Question:

: Hi Folks, : Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward : to a good time. : But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get : an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was : 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the : loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only : horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The : bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in : constant contact with the pavement. : Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be : used. Also what distance is quoted for races. : Thanks, :  Art The actual distance covered (the slope distance) is used for races.  If you want computer software that can do this try DeLorne Topo USA.  Do you know for a fact that you bike computer is dead on?  Very few people have their bike computers properly calibrated.  Even with proper care a +- 1 to 2 % error is common on bike computers. Tom

Response:

Unless you route is extremely hilly it is unlikely to make that big difference – its more likely that either the mapblast scale isn’t spot on or your bike computer isn’t that well calibrated. At the risk of being accused a spammer, I’ve written some software that’s similar to RouteDigitizer but does take elevation into account. You can download it from http://www.trailgauge.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time. But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used. Also what distance is quoted for races. Thanks,  Art

Response:

Unless you route is extremely hilly it is unlikely to make that big difference – its more likely that either the mapblast scale isn’t spot on or your bike computer isn’t that well calibrated. At the risk of being accused a spammer, I’ve written some software that’s similar to RouteDigitizer but does take elevation into account. You can download it from http://www.trailgauge.com

Interesting stuff, but I have 2 problems with it. 1) It has a huge memory leak. 2) 12 waypoints is not enough for me to measure any known route, so I can’t assess it’s accuracy. — Brian Wakem

Response:

It’d appear that my effort was not totally wasted. Got me one actual user. pete – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time. But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used. Also what distance is quoted for races. Thanks,  Art

Response:

I’ve not had any other reports of a memory leak but if you drop me a mail with the details I’ll have a look at it. The 12 point limit is a limitation of the trial version I’m afraid, if you think that 12 points is too few I can always up it on the next release. Thanks for your comments anyway.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unless you route is extremely hilly it is unlikely to make that big difference – its more likely that either the mapblast scale isn’t spot on or your bike computer isn’t that well calibrated. At the risk of being accused a spammer, I’ve written some software that’s similar to RouteDigitizer but does take elevation into account. You can download it from http://www.trailgauge.com Interesting stuff, but I have 2 problems with it. 1) It has a huge memory leak. 2) 12 waypoints is not enough for me to measure any known route, so I can’t assess it’s accuracy. — Brian Wakem

Response:

Look at the following image. If the image isn’t lined up properly it should be a V with a line across it.     c        /        / a    /  b     / a and b are the route through the valley you took. c is the surface representation on a map. The correct distance is a + b. Not c. Now for the tricky part. Does your map software account for this difference?Some do and some don’t. If you are looking for a fully accurate way of route measuring then you should get software that you know takes this into account. Topo by Delorme ($100 in stores, $65 on e-bay) allows you to measure a route and account for the vertical. For a race to be certified by a governing body the course must be field measured with a wheel counting device. Count the number of times the wheel goes around, multiply by the circumference and you have your distance. Bicycle computers are not considered accurate enough for certification. Hope this helps, Andy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time. But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used. Also what distance is quoted for races. Thanks,  Art

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve not had any other reports of a memory leak but if you drop me a mail with the details I’ll have a look at it. The 12 point limit is a limitation of the trial version I’m afraid, if you think that 12 points is too few I can always up it on the next release. Thanks for your comments anyway. Interesting stuff, but I have 2 problems with it. 1) It has a huge memory leak. 2) 12 waypoints is not enough for me to measure any known route, so I can’t assess it’s accuracy.

I use Trailgauge to measure my routes. This evening’s route was 3.6 miles according to the car, 3.56 miles according to Trailgauge. That’s good enough for my purposes – and I can’t measure it any more accurately if measuring directly from the map. As far as the vertical component of a route is concerned, it will make very little difference to the overall mileage of anyone running on roads. This takes some believing, but you can prove it by drawing a scale profile of the gradient. I like Trailgauge – you need to play around with settings and sizes of maps to get it working properly, but that’s not difficult. I’d recommend it. Paul

Response:

I’ve not had any other reports of a memory leak but if you drop me a mail with the details I’ll have a look at it.

I’ve emailed the info to you. — Brian Wakem

Response:

Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time.

Any time there’s hills, it’s a fun time But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used.

In this case, I’d log the time and round the distance to 2 mi if you really want to log a distance. Some people log only time; others log both. I do log both, but don’t sweat the details of the distance since that’s only part of the picture – snow depth, terrain, etc has a lot more bearing on effort/pace involved in my case. For my training logs (injury prevention), I’m more interested in wear and tear on the body and distance of run is only one component. If hills are significant, then elevation gain, continuous length of uphill run, slope, etc may be relevant factors to record. With some exceptions, on paved roads the difference in distance is fairly minor for training purposes, unless there’s a particular reason why you want something "exactly" 400 m (as a hill repeat, for an example). We have a 3 mi out/back (up/down?) race that’s about 3mi via trail but has 3000+ ft vertical climb. In that case, it may make a difference, but the terrain is more of an issue than the distance in that case Some people here would probably advocate using some of these newer foot sensors that measure distance via accelerometer (or something). But I haven’t seen any comments on how well they work when wet – as in slogging through snow or traversing deep puddles or streams and whether there’s any hangups with brush on single-track. If someone out there has some experience, I’d be interested in knowing. Also what distance is quoted for races.

Some knowledgeable person (I’m not) might want to respond to this, but I believe that certified courses are measured with a wheel, hence the bike distance would be more appropriate. However, where I am in Alaska, many (most?) races aren’t certified, and I’m not really sure where they get the distances – probably from maps and/or bike odometers if you can get a bike there. Case in point, the bike leg of a triathlon was advertised as 10k on flat pavement – easily measured. It was closer to 13k as measured by my bike, car, and map. Got my money’s worth out of that event Many of our longer races here (and I suspect many places) nobody really knows how long they are, and most people don’t care about anything other than ballpark measurements (within 20%?) – it’s the elevation gain, glacial river crossings, and other adventures that make up the race. Hmm, maybe that wasn’t the context you were asking your question in Sorry, spring thaw has hit and I had my first single-track/farm-road run of the year on Sunday Hopefully, more snow will be melted soon so I can get to the hillier sections of trail. Dot

Response:

Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time. But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used. Also what distance is quoted for races. Thanks,  Art

Response:

and was looking forward to a good time.

I don’t know what city you live in, but there’s usually some action down by docks, $20 will get you "round the world" "Make no mistake about it! Without humor, freedom would drive you insane." Bill               I am so cool, that sheep count ME before they go to sleep. http://hometown.aol.com/mrrobottow/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, Just finsihed 3 slightly hilly two mile loops and was looking forward to a good time. But something was bothering me. To determine my speed I wanted to get an exact distance. Using Mapblast and RouteDigitizer, each loop was 1.95 mi long. But tracing my route with my Cateye bike computer the loop was closer to 2.1 mi long. Then I realized Mapblast measured only horizontal distance so that the vertical portion was eliminated. The bike odometer obviously measured both because the bike tire is in constant contact with the pavement. Finally, my question is for tracking purposes which one should be used. Also what distance is quoted for races.<<

Distance on the ground. Thanks, Art

THUS SAYETH WithBACON

Response:

Question:

Anyone have results yet? thx. Bryant — Performance Multisport Portland, OR. www.performancemultisport.com

Response:

Anyone have results yet? thx. Bryant — Performance Multisport Portland, OR. www.performancemultisport.com

Elites only, and just from memory after a brief call from Sheila at the airport: MEN 1. Chris McCormack 2. Conrad Stoltz 3. Matthew Reed 4. Greg Bennett WOMEN 1. Nicki Hackett 2. Barb Lindquist 3. Michellie Jones 4. Joanna Zeiger 5. Karen Smyers 6. Nicole DeBoom 7. Becky Gibbs 8. Sheila Taormina 9. Evelyn Williamson

Response:

Elites only, and just from memory after a brief call from Sheila at the airport:

[...] Wow, that’s two good memories! Although I guess when you know the racers personally, and it’s your profession, it tends to stick better in your mind… Andrew

Response:

Elites only, and just from memory after a brief call from Sheila at the airport: [...] Wow, that’s two good memories! Although I guess when you know the racers personally, and it’s your profession, it tends to stick better in your mind… Andrew

Yeah, but how come I can’t remember wedding anniversaries until the temperature gets several degrees cooler?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elites only, and just from memory after a brief call from Sheila at the airport: [...] Wow, that’s two good memories! Although I guess when you know the racers personally, and it’s your profession, it tends to stick better in your mind… Andrew Yeah, but how come I can’t remember wedding anniversaries until the temperature gets several degrees cooler?

Response:

Question:

I bought the Timex HRM about 3 months and use just about every day for riding and running but not in the pool.  zero complaints from me. Works great in almost conditions that I have been in this summer. I have in the past owned 3 different Polor HRM’s and was very dissapointed each time though.   brent

Response:

P.S. FWIW, I’ve heard similar complaints to yours about the Timex HRM.  Can you return it to where you bought it from? P.P.S. I haven’t tried swimming with my Soprts Instruments/Nashbar HRM so I can’t vouch for it’s waterproofness or efficacy there. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve got a Sports Instrument Circuit 5 that I have had for a few months now and I’m pretty happy with it.  I picked it up for $45 from Supergo.  I think they are sold out, but the same model is available at Nashbar with a something-5 designation for ~$70.  The "5" has a stopwatch, a large HR display that also shows the stopwatch or clock , average HR for the workout, and a backlight, plus all the alarms, zones, yadda, yadda, yadda.  It also comes with a nice Velcro band. I bought a Timex Heart Rate Monitor to use in preparation for my first triathlon.  It seems to work rather sporadically.  It never works in the pool.  I get a lot of signal lost or com error.   When biking and running it seems to get stuck and will stay at the same heart train for my whole session.  About once a week it seems to work absolutely perfect. My question is: 1) Do heart-rate monitors work when swimming? Both of the Polar HRMs I’ve had worked in the pool with no problem. 2) Can anybody refer me to a good comparison on the different brands.  I’m not ready to spend $ 300 on an HRM (I’m saving for a new bike) – is it possible to get something reliable in the $ 100 range? I believe so . . . depending on what features you want. Polar is pretty much the gold standard, and they have a fairly diverse product line, so you should be able to find something from them – ( www.polarusa.com ) Nashbar is also a good bet – lots of people ’round here have Nashbar HRMs and like them ( www.nashbar.com ). Those are the only two brands I’ve heard good things about. MarathRon ORN: 4mi yesterday, 4mi today, 14mi tomorrow. Before you buy. Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

I bought a Timex Heart Rate Monitor to use in preparation for my first triathlon.  It seems to work rather sporadically.  It never works in the pool.  I get a lot of signal lost or com error.   When biking and running it seems to get stuck and will stay at the same heart train for my whole session.  About once a week it seems to work absolutely perfect. My question is: 1) Do heart-rate monitors work when swimming? 2) Can anybody refer me to a good comparison on the different brands.  I’m not ready to spend $ 300 on an HRM (I’m saving for a new bike) – is it possible to get something reliable in the $ 100 range? Thanks. Vicki

Response:

I bought a Timex Heart Rate Monitor to use in preparation for my first triathlon.  It seems to work rather sporadically.  It never works in the pool.  I get a lot of signal lost or com error.   When biking and running it seems to get stuck and will stay at the same heart train for my whole session.  About once a week it seems to work absolutely perfect. My question is: 1) Do heart-rate monitors work when swimming?

Both of the Polar HRMs I’ve had worked in the pool with no problem. 2) Can anybody refer me to a good comparison on the different brands.  I’m not ready to spend $ 300 on an HRM (I’m saving for a new bike) – is it possible to get something reliable in the $ 100 range?

I believe so . . . depending on what features you want. Polar is pretty much the gold standard, and they have a fairly diverse product line, so you should be able to find something from them – ( www.polarusa.com ) Nashbar is also a good bet – lots of people ’round here have Nashbar HRMs and like them ( www.nashbar.com ). Those are the only two brands I’ve heard good things about. MarathRon ORN: 4mi yesterday, 4mi today, 14mi tomorrow. Before you buy.

Response:

If you’re looking to buy a new one and want a Polar, I just did a bunch of comparison shopping, and the best price I found was at www.shoplite.com.  You might also check Mercata.  Shoplite had the best price for the Accurex Plus, I would imagine they’re about the best price on other models.  You could probably get a decent model for ~$100 (the Pacer, or so).  I’ve also heard good things about Cardiosport HRMs.  You can replace the batteries on a Cardiosport yourself.  YMMV, not affiliated with any of the above mentioned stores. Scott Hoffman Before you buy.

Response:

My question is: 1) Do heart-rate monitors work when swimming?

Yes, they should 2) Can anybody refer me to a good comparison on the different brands.  I’m not ready to spend $ 300 on an HRM (I’m saving for a new bike) – is it possible to get something reliable in the $ 100 range?

As mentioned, Polar is the benchmark in this field, although there are several good brands. I know that both Performance and Nashbar sell a Polar Protrainer NV (Night Vision – means it’s backlit) in the $120-130 range.  Also, Performance sells refurbished Protrainers and Accurexes (NOT the newer Accurex Plus that sells for $200+) for $80-100. Both these models have just about everything you need short of computer downloading capability and cycle functions.  Both transmit in the water, and are EKG accurate.  Will give you the workout time you spent below, in, and above the target heart rate range you specify.  Both will give you a post-workout heart rate recovery number and have multiple lap timers. Disclaimer: I have no financial interest in Performance, Nashbar, or Polar . . .blah, blah.  Just a very satisfied user. – Bruce in Atlanta Before you buy.

Response:

I’ve got a Sports Instrument Circuit 5 that I have had for a few months now and I’m pretty happy with it.  I picked it up for $45 from Supergo.  I think they are sold out, but the same model is available at Nashbar with a something-5 designation for ~$70.  The "5" has a stopwatch, a large HR display that also shows the stopwatch or clock , average HR for the workout, and a backlight, plus all the alarms, zones, yadda, yadda, yadda.  It also comes with a nice Velcro band. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I bought a Timex Heart Rate Monitor to use in preparation for my first triathlon.  It seems to work rather sporadically.  It never works in the pool.  I get a lot of signal lost or com error.   When biking and running it seems to get stuck and will stay at the same heart train for my whole session.  About once a week it seems to work absolutely perfect. My question is: 1) Do heart-rate monitors work when swimming? Both of the Polar HRMs I’ve had worked in the pool with no problem. 2) Can anybody refer me to a good comparison on the different brands.  I’m not ready to spend $ 300 on an HRM (I’m saving for a new bike) – is it possible to get something reliable in the $ 100 range? I believe so . . . depending on what features you want. Polar is pretty much the gold standard, and they have a fairly diverse product line, so you should be able to find something from them – ( www.polarusa.com ) Nashbar is also a good bet – lots of people ’round here have Nashbar HRMs and like them ( www.nashbar.com ). Those are the only two brands I’ve heard good things about. MarathRon ORN: 4mi yesterday, 4mi today, 14mi tomorrow. Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

For me it is double it and add 30 minutes. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – the "rough estimate" is to double the time and add an hour- but that assumes similar course and conditions and conditioning…

Response:

Kevin – A few more data points: May 99 – Wildflower – 5:03 Aug99 – IMC – 11:06 Oct99 – IMH – 10:38 Double it and add an hour sounds about right to me. gordo

Response:

Re: ironman vs half ironman For me its double it and take off (!!!!) half and hour. There is no rule – do and and enjoy it. Chris Eversfield Chairman  -  Team Volcano International http://www.btinternet.com/~dra – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dont tell my charming wife, but all this talk has me thinking about doing the full distance IM. So, my question is, how do IM times compare to 1/2 IM times? For someone who can do a 5 1/2 hr 1/2, what can you expect (given decent conditions) just wondering…. Kevin Before you buy.

Response:

Dont tell my charming wife, but all this talk has me thinking about doing the full distance IM. So, my question is, how do IM times compare to 1/2 IM times? For someone who can do a 5 1/2 hr 1/2, what can you expect (given decent conditions) just wondering…. Kevin Before you buy.

Response:

It has been in my experience of doing both 1/2s and fulls and talking to others, the times are really hard to compare.  I know some people slow down tremendously from a 1/2 to full while others splits have gotten better.  In my humble opionon, there is not a magic way to do that like running… stefan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dont tell my charming wife, but all this talk has me thinking about doing the full distance IM. So, my question is, how do IM times compare to 1/2 IM times? For someone who can do a 5 1/2 hr 1/2, what can you expect (given decent conditions) just wondering…. Kevin Before you buy.

Response:

the "rough estimate" is to double the time and add an hour- but that assumes similar course and conditions and conditioning…

Response:

Apples and oranges, really. My best time at Wildflower Long Course is a 6:21.  My best time at IMC is 12:10.  It amazes me to consider that I did a full in less than double the time for a half, BUT, Wildflower is no ordinary half! On the other hand, my best time at the 1/2 Vineman is just under 5:40. Double that and you have 11:20.  Add half an hour and you’d get 11:50. Can I do an 11:50 IM?  Hmmm.  I’d like to think so.  Maybe some day….. Anyway, it’s just so hard to guess because courses in various half and full IMs are so different.  Not to mention the experience factor with the longer distance, which can make an enormous difference. So this doesn’t answer your question very well, but I guess I’ll go with the fellow who said "Double your 1/2 time and add half an hour."  That’s a nice conservative guesstimate. Dont tell my charming wife, but all this talk has me thinking about doing the full distance IM. So, my question is, how do IM times compare to 1/2 IM times? For someone who can do a 5 1/2 hr 1/2, what can you expect (given decent conditions) just wondering…. Kevin

– Tri-Baby                                      _                                   –    o      ’             –  __o       –    </_  `     ‘         –    <         – __/    /o_         – (()) (())        -  / "Real triathletes don’t draft." http://www.stanford.edu/~brooksie *New to triathlon?  Check out Hulaman’s Simple TriTips:  http://www.hulaman.com/triathlon/tritips.html    

Response:

Question:

On the Inside Triathlon calendar, there is a race in late September in south central Colorado… Sept 26 Tenderfoot Triathlon, Salida, CO. 1km S/40km B/10km R. Donna Rhoads, 719/539-6738. Has anyone had any experience doing this event in the past? Thanks in advance!!! Pat Brug

Response:

Sept 26 Tenderfoot Triathlon, Salida, CO. 1km S/40km B/10km R. Donna Rhoads, 719/539-6738. Has anyone had any experience doing this event in the past?

No one has any experience with it. This is the first year they are having it. Swim is in a pool. They are only taking 79 people I heard. They don’t want to run so many waves in the pool that the event takes all day to have everyone finish. If you are not from Colorado and within easy distance I would pass this race by as there are probably enough around where you live. Ken  Colorado

Response:

Question:

Should sunscreen be applied before or after race numbers? AJ — Simon Haigh Illawarra Triathlon Club http://www.moreton.qld.edu.au/itc/index.htm      

Response:

Should sunscreen be applied before or after race numbers?

Very, very, very, definitely after numbers are applied as once you’ve put on your sunscreen – and then put on your numbers they just rub right off making it impossible for all those media, official and spectator type people by the course to not know who you are!

Response:

Should sunscreen be applied before or after race numbers?

Simon, Before AND after. I have fair skin and can get burned easily. My usual prerace routine for sunny races is as follows: Completely cover by body with minimum SPF 15 water proof sunscreen when I get up in the morning of a race.This allows the sunscreen to really soak in. I use Kinesys, a Canadian brand that works very well. Have used it in Ironman Canada and not been burned. When they number you they usually use a bit of alcohol to clean your skin where they write the numbers. This will take off the sunsceen that I have applied earlier. Once the numbers are dry, I then go over these spots again, making sure not to smear the number all over the place as the sunscreen may act as a solvent for the ink. A final touch up with sunscreen on high exposure areas – nose, ears and shoulders and I am ready to go. Steve Fleck

Response:

Question:

RESIST THAT TEMPTATION, YOUNG LADY!!!!! Mike "TriBop" Tennent Remove "nospam." for email reply

Mike, I couldn’t take it anymore — I went out for a short easy run tonight after work.  It was GREAT!  I think my doc was wrong and it might just be tendonitis (I’m crossing my fingers).  It was the first snowfall here in beautiful Aylmer, light winds, and just gorgeous to run in (ask me if I still enjoy this weather in January — probably not). Anyway, seriously, I’m getting a second opinion on Monday…. I will definitely keep swimming and just maybe try a triathlon next summer…. NO, NOT THE IRONMAN — now, THAT is INSANE ;-D. Take care and have a GREAT weekend. Ann in snowy Aylmer Quebec

Response:

I found that for myself, swimming works the best.  I try to build my lungs by only breathing every 6 strokes, and this actually has resulting in some of my best running times due to the increased lung capacity and cardiovascular fitness. I ran a 10K once (after 3 months no running, just swimming) in 45 minutes, and I can’t do much better than that when I actually practice running.   I had to get my lung capacity tested for a job I was applying for, and the lady just about freaked out because she’d never seen such a good result before.  I strongly believe in swimming as the best cross-training sport.  Good luck. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi there! I just found out that I probably have a stress fractured foot and I’ve been instructed not to run for the next 4 weeks….   Because I’m planning to start training for a marathon at the beginning of January, I really want to try and stay cardiovascularly (sp??) fit.  I have access to a gym, a pool and I’m also thinking (if finances permit) of getting a ’spinning’ membership. What would be the best way to cross-train during these 4 weeks?  Also, would cycling have a negative effect on running?  I’ve heard that runners must try to avoid building their quads.  Too much muscle mass in the quad could cause a muscle imbalance and possibly another injury when running resumes .  Any truth to this? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ann Aylmer Quebec

Response:

Ann, Sorry to hear about the stress fracture.  I have had some experience and  success with cross training because of severe shin splints that kept me from  running for about two months and some knee problems.  My training was for high  school/college cross country so it was the 5k and 8k which are obviously much  shorter than the marathon distance, but it’s still probably applicable. The best way I found to keep in running shape is by pool running or water  jogging (different names for what I consider to be the same thing).  It’s just  like it sounds…going through the running motions in water deep enough that  you can’t touch the ground.  You could easily very the intensity and time to  simulate both speed workouts or distance runs.   Another thing I did was stationary biking.  This was a great workout too, but I  had a tendency to work too hard sometimes.  If you do decide to bike a lot I  would recommend doing some kind of leg curls in the gym to work the hamstrings  because you could develop a muscle imbalance and end up pulling a hamstring or  something of that nature later on. I’ve never much been into swimming but that is also a great was to stay in  great cardiovascular shape.  I also like to lift weights 2-3 times a week but  that’s more for strength than anything else.  Though if you did lift more reps  with lighter weights, and reduce recovery time between sets, that could be a  great cardiovascular workout as well. Good luck with your training and remember that your body is telling you  something (with the injury) and don’t overdue it with the cross-training. Nathan

Response:

Ann, 4 weeks is on the short side of recovery, although if you already had time off  it might be sufficient.  My experience with the runners I work with is more  like 6. Cross training is a good idea and spinning certainly makes sense.  The work  will not bulk up your quads too much.  Many runners have knee  problems  because their quads are not strong enough. You may discover that the spinning may cause some pain depending on the  location of the fracture and the intensity of the work. Try resting your heel  on the pedal if the break is in the metatarsals.   Also interestingly enough  some runners found swimming uncomfortable as it flexed the foot and caused  pain at the fracture site.  You will just have to try and see. Also strength work has also shown itself to be useful as part of the cross  training.  This includes upper body work.   Best of luck, BJC Coach in Colorado

Response:

Hi there! I just found out that I probably have a stress fractured foot and I’ve been instructed not to run for the next 4 weeks….   Because I’m planning to start training for a marathon at the beginning of January, I really want to try and stay cardiovascularly (sp??) fit.  I have access to a gym, a pool and I’m also thinking (if finances permit) of getting a ’spinning’ membership. What would be the best way to cross-train during these 4 weeks?  Also, would cycling have a negative effect on running?  I’ve heard that runners must try to avoid building their quads.  Too much muscle mass in the quad could cause a muscle imbalance and possibly another injury when running resumes .  Any truth to this?

I don’t necessarily buy into the "harm" theory, but I’d stay away from spinning classes. They really are designed to build bike specific skills and endurance. If they’re included WITH running (not possible with you) then you end up with a balanced program. If you do bike training on a machine, keep it at an easy level, but a high rate of spin. Don’t mash the gears. Get in your exercise heart rate zone and stay there. Mike "TriBop" Tennent Remove "nospam." for email reply IMC ‘98 IronVirgins Website http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/imc_iv.htm WebRunner Running Page and my Model Railroad page http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/index.html

Response:

Hi Mike, Thanks for your response… I gather from your sig (TriBop) that you do triathlons (?)  Because I haven’t been running , I’ve been spending alot of time in the pool and also taking an "Improve your Stroke" class and realizing that I love swimming…. Maybe I’ll try a triathlon next summer. Anyway, my question is:  Is swimming going to help me when I start running again?  Although I can run for 42Km, all I can manage in a pool is about 1.5Km.  Do you still benefit from just a 30 to 40 minute swim session? Thanks, Ann Aylmer Quebec PS  Foot wasn’t sore at all today and I’m tempted to go for an easy run…..

t… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t necessarily buy into the "harm" theory, but I’d stay away from spinning classes. They really are designed to build bike specific skills and endurance. If they’re included WITH running (not possible with you) then you end up with a balanced program. If you do bike training on a machine, keep it at an easy level, but a high rate of spin. Don’t mash the gears. Get in your exercise heart rate zone and stay there. Mike "TriBop" Tennent Remove "nospam." for email reply IMC ‘98 IronVirgins Website http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/imc_iv.htm WebRunner Running Page and my Model Railroad page http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/index.html

Response:

Hi Mike, Thanks for your response… I gather from your sig (TriBop) that you do triathlons (?)

Yep. My first love. Because I haven’t been running , I’ve been spending alot of time in the pool and also taking an "Improve your Stroke" class and realizing that I love swimming…. Maybe I’ll try a triathlon next summer.

Careful. It’s a slippery slope. First a little "sprint" tri, just to see what it’s like. No inhaling.  Then it’s bigger, harder stuff. Olympic distance, half-Ironman. $2,500 Aero bikes, wet suit, speedos… And then before you know it, you’re putting your name in the Ironman Hawaii lottery. <g Anyway, my question is:  Is swimming going to help me when I start running again?  

From an aerobic conditioning standpoint, yes. It really doesn’t matter how you exercise – if you stay in your target exercise Heartrate, you gain (or maintain)  conditioning. I’m using a training program by Rob Sleamaker called S.E.R.I.O.U.S. training. It’s basic premise is to measure your exercise in terms of time spent at particular exercise exertion levels, not mileage in a particular discipline.  Through the year the mix of time and levels changes depending on your goals. It’s great for triathletes because you’re free to create your own mix of activities as long as you meet the time/exertion levels. (It does help to know what mix works for you.) Although I can run for 42Km, all I can manage in a pool is about 1.5Km.  Do you still benefit from just a 30 to 40 minute swim session?

From an aerobic conditioning standpoint, 30 minutes swimming at 70% of MHR is the same as the same as 30 minutes running at 70% of MHR. Now, the problem is that 4 hours a week of swimming at 70% MHR doesn’t do diddly for your legs when you’re ready to start running again. From an aerobic conditioning standpoint, you’re ready to go, but if you go out and try to run at a pace your lungs and heart are ready for, you’re gonna hurt yourself. So you have to ease back it into it, running slower than your aerobic conditioning allows. It ’s wise not to drop the cross-training for awhile while keeping your runs real slow. Thanks, Ann Aylmer Quebec PS  Foot wasn’t sore at all today and I’m tempted to go for an easy run…..

RESIST THAT TEMPTATION, YOUNG LADY!!!!! Mike "TriBop" Tennent Remove "nospam." for email reply IMC ‘98 IronVirgins Website http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/imc_iv.htm WebRunner Running Page and my Model Railroad page http://www.gate.net/~wbrunner/index.html

Response:

Pool running works for me.  Obtain a flotation belt or vest which will hold you upright, and jump in and run.  You get to go through the proper motions, training specifically for running, but you keep the stress from injured feet, joints, etc…  And you get to keep relatively cool while working out. The only problem I’ve found is that it’s mind-numbing (but so are the other options). That is partially balanced by the cool "detached head floating down the pool" effect. -Ray – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi there! I just found out that I probably have a stress fractured foot and I’ve been instructed not to run for the next 4 weeks….   Because I’m planning to start training for a marathon at the beginning of January, I really want to try and stay cardiovascularly (sp??) fit.  I have access to a gym, a pool and I’m also thinking (if finances permit) of getting a ’spinning’ membership.

Response:

Hi there! I just found out that I probably have a stress fractured foot and I’ve been instructed not to run for the next 4 weeks….   Because I’m planning to start training for a marathon at the beginning of January, I really want to try and stay cardiovascularly (sp??) fit.  I have access to a gym, a pool and I’m also thinking (if finances permit) of getting a ’spinning’ membership. What would be the best way to cross-train during these 4 weeks?  Also, would cycling have a negative effect on running?  I’ve heard that runners must try to avoid building their quads.  Too much muscle mass in the quad could cause a muscle imbalance and possibly another injury when running resumes .  Any truth to this? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ann Aylmer Quebec

Response:

Question:

I recently signed up for the Danskin Triathalon in Balitmore, Maryland (my first ever tri!). I am interested in the one day triathalon camp, but have not seen any information for one to be held in the Baltimore/DC area. Does anyone have any information about this? Also, if anyone has ever completed one of these before (in Maryland) and could tell me a little bit about the course (where do we swim?, etc), I’d appreciate the info. Thanks – Michelle

Response:

Michelle,         I signed up for Danskin in Maryland too.  When I called the 1-800 number, they had a listing of all of the times and places for the one day camps.  I may be wrong (ie make sure you check before you believe this!) but I thought that the camp had already passed by!!  I’m not sure though, so make sure you check.  Just call the number on the race form.         Hope to see you there!                                 JENNIFER HOOD I recently signed up for the Danskin Triathalon in Balitmore, Maryland (my first ever tri!). I am interested in the one day triathalon camp, but have not seen any information for one to be held in the Baltimore/DC area. Does anyone have any information about this? Also, if anyone has ever completed one of these before (in Maryland) and could tell me a little bit about the course (where do we swim?, etc), I’d appreciate the info. Thanks – Michelle

    LAZLO’S CHINESE RELATIVITY AXIOM:   *   "No one will ever win the           No matter how great your        *    battle of the sexes.         triumphs, or how tragic your    *    There’s too much fraternizing               defeats, approximately one      *    with the enemy!"         billion Chinese couldn’t        *         care less.                      *               — Henry Kissinger         Even I can be on the WWW:  http://rintintin.colorado.edu/~hoodj

Response:

Question:

Why stop with just ankle surgery or webbed feet?   I’m sure a competent surgeon could alter your body into a more "Aero Shape" as well as eliminate the need to watch your diet.  Just think, no more 40/30/30.  Instead, it would be eat what you want and then "suck out" the stuff you don’t need. I would also reccomend having Dave Scott’s heart, Thomas Helleriegel’s legs and some Kenyan’s legs transplanted into your body.   -Eric    Look, two more "quotation marks!"

Response:

     How about getting ankle tendons cut and/or replaced by more flexible ones, to increase swimming speed?  I am a very slow swimmer, due in part to my extremely inflexible ankles.  My kick gives me virtually no forward propulsion and I’ve wondered before whether or not this could be fixed surgically –Steve Gregg

Response:

Plotecia, Image Control) writes: While trimming my toenails yesterday and noting that I have two more black ones I wondered if I could just get them removed permanently, since I lose about 2 a year. After all, who needs them?

Most dermatologists, some family physicians and all podiatrists can remove toenails permanently. But most of us resist making permanent elective changes to bodies – as people often change their minds. Nevertheless, I have considered radial keratotomy for my eyes.  Glasses and contacts are such a hassle! Byron J. Byron Walthall, Jr. Charlotte, NC, USA

Response:

I have one word…pericardectomy! (Or, in other words, when you go to the track don’t bet against the greyhound with the scar on his/her chest…)

Response:

      How about getting ankle tendons cut and/or replaced by more flexible  ones, to increase swimming speed?  I am a very slow swimmer, due in part  to my extremely inflexible ankles.  My kick gives me virtually no forward  propulsion and I’ve wondered before whether or not this could be fixed  surgically  –Steve Gregg

That’s a good one.  My swim coach suggested once that maybe just having the bones shaved to increase the range of motion would do the trick. This might have an adverse effect on your running, however. |       Ray Plotecia            | |       Image Control           |

Response:

I would like a little silly putty injected in my left knee.  Not to be greedy, but I also think my bicycling would improve with a couple thigh enhancement implants. Ruth Kazez

Response:

    How about getting ankle tendons cut and/or replaced by more flexible ones, to increase swimming speed?  I am a very slow swimmer, due in part to my extremely inflexible ankles.  My kick gives me virtually no forward propulsion and I’ve wondered before whether or not this could be fixed surgically –Steve Gregg

If you’re willing to go that far, why not have skin grafts placed between your toes so that your feet will be both flexible and *webbed*? Just make sure that the surgeon understands that the skin folds must lie on top of the toes when you’re walking.  Otherwise you might damage your new fins on the run.  (Saaay…is this why Dave Scott always had that "duck footed" running style?) — Rick Teichler StorageTek Software Engineering (Louisville, Colorado)

Response:

If you’re willing to go that far, why not have skin grafts placed between your toes so that your feet will be both flexible and *webbed*?

While you’re there, why not have some inflatable air sacs implanted in your hips for extra bouyancy.  You can inflate then before the start of the swim with a CO2 cartridge, and deflate them as you run to your bike. Todd Jensen

Response:

Ok, here comes another one: While trimming my toenails yesterday and noting that I have two more black ones I wondered if I could just get them removed permanently, since I lose about 2 a year.  After all, who needs them? I wonder what other forms of elective surgery might enhance either performance or the triathlon experience. |       Ray Plotecia            | |       Image Control           |

Response:

Question:

I am considering entering the Columbia, MD triathlon on May 22. Anyone done the race in the past have any comments?  Please reply ASAP, as the entry fee has to be in the mail on Monday! Thanks, kbb — Kim B. Blair, Ph.D.                     Senior Staff Scientist

Response:

| I am considering entering the Columbia, MD triathlon on May 22. | Anyone done the race in the past have any comments?  Please | reply ASAP, as the entry fee has to be in the mail on Monday! | Ahhh….. You better call to make sure that you can still get in. In years past it has filled up pretty quick.  This is my first year doing it, but I live in the area and ride the bike course often. I consider the bike part faily hilly. -Dennis — Fields Divided Dennis Flanigan, Jr.              |   Goddard Space Flight Center Applied Research Corp.            |   TRMM Office, Code 910.1

Response: