, IMC 96, 97      | ~~~~~~          /   |      ||      |

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O.K. I’ll put up! You’re on. Laura – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Hey, I want to be there too! I’ve been toying with the notion of a discrete IM : Maple leaf all summer. Now, with this stress fracture in my right foot healing : up, I’m going to feel that I’ve really earned it! Ok, you guys asked for it.  Time to put up.  :) I’ll call the tattoo place in Penticton and make a group reservation for Monday afternoon.  :)  I just need a list of names…. Jason, if this doesn’t motivate me to keep training what will? |83 Days Until Ironman          |          __o        |     _/_     | |Canada 1998                    |        _`<,_   o   |  _/\  //_  | |Jason Mayfield                 | ___o_         _   |   __  __<   | |Arlington, VA, IMC 96, 97      | ~~~~~~          /   |      ||      |

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Gad, did I crack up when I read your post! She IS going to have her picture on the box this year right??? Laura – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year. Don’t forget to add that her sponsorship with Pop-Tarts requires her to do both this year! Alison Keple Mill Bay, BC

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Hey, I want to be there too! I’ve been toying with the notion of a discrete IM Maple leaf all summer. Now, with this stress fracture in my right foot healing up, I’m going to feel that I’ve really earned it! See you there –just name the time! Laura (IMC ‘97 AND will be there in ‘98!) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : 8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona. I’m there if you guys are there….         I’ve got my camera and a big spot on my ankle crying for attention… David Barclay IMC 1997: 11:55:59 Triathlon: "Swim, Bike, Crawl"

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How clever, the number one training secret diabolically not revealed on the top 10 list… ..Phish Food and power-nap intervals are twice as necessary now! Good luck to you Tri-Baby! I *tri* because…I have many skills!

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Don’t do it Tri-baby!  Don’t you want to be fresh for your first Hawaii?? "Life’s a brick"

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Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year.

Don’t forget to add that her sponsorship with Pop-Tarts requires her to do both this year! Alison Keple Mill Bay, BC

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5)  At least 130 other people will be doing the exact same thing.  (There are 130 Qualifying Slots up for grabs at IMC)

I know. If I do not qualify for the Domestic Qualifiers here…hmmm, maybe if I actually do I probably would go to IMC anyway now that I think about it…well anyway, if I don’t I will have to do it up there. But let me get to that bridge first. 4)  She has nonrefundable airline tickets!

Now that’s no excuse! For several months I’ve been contemplating the financial burden of doing both Canada and Hawaii. Believe me, my wallet is crying already! Of course the cheaper thing to do is to send the tickets back and get ones that go to Hawaii. I believe the charge is $50. But I know you…you’re too tough a woman to let a challenge go unchecked! Rationalization denied! <g 3)  In 1997, 4 weeks to the day after IMC she successfully completed a very difficult Olympic Distance tri with a PR.  (OK, so an Olympic ain’t Ironman; but it sure sounds hopeful, eh?)

At least you know you can move 4 weeks after IMC. You definitely won’t be 100%, but through sound training and recovery between the 2 races, you can probably get pretty close to 100%. 2)  As President of the TriPosers, it is her solemn duty to attend the annual gathering in Penticton (or Vice President Barclay will threaten her with lectures on PowerGel)

I guess it is your duty. <g She’s already proved she can go the distance, so where’s the challenge in one Ironman?  She’s going for the real gusto:  Two!

Didn’t I say you’re too tough a woman to let a challenge go unchecked? This rationalization I believe the most. And I everyone on this newsgroup, including me, knows that you can do it. Damn, with this much support, you can maybe do three IM’s next year. Good luck.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   ‘98 IMC, GCT, BSLT IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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: 8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona. I’m there if you guys are there….

        I’ve got my camera and a big spot on my ankle crying for attention… David Barclay IMC 1997: 11:55:59 Triathlon: "Swim, Bike, Crawl"

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I had to contemplate what would drive you to do 2 Ironmans in 5 weeks.

Now, why’dja have to go an’ do a durn’ fool thing like that, Pete?? Sheesh, get me to frettin’ about it all over again, why don’tcha? However, since you felt compelled to post this cruel jest, I feel compelled to respond, forsooth: Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year. 10. IMC would be her second ever Ironman. She’d figure to get the dreaded "sophomore jinx" out of the way before doing IMH.

Hell, I hadn’t even thought of this one; thanks for one more thing to worry about! 9. Has a strong urge to bleach Jason’s hair blonde again.

Ah, now THIS one is not too far off base!  And it’s not so strange; I do love running my fingers through men’s hair.  However, allow me to point out that Peter Reid’s color of choice this year is a lovely, luminescent silver (as sported at Wildflower).  Thus, we’ll be going for something with a more blueish rather than orangish hue in Penticton, methinks. 8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona.

A moot point; San Francisco’s tattoo parlors have it hands down over either of the above. 7. Needs a thirteen hour "tune-up" for Hawaii.

See, that’s what I keep saying:  One last, really solid, long training day. 6. "Five weeks between Ironmans? No problem!

What I also keep saying.  And saying.  And saying.  Over and over and over again…. 5. Peaches are still better to eat than lava rocks.

Indubitably!  I have never in my life enjoyed a peach so much as that enormous, juicy, sumptuous delectable I consumed at the run turnaround in Canada last year.  My oh my, my mouth is watering even now as I think of it! 4. Wants to rub it in to other RST’ers in Penticton that she’s going to Hawaii.

Dammit, must you reveal ALL my secrets? 3. At least she won’t have a problem getting that darn seat post off when packing her stuff before going to Hawaii.

I have already informed my bike mechanic that no such repeat performances will be tolerated this year, thank you very much. 2. Wants to experience Pete’s and Rolf’s "charming" personality again.

Well, yes, ridiculous as it may seem, this really IS a valid reason!  ;-) I think anyone who was there last year will agree that the social aspect of the RST gathering at IMC was no small part of the magic of the event. Socially, IMC promises to be twice the fun of Kona.  I’m looking very much forward to seeing folks I haven’t seen since IMC ‘97, and folks whom I’ve only ever met "virtually" through RST and the magic of email.  That’s no small draw to someone whose entire experience of this sport has been materially influenced by the comings and goings of this group. 1. Why not!

Well, I’ve got a list longer than your arm of reasons why not.  But I’m not going to post them, because that would be no fun! However, I can add TriBaby’s Top 5 Rationalizations for doing IMC before IMH: 5)  At least 130 other people will be doing the exact same thing.  (There are 130 Qualifying Slots up for grabs at IMC) 4)  She has nonrefundable airline tickets! 3)  In 1997, 4 weeks to the day after IMC she successfully completed a very difficult Olympic Distance tri with a PR.  (OK, so an Olympic ain’t Ironman; but it sure sounds hopeful, eh?) 2)  As President of the TriPosers, it is her solemn duty to attend the annual gathering in Penticton (or Vice President Barclay will threaten her with lectures on PowerGel) And the number 1 Rationalization for TriBaby to do IMC just 5 weeks before IMH: She’s already proved she can go the distance, so where’s the challenge in one Ironman?  She’s going for the real gusto:  Two! Stay tuned for further rationalization as August draws nigh! — Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft." *** Ironman Canada 1997 – 13:04:09 *** http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie         "’Be a terrific innovation if you could get your mind to stretch a little further than the next wise crack." "Y’know, I tried that once, but it didn’t snap back into place." —Katharine Hepburn & Eve Arden in "Stage Door" (1937)    

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|Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year. | |10. IMC would be her second ever Ironman. She’d figure to get the dreaded |"sophomore jinx" out of the way before doing IMH. | |9. Has a strong urge to bleach Jason’s hair blonde again. | |8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona. I vote to combine these last 2.  I think Jason should get a red maple leaf dyed on the top of his head after the blonde dye job.  You know, ala Dennis Rodman, but with class.  Wouldn’t they just love that at your snooty(just kidding) new job Jason? Stacy Hills Reston, VA

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|Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year. | Lets face it the girl is just plain loco! Gary McMurtrey Inland Inferno Triathlon Club http://members.aol.com/infernotri/home.htm

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: 9. Has a strong urge to bleach Jason’s hair blonde again. Hmmmm……the peer pressure…I can’t take it anymore…  ;-) : 8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona. I’m there if you guys are there…. — Jason Mayfield, Arlington VA Persist, Persevere, Deny, Pursue, Pain, Survive, Ignore, Endure, Strive, Laugh, Cry, Live, Prevail, Scream, Sweat, Bleed, Sustain, Learn, Ascend, Give, Get, GO!  86 Days Until Ironman Canada ‘98

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This is just a little creativity that seems to come out when I taper. I guess my brain is in a fog all other times! Sorry to knock on you Tricia, but this did cross my mind today and I had to contemplate what would drive you to do 2 Ironmans in 5 weeks. Top 10 Reasons Why Tri-Baby is Doing Both IMC and IMH This Year. 10. IMC would be her second ever Ironman. She’d figure to get the dreaded "sophomore jinx" out of the way before doing IMH. 9. Has a strong urge to bleach Jason’s hair blonde again. 8. The tattoo parlor in Penticton has a better reputation than the one in Kona. 7. Needs a thirteen hour "tune-up" for Hawaii. 6. "Five weeks between Ironmans? No problem! 5. Peaches are still better to eat than lava rocks. 4. Wants to rub it in to other RST’ers in Penticton that she’s going to Hawaii. 3. At least she won’t have a problem getting that darn seat post off when packing her stuff before going to Hawaii. 2. Wants to experience Pete’s and Rolf’s "charming" personality again. 1. Why not!                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   ‘98 IMC, GCT, BSLT IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

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Question:

http://www.competitor.com/ironman/ Competitor Magazine’s editor and publisher Bob Babbitt first journeyed over to the Big Island to participate in the Ironman Triathlon back in 1980. Almost 17 years later the event is still the most important on the Competitor calendar. When Competitor opened it’s doors in 1987, the  Ironman became a big part of the editorial and photographic focus. Competitor Magazine is proud to present ten years of our Ironman coverage, 1987-1996. Read about the great races between Mark Allen and Dave Scott plus Paula Newby-Fraser and Erin Baker. The breakthrough races from Greg Welch, Jurgan Zack, Pauli Kiuru and Natascha Badmann. And every article is supported by GREAT photography from Lois Schwartz and Rich Cruse. http://www.competitor.com/ironman/

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http://www.competitor.com/ironman/ Competitor Magazine’s editor and publisher Bob Babbitt first journeyed over to the Big Island to participate in the Ironman Triathlon back in 1980. Almost 17 years later the event is still the most important on the Competitor calendar. When Competitor opened it’s doors in 1987, the  Ironman became a big part of the editorial and photographic focus. Competitor Magazine is proud to present ten years of our Ironman coverage, 1987-1996. Read about the great races between Mark Allen and Dave Scott plus Paula Newby-Fraser and Erin Baker. The breakthrough races from Greg Welch, Jurgan Zack, Pauli Kiuru and Natascha Badmann. And every article is supported by GREAT photography from Lois Schwartz and Rich Cruse. http://www.competitor.com/ironman/

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This is great stuff…I can’t wait to get home and sift through it. Thanks for the compilation. Augie Calabrese – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.competitor.com/ironman/ Competitor Magazine’s editor and publisher Bob Babbitt first journeyed over to the Big Island to participate in the Ironman Triathlon back in 1980. Almost 17 years later the event is still the most important on the Competitor calendar. When Competitor opened it’s doors in 1987, the  Ironman became a big part of the editorial and photographic focus. Competitor Magazine is proud to present ten years of our Ironman coverage, 1987-1996. Read about the great races between Mark Allen and Dave Scott plus Paula Newby-Fraser and Erin Baker. The breakthrough races from Greg Welch, Jurgan Zack, Pauli Kiuru and Natascha Badmann. And every article is supported by GREAT photography from Lois Schwartz and Rich Cruse. http://www.competitor.com/ironman/

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Question:

Anybody know of some nice condo’s that will handle 6-10 people (some can sleeop on the floor).  We’re bringing a large group from Cincy (at least 4 racing as of today, and probably a few more). Marty – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : What is the Shoreline rate? Spanish Villa gave me a flyer for a pkg : deal that ain’t bad! Bookings start on Jan 1.  5 nights for $333 US & : it sleeps up to 3. Spanish Villa quoted me 5 nights at C$90/night which comes out to around $333 US I think.  That’s with two queen beds…a standard room.  Shoreline is quoting C$95/night for the same thing with a fridge and kitchen.  Since they said they’ll try and give me the same room I had this year I think I’m going to be staying at Shoreline.  It’s not like they’re not next door to each other or anything…  ;-) Jason — Jason Mayfield, Arlington VA Kona is not my mission, it is my DESTINY! 323 Days Until Ironman Canada

– Marty Miller Proprietor of The Triathlete’s Web http://w3.one.net/~triweb

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I missed the URL for that cool "Shocked" Kona site. Could you repost it please. Marcus Perry "TriDork" ** Give whenever you CAN…..Take only when you HAVE to. ** ** M. Perry     circa 1980 **

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I missed the URL for that cool "Shocked" Kona site. Could you repost it please. Marcus Perry "TriDork" ** Give whenever you CAN…..Take only when you HAVE to. ** ** M. Perry     circa 1980 **

I think you mean this one: http://www.sportsline.com/u/ironman/ -mark johnson http://www.math.princeton.edu/~maejohns

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I missed the URL for that cool "Shocked" Kona site. Could you repost it please. Marcus Perry "TriDork" ** Give whenever you CAN…..Take only when you HAVE to. ** ** M. Perry     circa 1980 **

Try http://infoman2.sportsline.com/u/ironman/ You’ll need a browser which supports plugins and the site may link you to Macromedia’s page to download and then install the plugin, but trust me, it’s worth the effort John Fenner

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I missed the URL for that cool "Shocked" Kona site. Could you repost it please. Marcus Perry "TriDork" ** Give whenever you CAN…..Take only when you HAVE to. ** ** M. Perry     circa 1980 **

No problem, Ken. http://www.sportsline.com/u/ironman/ will get you there.  Pretty snazzy. Steve, Downunder (anxiously awaiting the first race of the new season on 11/17/96) — |               Stephen "Trib" Collins              | |     TRIATHLON!    o  "The best view of one’s      | |            __o   <|  soul is from beyond the     | |          _ < _  _   edge, looking back."        | |   __^o_ (_)/ (_)  /                               |

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: Ditto!  I want to be as close to all of you as possible in order to throw : you all into fits of guilt after I collapse out there on the course! Well, my suggestion would be that we don’t pick one hotel.  Just too hard to do since most places I would imagine are at at least 50% by  now. Along Lakeshore Drive, there’s a string of about 5-10 hotels to choose from.  Just from memory they are the: Tiki Shores, Spanish Villa, Shoreline Condos, geez it’s been too long. help me out anyone?  Personally, I’ll be back at the Shoreline again unless Spanish Villa comes through with a better rate.  At this point, they want quite a bit more than Shoreline and it’s just marginally nicer from what I saw. : Either that or I want to be as close to all of you as possible for the : moral support.  Quite frankly, I think I’m gonna be shaking in my shoes : come August… What I want to know is, where are we doing breakfast now that the Wild Goose Cafe is gone?  What will I do with out the pre-race Big Ugly Stack of Hotcakes???  ;-) Jason — Jason Mayfield, Arlington VA Persist, Persevere, Deny, Pursue, Pain, Survive, Ignore, Endure, Strive, Laugh, Cry, Live, Prevail, Scream, Sweat, Bleed, Sustain, Learn, Ascend, Give, Get, GO!   324 Days Until Ironman Canada

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help me out anyone?  Personally, I’ll be back at the Shoreline again unless Spanish Villa comes through with a better rate.  At this point, they want quite a bit more than Shoreline and it’s just marginally nicer from what I saw.

What is the Shoreline rate? Spanish Villa gave me a flyer for a pkg deal that ain’t bad! Bookings start on Jan 1.  5 nights for $333 US & it sleeps up to 3.

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: What is the Shoreline rate? Spanish Villa gave me a flyer for a pkg : deal that ain’t bad! Bookings start on Jan 1.  5 nights for $333 US & : it sleeps up to 3. Spanish Villa quoted me 5 nights at C$90/night which comes out to around $333 US I think.  That’s with two queen beds…a standard room.  Shoreline is quoting C$95/night for the same thing with a fridge and kitchen.  Since they said they’ll try and give me the same room I had this year I think I’m going to be staying at Shoreline.  It’s not like they’re not next door to each other or anything…  ;-) Jason — Jason Mayfield, Arlington VA Kona is not my mission, it is my DESTINY! 323 Days Until Ironman Canada

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I called to book at the Spanish Villa Friday night and they are filling up much earlier than past year.  Don’t wait til January if you want to book at the flyer rates that were distributed at IMC 96.  Book now!

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I’ll throw my two-cents in for good hotels. I’ve stayed at the Penticton Inn & Conference Centre the last two years (and made reservations for ‘97). It’s two short blocks to the Start/Finish (Transition Area) so you can walk to everything easily. This year I booked two rooms (sleeps eight plus floor) because I’m bringing my whole family. Good Luck and Enjoy IMC ‘97. Stephen Wright – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Anybody know of some nice condo’s that will handle 6-10 people (some can sleeop on the floor).  We’re bringing a large group from Cincy (at least 4 racing as of today, and probably a few more). Marty

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Well, my suggestion would be that we don’t pick one hotel.  Just too hard to do since most places I would imagine are at at least 50% by  now. Along Lakeshore Drive, there’s a string of about 5-10 hotels to choose from.  Just from memory they are the: Tiki Shores, Spanish Villa, Shoreline Condos, geez it’s been too long. help me out anyone?  Personally, I’ll be back at the Shoreline again unless Spanish Villa comes through with a better rate.  At this point, they want quite a bit more than Shoreline and it’s just marginally nicer from what I saw.

Jason, what do the rates look like at Shoreline Condos?  Do they still have room?  I called OK Travel yesterday and the fellow said he’d get back to me, but haven’t heard anything yet. Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft!" http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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Since there alot of RST’ers going and I want to be sure and get a nice place to stay that’s as close as possible to the race, any ideas for an RST base hotel???  I plan to make reservations by next week, but I’d like to stay where alot of other RST’ers will be. Marty — Marty Miller Proprietor of The Triathlete’s Web http://w3.one.net/~triweb

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Since there alot of RST’ers going and I want to be sure and get a nice place to stay that’s as close as possible to the race, any ideas for an RST base hotel???  I plan to make reservations by next week, but I’d like to stay where alot of other RST’ers will be. Marty

Ditto!  I want to be as close to all of you as possible in order to throw you all into fits of guilt after I collapse out there on the course! Either that or I want to be as close to all of you as possible for the moral support.  Quite frankly, I think I’m gonna be shaking in my shoes come August… Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "REAL Triathletes don’t draft!" http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~brooksie        

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